Arising Star and SC52FS

[Terry Scott]

Hi All

As a beginner I am going to ask probably a silly question and throw myself on your mercy,

I bought the seagull arising star as my first i/c trainer - and decided upon an sc52fs to power it. Problem - the Sc has the throttle lever in the centre and to rear of the engine, when mounted on the A/Star there is very little room between it and the firewall - no probs but then I thought how to connect the throttle pushrod that exits the models firewall to the right of the rhs engine bearer and lower than the throttle lever. I have trawled the internet and looked at all the posts but cannot see an answer. Some have suggested a wire loop ? cant see how that works or dubros four stroke throttle connection kit still cant see how that works as the lever is in centre at rear of engine.

I am sure there is a simple solution as many people seem to use the FS52 in this model but to date I cannot figure it out -

Anyone got this arrangment and show a piccy or explain to now frustrated beginner

Thanks

[Steve Hargreaves - Moderator]

A picture would be worth a thousand words here Terry but basically you take the wire past the throttle lever & then bend it back on itself (through 180 degrees if you like) & then approach the throttle lever from the front of the model if that makes any sense.

Then as the wire moves forward it "pulls" the throttle lever forward with it......

Hope that helps....

By the way...the only silly questions are the ones you don't ask....

[Paul Marsh]

On four strokes, you can reverse the carby round but undoing the screws, rotating and tightening up. It then puts the throttle on the other side, near the edge.

Throttle on "wrong" side.

 

Remove carb screws and remove carb body.

  

Rotate carb round and replace screws.

Edited By Paul Marsh on 15/03/2012 18:10:45

[BB]

If you want to keep things really simple. Just cut a slot in the firewall to match then bend the control rod wire to suit around where the tank fits. There will be a little flexing in it afterwards, but, not enough to give you trouble (just don't apply heat to bend the wire, you'll weaken it. Cold bend it.

You could go 'bell cranking' it, but that just makes things complicated. These frames are designed for cheap as chips .40 - .46 2 stroke engines. Its a trainer. It may not look pretty for long. If you arrive heavy and suffer a 'nose over', likelyhood is that the 52 FS will not run the same way again.  Thereby becoming a 'tempremental' engine.  Simply because something has gone slightly out of alignment etc..

I'd be inclined to save the 52 fs for a 2nd or 3rd model (a little warbird perhaps): And get an SC.46 2 stroke for the trainer.

Go tail dragger if flying off grass.  That nose wheel will bend under every landing on grass: And its steerable, so will continually knock out of alignment.

BB

 

Edited By BB on 15/03/2012 18:06:11

[Terry Scott]

Many thanks for the swift replys -

Steve - I believe i understand the method but not sure how it would work with the throttle lever in the centre of the engine

Paul - I didnt appreciate the SC carb could be turned round - as it appears the throttle lever is then on the LHS of the engine meaning it would have to be fitted inverted leaving the pushrod housing very exposed - not sure I would relish that.

BB - to exit the pushrod to match the throttle lever even nearby would mean that it would have to exit via the windscreen as the throttle lever sits so high.

All the above are good solutions - is there another way - I have seen one model on you tube that uses the SC52FS and A/Star with the engine upright and using the original pushrod but the angle is such that you cannot see how he has done it -

Asd soon as the camera is charged I will take some pics to show how it looks on my setup

Terry

Edited By Terry Scott on 15/03/2012 19:05:53

[fly boy3]

Hi Terry, I agree with every thing BB has said regarding engine. The A/S is an exellent choice for a trainer, but the better combination is combined with a 46 2stroke. 4 strokes are more complicated due to more moving parts,and should be kept for a later date if possible. Dont take this as a negative comment on your choice of engine, but could save you money in the long run. Cheers

[Terry Scott]

No negativity noted fly boy3 - I appreciate what you are saying but - my choice was influenced by the better power delivery and slower revving - also the sound to my mind is better than a screaming two stroke. - but if I cant bottom this then maybe an OS55AX

Terry

[fly boy3]

Hi Terry,, another exellent choice of engine top of league job, but pricey. One of these will set you back about £130 + pp, whereas a SC 46 is around around £44 +pp. I think there are combos. around , Arising Star plus SC 46 for less than the cost of the OS. The choice is yours, welcome to the forum, and remember there are no silly questions, we have all started with a trainer, then moved to other areas of our choice. What a wonderfull hobby. Cheers

[Ian Jones]

I though I'd got a better photo in the album but it seems not. If this looks like it's any help and you would like a better photo then let me know and I'll upload one.

The connection at the throttle is tight and does not rotate - the rotation is at the other end, the clevise. This means the throttle arm's track can arc as intended but does not result in the connecting rod folding back.

This arrangement is an SC52FS in an SE5a that has flown many, many times over the 8 years or so. It doesn't look much but it's never failed (yet!).

Edited By Ian Jones on 15/03/2012 21:05:19

Ah, found one:

Edited By Ian Jones on 15/03/2012 21:10:00

[fly boy3]

Nice one Ian, whats the saying about a picture and words. Cheers

[BB]

Edited By Ian Jones on 15/03/2012 21:10:00

Pretty much as I said, only with the 'S' bend before the firewall, not aft. By the way modern 2 strokes don't scream ! This is a 'trainer', don't get too precise, or precious. Or, you will just get dissapointed, very quickly !

