precedent hi boy

[Denis Watkins]

Ahh But Donald, I bet you could fly, and not a complete novice. As I said, a flyer will enjoy its stability.

[TIM Shaw]

Hi Guys

I remember the HiBoy vividly. I never owned one, but I was doing a lot of training in the late 80s / early 90s and I shuddered whenever one turned up, praying it was on mode 1 (I fly mode 2....)

Sure, they varied widely and the better built ones did fly better than the less well built ones, but the original Yamamoto (not the later, GF bodied one), Moonraker and Chris Fosses trainer, whose name currently escapes me) were all much better.

Yes, narrow hinge gaps help with control authority, and hence general flying characteristics, and can be achieved in 2 basic ways.

The best is simply careful building, make sure the edges are straight, the hinge line is exactly on the point of the bevel, take care in your sanding - all obvious once you done it a few times but not immediately apparent in the excitement of nearly completing your first build.

The alternative and I guess ultimate way is to seal the gaps as the glider guys do. I doubt full wiper set-ups are worth doing on most power models, but silicon hinging or film sealing might solve the problem on a badly finished model.

I recently silicon sealed the gap on a scratch built, 80% scale Mach 1 pattern ship and the surfaces were certainly very powerful. I cheated actually, hinged with mylar strip as normal, then, at full deflection ran in a tiny bead of aquarium sealer along the hinge line from 1cc syringe, smoothed it out with a damp finger, and the jobs done.

The trick is not to use too much....

HTH

Tim

[David Davis]

The Super Sixty was a better contemporary trainer in my view, able to fly more slowly and therefore more suitable for a beginner. It took much longer to build of course.

[Peter Miller]

We had a learner in the club who learned to fly on the Hi Boy. seemed ok to us, flew well . His main problem was that once he got it into a turn on finals he got disoriented and crashed...several times.

I gave him a slow stable model to practice landings on and that cured the problem. It wasn't the Hi Boy.it was him.

[Peter Miller]

Posted by IanR on 25/01/2017 22:50:03:

John, could you please explain best way to achieve no (or very tiny) control surface gaps. Many thanks.

Ian

I use Kavan CA hinges, close hinge gaps are easy with them

[Cuban8]

I taught myself to fly power models on a 4ch Hi-Boy in the early '80s after getting the basics on gliders, both thermal and slope. I never had any trouble with the model, but then I did have the basic rudiments of R/C flying under my belt at the time. A couple of friends went on to learn from scratch on 4ch Hi-Boys and both were successful and are now very competent flyers.

The Hi-Boy did need to be adequately powered otherwise it could get a bit messy - I think I had an OS .46 LA in my example, which was a vast improvement over the old Merco 35 that I had originally which only just about managed to get the machine to limp into the air and cruise about.

I believe that if you could get on with a 4ch H-Boy (the 3ch version wasn't very good) then it did, in the long run, make a better pilot of you as it had to be flown correctly to get the best from it. Although the rudder was small, it was effective in tidying up turns in a more co-ordinated fashion, rather than 'bank and yank' and landings had to be prepared for from a decent square circuit approach to the the strip.

Whilst the current crop of lightweight foamy trainers and others are good, I think they can be a bit too easy to fly, particularly landings, which (because of their very benign characteristics) often wind up as a quick dive for the deck with no real approach, no round out and hardly any roll on to a stop. Not a problem if that's the style of flying you like, but of no help with a later model of higher performance or perhaps a warbird. Naturally any instructor worth his salt, will point this out.

[Don Fry]

Posted by Denis Watkins on 26/01/2017 09:43:25:

Ahh But Donald, I bet you could fly, and not a complete novice. As I said, a flyer will enjoy its stability.

 

Yes you are right, but it seemed to be the standard trainer, and I taught two or three to fly on them. About weight, there were two wings for them. A foam veneer quick build, which was heavier, and a built up wing which was lighter, and flew better. But either were still a good trainer. And the pupil got stick time because it flew in winds. And landing practice was a matter that anything short of an impact was part of their flying learning curve rather than repair learning curve. In those days it was normal to carry spare props.

