Peter Jenkins Posted June 27, 2020 Share Posted June 27, 2020 I would agree with Ron as the veneer will act like a stressed skin. Losing adhesion with the underlying foam will mean that the foam will be more highly stressed in those areas. I'd definitely go for the Superphatic solution before covering Ron. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Gray Posted June 27, 2020 Author Share Posted June 27, 2020 It doesn’t feel as though it has debonded but wicking the SA in will sort it even if it has. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Gray Posted June 27, 2020 Author Share Posted June 27, 2020 Today's goal was to get the motor installation sorted out. so after looking through my scraps and offcuts box I came up with some bits and made up the engine mounting box. I then had to make up a radial, bolted prop adapter for the motor as I wanted to rear mount it to the engine box. I didn't take any photos of that but I basically re-fabricated an eFlite four hole one. This meant having to bore it out to fit the Hyperion stub driver and re drill it for a 3 hole fixing rather than a 4 hole one. I also had to machine a spacer to give a greater stand off from the motor. TBH it was one of those jobs that I should really have machined up a complete new adapter as it probably would have taken less time! Once the engine box was dry I fitted it to the fuse using the supplied side thrust wedge, again a bit of fiddling to get it right but got there in the end. And a photo with the motor fitted yes, the threads at the end of the shaft are knackered, the joys of buying second hand, but they will be cut off. I didn't like the fact that there is a gap between the top of the wing and the wing seat plate in the fuse so I 3D printed a spacer to go in there. And just checked to make sure it all fitted. The instructions say to cut a slot out of the wing and then to glue the wing fixing bolt plate into it. I would rather spread the load with a play plate sitting across the underside of the wing and I'll be making that later. So I did meet my target for today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Spicer 1 Posted June 27, 2020 Share Posted June 27, 2020 Well done again Ron! I think mine will take a bit longer once I start.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Spicer 1 Posted June 27, 2020 Share Posted June 27, 2020 Well done again Ron! I think mine will take a bit longer once I start.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Spicer 1 Posted June 27, 2020 Share Posted June 27, 2020 Well done again Ron! I think mine will take a bit longer once I start.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Gray Posted June 28, 2020 Author Share Posted June 28, 2020 It does go together very well and can be a quick build. If I’d been able to work on it full time I think I could have had it built within 4 days rather than the week or so that it has taken. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mac Duberia Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 Hi Ron, You're doing well with the build with excellent photos, I bought mine a week ago and its a two seat version. I'm bit of a slow builder with added time constraints through work. Anyway I'm hoping to lighten the airframe where I can such as making lightening holes in the ply fuselage sides and anywhere, where I could make holes without compromising strength, also planning to install a carbon tube in the wing and in the tail to give me a peace of mind. And to power it, I'm thinking petrol perhaps OS GT22. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Gray Posted June 28, 2020 Author Share Posted June 28, 2020 Hi Mac, personally I wouldn’t lighten the ply doublers, they’ve already got lightening holes in them so I would be concerned about integrity. If you want to lighten the fuse, you could put some holes into the sides, top and bottom behind the cockpit, plus the tailplane is a big lump of balsa so some holes in that would help. The main plane does not need a tube / spar, the veneered foam construction with the GF root bandage (applied as per the instructions) is plenty strong enough and is a tried and tested method. Obviously if you want to have a wing joint to make transport easier then fine. The carbon tube in the tail is a no brainier! I’m sure you will enjoy the kit / build, it can be done quite quickly but is an ideal ‘couple of hours a day’ build, just make sure you ensure everything is square when you assemble the fuse sides to the first couple of formers as this determines the accuracy of the rest of the build! Post your progress on here, I, for one, would like to see others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Gray Posted June 28, 2020 Author Share Posted June 28, 2020 Having worked on 2 models recently with foam veneered wings I've got to say that the Warbird Replicas' ones are superior to the Chris Foss ones, the grain on the Xtra Wot is really coarse and quite prominent. Notwithstanding this I started the covering with the underside of the wings, well actually I decided to do all of the black bits first, leaving the control surfaces until later as they will need the control horn hard points fitting first. My normal practice is to cover wings in pieces to make it easier to handle but this time I decided to do it in one. The the rear underside of the fuse Underside of the tailplane And some bits on the sides of the fuse. Top surfaces and the rest of the fuse will be orange Wing Fuse And then put together to see what the base colours look like. The orange top surface on the wing will be broken up with some black 'flashes' but they will come later. Unfortunately I didn't meet my target of finishing the main covering today as I've still got one half of the fuse to put the orange film on plus the fin and rudder. I always underestimate how long it takes me to apply covering film. I would say that another couple of hours should see it done so I'll try and get some time in tomorrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john stones 1 - Moderator Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 Oooh Jacinth, my favourite colour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Spicer 1 Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 Excellent Ron, the wings look great with that covering Strange not seeing a Laser bolted on the front end! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Gray Posted June 28, 2020 Author Share Posted June 28, 2020 Mine too John. @Gary - yep, a bit of a departure from my normal! