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Mini Super Belair Kits


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The model can be found here

 

and this is what it says

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A small enough model to build on a kitchen table and an easy build ideal for a novice.

 

I will place an order for the strip wood when I have worked out what is needed by measuring up from the plan.

It's going to be electric so one of the first tasks is to size the motor and ESC and once that is decided work out where they will fit and what changes are needed.

I expect to move F1 forward to keep the prop in the design position which helps with room for the battery (3S 2200) and CofG.

 

I have a Super 60 which was an easy conversion so I assume this will be straight forward as well. We will find out ?

The build will start tomorrow.?

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Just now, David Davis 2 said:

Has a decision been made on the Mass Build? Is the Mini Super the people's choice or are we building any British model of the last 100years? These seem to me to be the two choices suggested so far.

Yes the decision is anything. The choice is yours so please join in. 

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Looking at the electrics. The AUW will be something like 2 1/2 pounds so, I usually use 100 watts/lb, 250 watts.

 

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will do the job. If there is too much power then I will prop it down which is a lot easier than a motor that is too small.

 

Having made that decision and with the dimensions to hand I can decide on the changes that are needed. As I am building a new model I can do things like lengthen the nose for the battery to fit. Also get rid of the wing bands and use wing bolts. A bit of forward planning will reduce the number of surprises encountered during the build, I hope.  

 

Steve

 

?

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Steve, I'm sure that motor would provide plenty of power but IMO you'd be better off going for a motor closer in weight to a 15 ic engine. My personal choice would be a 3536 around 1000kv like this one from Ebay. Advantages are - it's nearer the weight (cg), it's got a 5mm shaft (more robust), the shaft's pointing in the right direction for use with an "X" mount (more room behind), it will run cooler for the same current draw as the smaller motor at any given power output(reduced stress).  

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8 hours ago, PatMc said:

Steve, I'm sure that motor would provide plenty of power but IMO you'd be better off going for a motor closer in weight to a 15 ic engine. My personal choice would be a 3536 around 1000kv like this one from Ebay. Advantages are - it's nearer the weight (cg), it's got a 5mm shaft (more robust), the shaft's pointing in the right direction for use with an "X" mount (more room behind), it will run cooler for the same current draw as the smaller motor at any given power output(reduced stress).  

Thanks for the input Pat.

I don't do ebay for two reasons my son was ripped off years ago and it wont let me sign in, no big loss IMO. However I have that motor in my Ohmen which confirms what you say. I also have a 2836 1020kv with the reversed shaft, I turned it around. My thinking is to minimise the weight. I can change my mind and all input is gratefully received.

 

What to do ?

Steve

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Being keen to start I cleared the building board then knowing I have a stock of wood opened up the plan and had a couple of surprises. The wings are bolted on ? which makes one less decision but also most of the square balsa is 3/16" you probably guess that I have none☹️. This means that before I can start I need to buy the wood.

 

Study the plan and work out what's needed. Unless of course someone has done this and has a list to hand. Is that a long shot?

 

Another puzzle is that it's a trike and has a tail wheel. ?

Obviously this is going to be fun.

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5 minutes ago, David Davis 2 said:

Both are available from Belair kits. Perhaps you've bought the original design.

I bought the KK version which is the trike but you made me look at the plan again and it has both options. ? I must learn to read the plan?

 

Thanks for that David one conundrum solved. ?

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I worked through the plan with a ruler and made up a list of wood and added a few just to make sure. To be honest I got to the point where I was losing the will to live, paracetamol didn't help, so I pressed the buy button and I will see what arrives ? Not to worry I will definitely be able to start when the order arrives and hopefully have some extra to put into stock. One observation is that 1/32 birch ply seems expensive odd that the thinner it gets the more it costs which seems counter intuitive to me.

 

Back to Rhapsody for a couple of days. ?

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1/32 ply is expensive and 1/64 is even more expensive.

For the Mini Super the 1/32 ply is used for the elevator but it seems to me that 3/16 balsa would be easier and take hinges better.  

Also uses 1/32 for u/c support but that could be 3mm lite ply I reckon.

Jims photo of the white model looks as though the elevator is quite a bit wider than the AMI plan and looks more conventional for modern RC. 

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Ailerons and flaps caught my eye as I was looking at the plan earlier and thought convert to ailerons would be easy then quick as a flash flaps as well. A couple of hours later an up pops the proof. Amazing.

 

Mk1 wing bands and trike

Mk2 wing bolts and tail dragger also the tailplane is slotted into the fuselage.

 

Both are nice and something for me to aim for.

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The original plan has about 3 inches of dihedral under each tip while the ones built with ailerons probably have this reduced a lot.   Means the dihedral braces would be quite different.

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Hi John

The MK1 is as per plan apart from the ailerons and flaps. this model was built in 2008 and flew very well with OS15 up front.

 

Mk2 as you say has the mid mounted tailplane and a full length rudder,MK1 rudder did not have a lot of authority for steering on the deck.

Mk2 I have upped the power  to OS20,bolted on wing,no flaps on this one,built it for a friend of mine down Liverpool ways and just waiting for test flight  results when weather improves.

Both models are tail draggers.

JIm

Ps  Models are built from different plans,the MK2 has a wider fuzz than Mk1..my good friend Patmc will explain if he sees this post.

Just seen Kc post and I have reduced the dihedral to 1" under each tip.

Edited by Jim Carss
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37 minutes ago, Jim Carss said:

 

Ps  Models are built from different plans,the MK2 has a wider fuzz than Mk1..my good friend Patmc will explain if he sees this post.

 

Oh no he won't !! 

'cause he doesn't know. ?

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6 hours ago, David Davis 2 said:

The original Mini Super 60 as designed by David Boddington had a conventional undercarriage. Keil Kraft converted it to a trike when the introduced their kit.

 

Both are available from Belair kits. Perhaps you've bought the original design.

The Keil Kraft model didn't have the "60" suffix, AFAIK it was just called the Mini Super, as is the Ben Buckle kit and plan.

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David Boddington explained the Mini Super in his article in AMI Nov 96.  ( it's on Outerzone )

The AMI free plan on Outerzone was taken from the original Boddington drawing and is the narrower fuselage.  When Keil Kraft kitted it they widened the fuselage and made it a tricycle u/c and paid him his first ever payment for aeromodelling.

 

This plan from AMI actually spans 46 7/8 inches which is more than the 45 inches stated in the article heading and a bit less than the 48 inches quoted by Keil Kraft in their adverts.  The AMI plan fuselage  ( Boddo said it's from his original tracing ) measures 80mm  ( about 3 1/8 inches ) outside and gives 60mm ( about 2 7/16  inches ) inside the fus which should be enough for 2 servos  and just about enough for 3 modern servos if using glow with a throttle.    If someone measures the Belair kit then we might know whether its from  the KK plan or the AMI one but I wouldn't expect it to make much difference.    Just build to the plan you have and don't mix components from one plan with another.

 

 

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