This summer I will be teaching some kids. I will use an 700 gram foam job. It will do a job, but if they fly it for a hundred hours, that is still all they can fly, because it won't fly in a wind, and because it carries little kinetic energy so no knowlege of what kinetic energy does to a plane.

Half the trouble, I suspect, was trying to fly an appalling build. Remember it was a first build as well as first flight.

Edited By Donald Fry on 26/01/2017 13:00:35

[Nigel R]

Aged 10 (ish) my dad built one of these (or was it a fly boy?). Being an old hand at balsa bashing, he ummed and ahhed at the plywood fus.

Anyway. Whilst turning a bit too sharp and a bit too low, I stuck it in the tarmac on flight number six (ish). I don't remember it being a poor flyer. A bit heavy maybe. Taught me a valuable (if expensive, owing to aforementioned tarmac) lesson about speed, turning, and spin recovery.

A few hours on the next high wing (Junior 60) and I was on to a low wing job no problem.

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

Boomerang/Tutor 40 etc are no slouches, but you can trim to fly slow , same with the Hi Boy, ground loops ? you'd too much movement on the nose wheel.

John

[IanR]

Thanks Tim and Peter re your info on small control surface gaps.

Ian

[Shaunie]

I greatly enjoyed my Hi-Boy, but it was my second trainer not my primary one, quite slick and very responsive  for a trainer I think. I put an OS 45FSR in mine, maybe that was the difference. Built it around 1986 and only binned it a couple of years ago. Wish I'd kept it now!

Low pass Pete, I built a Masterline Vandal, and still have it in the loft, it's going to get a rebuild soon. I put a Super Tigre 61 in mine with a tuned pipe, it was an absolute hoot, not over powered at all. It just worked really well together. I put an own design steering tail wheel on it. Take offs needed no more than half throttle. Went like stink on an MK 12X6 but sounded like a Stuka in a dive.

Shaunie.

Edited By Shaunie on 27/01/2017 19:47:20

[Low pass Pete]

Cannot imagine a 61 in a Vandal. It would have been a real.... vandal😂

[Shaunie]

Unlimited verticals on the 12X6 . Then again there's always the throttle stick.

Trying to get parts for an engine rebuild then I'll get it back in the air. It really wasn't Looney Tunes it just went well.

Like the Hi Boy, I've always powered my planes at the top end of the power envelope, I think it gets you out of trouble more often than it gets you into it! The throttle stick does more than control the volume.

Shaunie.

[ted hughes]

Posted by David Davis on 26/01/2017 07:49:23:

My own view of the Hi-Boy is that they were an awful trainer, too heavy and too fast. That having been said, if you can fly a Hi-Boy you can fly anything. .

Those that learned on a Hi-Boy learned despite the Hi-Boy not because of it! .

Edited By David Davis on 26/01/2017 07:51:46

I second this.I remember I also always wanted a Waterhouse and Ely Superfly, because of the glassfibre fus.

Another flyiing brick.

[ben goodfellow 1]

i learned on a hiboy mk2 .....and an mds 4o gold !!! thats another story...., those who say todays light weight foam trainers are better . imo couldnt be more wrong. i ;learned properly . to take off properly fly properly and land properly .not like this ass3x safe gyroed up foam thingy that dave johnson can can learn to fly in half an hour ......

[Braddock, VC]

I had two hi-boys and was given a third. Yes they were heavy and fast but they did the job for me. One of my clubmates suggested increasing the chord of the aileron to improve their authority, ditto with the rudder. IIRC I used an enya 35 on the first and a TT 42 GP on the second.

So, with my second one, I glued a length of 1/4 triangle section to the leading edge of the ailerons and rudder which made it respond more directly and, iirc, rolls lost their barrelly tendency.