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Gray Posted June 30, 2020 Author Share Posted June 30, 2020 Unfortunately I didn't hit my target of having the XW finished today, instead it looks like it's gong to be Thursday or Friday. But lots of little jobs done, hard points fitted to rudder, elevator and ailerons. All hinge points slotted and hinges fitted. Elevator joining wire fitted. Rudder, elevators and ailerons covered. Fin and tailplane glued in place, for the latter I had to slightly trim one fuse tailplane slot as it was about 1/2 degrees out from level. I also spent a bit of time drawing and cutting out some letters for etc fuse and wings, for this I used the Silhouette Cameo to cut the letter from covering film. Not many photos as the work was pretty basic and covering is covering! For eta hinges I'm using 'furry' plastic type glued into the control surfaces using medium, slow set cyano, then Gorilla Glue (white) to attach them to the wings etc, Hinge slots cut using the slotting tool Most of the parts can be seen in this shot plus the lettering has been added to the fuse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Flyer Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 Looks great Ron! Super Fast Build too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Gray Posted June 30, 2020 Author Share Posted June 30, 2020 Thanks Tim, it went together quite easily, really good instructions and sketches. Taking longer to finish bits off but me doing the fancy lettering hasn't helped! Hopefully it will look alright when it's all put together (got to paint the front deck and cowl first!) Edited By Ron Gray on 30/06/2020 22:31:59 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Spicer 1 Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 I think it look great as well Ron, I,m very impressed with your lettering, I had know idea you could cut covering film with the Cameo. Are you using the kit hardware pack for hinges clevis etc.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Gray Posted July 1, 2020 Author Share Posted July 1, 2020 Thanks Gary, I tried the Cameo as an experiment and am rather pleased with the results but wait until you see the wings! I’m using the kit supplied hardware, apart from the hinge material which is smooth nylon but I prefer to use the ‘flocked’ nylon type for flat hinges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flying pastor Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 Excellent job Ron. This may be of interest regarding your power train. I am converting a Wot4 xl to electric using a Hyperion 4045/280 which is the forerunner of the 4045/12. On 8s and an 18*10 apc e I am getting 55 amps and about 1550 watts. This is with the cells on storage voltage. They are now on charge to see the results later today. The motor has a continuous current rating of 50amps and max 63 amps. Unless there is a significant difference between your motor and mine I think that you will need a smaller prop than the 19*10 than you intended to use. I'm sure that you will use a wattmeter to check and I look forward to seeing the results. All the best...Chris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Gray Posted July 1, 2020 Author Share Posted July 1, 2020 Many thanks Chris and you are correct, I will be using a wattmeter to check it out before flying, I was basing mine on what another guy is using with the same motor plus what eCalc says (I know that is not always right!). Will be good to see your findings with fully charged cells. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flying pastor Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 Ok Ron here we go. Fully charged my lipos and then left them for 3 hours to settle. Ran up motor at half throttle for 1 minute then went to full power and hastily shut down again as was seeing 75amps and over 2000 watts. Changed prop to 16*10 and saw 55 amps and 1650 watts which is fine for me. It could be that the type of wind/construction changed when the motor was updated. Will be interested in your results. Incidentally I reckon that you will finish your extrawot build before I finish my wot 4am assembly! All the best...Chris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Gray Posted July 1, 2020 Author Share Posted July 1, 2020 Great info Chris, will probably have to re-think the prop then! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Jenkins Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 Some info on setting up electric motors guys. I bought a small on-board telemetry system sold by SM Modelbau called the UnisensE that can be made to talk to most types of radio system. (You can find an English translation here.) It is small and light yet provides real time readouts of the motor parameters as well as height and is pretty accurate. I mention this as when doing a check on power output on two 2 mtr class aerobats I found that the static measurement was way out. I recorded 3600 watts at 98 amps on one motor/prop combo (10S pack with a 99 amp ESC) but never saw more than 2800 watts (the motor's limit) on more than one occasion and around 70 amps. Those figures were obtained from the UnisensE with the aircraft tethered and then at full throttle on a vertical climb. I no longer rely on ground testing but on relying on airborne readings. For electrics, there is little point in doing a static full power check once you have sorted out the correct prop and, as you can see from the results I obtained, if you use the static power/current check to size the prop you will be well under that power/current in the air. Up to you how you go about this but for around Euro 70 (incl post) you have a piece of kit that can be moved from model to model to help check you are getting the maximum performance out of your equipment without overstressing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Gray Posted July 2, 2020 Author Share Posted July 2, 2020 Peter, based on your comments about the UnisensE up at the field, I went ahead and bought one and will be using it in the Xtra Wot! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted July 2, 2020 Share Posted July 2, 2020 The thing I like about the Unisens-E is that one unit can be swapped from model to model at the field. All you need is an SPort lead cable tied near your battery connectors. If you've got room for an extra 1 1/2" of connector they are a great upgrade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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