Good luck. Welcome to the forum. As said ealier, there are NO stupid questions. Just; the odd dumb replyier.... you'll work out the difference

[Alan Cantwell]

Well, thats the throttle link delt with, now the hard facts, trainers are what trainers are, they have to take knocks, and are expendable if it goes in, your nice four stroke will be the first to hit the deck, if its affordable then fair enough, but generally i would recomend a budget engine like the 46LA or enya 40 SS these are solid built motors, more suited to the rumble tumble of the tyro enviroment, i tell all learners this,

as for the linkage to the four stroke, i use Kavan tanks, these have a series of grooves down the tank, really handy for sneaking a throttle link in, i mount the servo in line as i can, and have a direct link to the throttle arm, on the engine end, i bend the rod at 90 degrees, and use a keeper, and on the servo end, a metal 2mm clevis

Edited By Alan 4 on 15/03/2012 22:53:21

[BB]

Posted by Alan 4 on 15/03/2012 22:31:52:

Well, thats the throttle link delt with, now the hard facts, trainers are what trainers are, they have to take knocks, and are expendable if ti goes in, your nice four stroke will be the first to hit the deck, if its affordable then fair enough, but generally i would recomend a budget engine like the 46LA or enya 40 SS these are solid built motors, more suited to the rumble tumble of the tyro enviroment, i tell alll learners this,

as for the linkage to the four stroke, i use Kavan tanks, these have a series of grooves down the tank, really handy for sneaking a throttle link in, i mount the servo in line as i can, and have a direct link to the throttle arm, on the engine end, i bend the rod at 90 degrees, and use a keeper, and on the servo end, a metal 2mm clevis

Ditto...... a 2 stroke will do.

And it's,  it NOT ti....  . And all is 2 LL's not 3, Alan.

BB - Sings, "I'm in the mood for dancing, and correcting.  I go back to work tomorrow night ......"

(ABBA - IM IN THE MOOD)

Edited By BB on 15/03/2012 22:53:50

[Alan Cantwell]

i always get things front to back, or the round way wrong

Edited By Alan 4 on 15/03/2012 22:55:35

Edited By Alan 4 on 15/03/2012 23:01:36

[Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator]

Posted by BB on 15/03/2012 22:48:04:

And it's, it NOT ti.... .

He's writing in a "Manc" accent!

BEB

[Alan Cantwell]

OY!!!! i speak in an Oldham accent,

[BB]

Posted by Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator on 15/03/2012 22:56:40:

Posted by BB on 15/03/2012 22:48:04:

And it's, it NOT ti.... .

He's writing in a "Manc" accent!

BEB

Sorry BEB I forgot to check his passport on this occassion. Alan - I'm sorry. We down't'suth as u mit say fargivves ya geeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeezeerrrrrrrrrrrrrr . Yaaaaaaar still aaa toup blouke thourgh.

Phew, hope he understands BEB. Google translate can be hard sometimes !!

BB

[Alan Cantwell]

ACTUALLY, half of me is from Kent, yes, cantwells half a southern softy

[BB]

Posted by Alan 4 on 15/03/2012 23:17:40:

ACTUALLY, half of me is from Kent, yes, cantwells half a southern softy

Soz, forgivs me ya lardshippy

[Terry Scott]

Again thanks for the replies - Ians picture is indeed worth a thousand words - that looks like a solution

I have added some pics to show what the situation looks like no doubt many of you wil have seen this before

Hope these show to some degree the distances and angles being encountered - I think the thrid and fourth pics give the best impression. You can just see the throttle pushrod on the RHS so a few bends and it may work -

thanks chaps

Edited By Terry Scott on 16/03/2012 09:31:58

[Steve Hargreaves - Moderator]

Spin both the carb & the operating arm through 180 degrees & drill a hole on the opposite side of the engine mount for the linkage.....should line up pretty well then.....

[Terry Scott]

Hi chaps

Inspired by Ians photo I have made a protoype linkage - you will have to use your imagination a bit - basically lose the z bend at the throttle arm and use same as ian and make the whole length out of one piece so it goes back through firewall to servo - I have added the protoype pics to my album

again thanks for the info and getting the brain working

Terry

Edited By Terry Scott on 16/03/2012 16:08:56

[fly boy3]

Nice pictures Terry, Looking at them I am sure things will be ok. If its any consolation to you , the throttle linkage is what gives us ic boys the most headaches every time we put a new installation in. Looks like you are well on your way for its maiden. Let us know how you get on. Don't try to maiden it yourself, much better an experienced flier does it. Cheers

[Ian Jones]

Posted by Terry Scott on 16/03/2012 16:08:13:

Hi chaps

Inspired by Ians photo I have made a protoype linkage - you will have to use your imagination a bit - basically lose the z bend at the throttle arm and use same as ian and make the whole length out of one piece so it goes back through firewall to servo - I have added the protoype pics to my album

again thanks for the info and getting the brain working

Terry

Edited By Terry Scott on 16/03/2012 16:08:56

Pleased to have contributed to your future success, looks like you have worked out a good solution.

Totally agree with others regarding getting someone else to test fly it for you.

I have taught a good number of people to fly on this model of trainer without any problems whatsoever with the tricycle/steerable noseleg setup. This has been achieved by properly balancing the aeroplane (no guesswork like "maybe slightly nose heavy" and then not allowing the trainee to attempt a landing until he has already learned to fly low over the strip at landing speed with the nose slightly raised - followed by an abort! It's good practice and has avoided the the damage caused by some so called touch and goes. This way the often experienced noseleg first landings just don't happen, so no noseleg problem.

This is the technique advised by the BMFA and if you do not have the benefit of an instructor to guide you through this then you can find out a lot more about it in the BMFA Instructors guide which is here. Although it's an instructor's guide it make great reading for any beginner too.

Edited By Ian Jones on 17/03/2012 12:52:51