My 2 are in the loft but I doubt it'll come out again as I'm playing with my 10th wot 4, powered by an irvine 36.

[Ben B]

I'd buy one tomorrow if I could. I've got my second in the loft and one day will recondition it. Trying to find some OEM decals though...

[Ben B]

Re ground looping the problem was more lack of a steerable nose wheel. As said above I loved my Hiboy. I can remember one hilarious occasion in which a tree jumped in front of my plane on finals (I thought I was in front of it). It hit the plane half way down one wing half and it span down to the floor in a shower of autumn leaves. I walked over, bent the U/C back to shape, fired the 40GP back up and took off for another circuit.

[David Davis]

I agree that a foam trainer with a gyro, while it might be a good first step for a nervous elderly beginner, teaches you almost nothing because it is the equipment which in large measure is flying the aircraft and not you. However, a modern ARTF trainer like the Boomerang is a superior aircraft to the Hi-Boy in every way.

Incidentally, talking of modern equipment, I have been using my Spektrum DX6i as a slave transmitter attached to my DX9 in order to teach beginners. A more computer-savvy clubmate suggested that I could use the voice function in the DX9 to tell me when the instructor has control and when the trainee has control, so now a young lady tells me who has control! As I now live in the middle of France, my next step will be to teach the young lady to speak French! While setting this up I noticed that there was a function for a rolling circle, a manoeuvre which is outside my ability. Can you really get a model to fly a rolling circle just by setting it up on the transmitter and pressing a button?

To return to the Hi-Boy, I did have one positive experience with it. I was walking down a street in Shrewsbury one day when I saw an unfinished Cambrian Spitfire, one of the larger ones, in the window of a terraced house. I was on the committee of SMFC at the time and didn't recognise the address so knocked on the door to see whether the bloke wanted to join the club. He said that he was giving up the hobby and asked me whether I wanted to buy the Spitfire and his Hi-Boy, radio, engine etc. We did a deal.

I sold the Spitfire to a clubmate and flew the Hi-Boy once or twice before putting it in an auction, complete with OS 40 FP and radio. As the bids topped £100, and I must have looked increasingly pleased, the bloke next to me said, "They don't fly very well do they!" I didn't mind! I won a works-reconditioned Laser 150v later in that auction and the Hi-Boy helped me to pay for it!

Ben, perhaps Tim Calvert of Model Markings could help you with the decals or produce something close enough.

Edited By David Davis on 29/01/2017 06:39:23

[John Lennon 1]

Hi All, I am very new to this. I have a Hi boy precedent I built with my father many years ago. He has now passed so I can't pick his brains on what's what but I am very keen to renovate my hi boy and join a club to start flying her. Does anyone have a copy of the build instructions, operating manual and any suggestions on who I can contact in the UK for parts? Many thanks in advance. John

[Nigel R]

John, the similar (and slightly smaller) FlyBoy plan & manual is here:

http://outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=2880

They shared common style of construction and so on, so this might be worth looking at.

As for parts, slim to no chance really, they have been out of production for years.

[David Davis]

John, I would suggest that you visit the British Model Flying Association's website and find out where your nearest club is located.

**LINK**

Then I would take the Hi-Boy along and have a chat with some of the older members who will remember the model from the Seventies and Eighties. They will be able to help you with your renovation project.

As I've stated above, modern ARTF trainers fly much better than a Hi-Boy the but if you can fly a Hi-Boy, you can fly anything!

[IanR]

John, I have both the instruction manual - 10 off pdfs and plan - 10 off jpegs - (not really a plan but an Airfix-type breakdown showing how the model goes together)

If you PM (personal message) me your email address, I will send them to you.

Ian

PS  This for a Hi Boy Series 2, 3-4 channel, 62" wingspan

Edited By IanR on 18/04/2017 12:14:58

[kc]

The Hi boy was a SLEC kit but no longer produced. However hardware items should all be available and you could probably get a spare foam wing cut by a specialist like Bill Kits.

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]