Classic Or Vintage.....??

[GaryW]

At what age,,,, Does a model become a " Classic " or a " Vintage " Model....?

 

Over the years I've either owned or flown just about every class & type of model including Trainers, Scale, Sports Scale, Aerobatic, Sports Aerobatic, Vintage model such as junior 60 etc Slope Soaring & Thermal Gliders.... a coupe of flights on jets and even Control Line which I must admit made me as sick as a pig..lol And whether they be powered by Glow Diesl or Petrol... So a varied range & type of flying in me Rc Flying Life...... This time round since coming back into the hobby just over a year ago after a 6 year break due to health reasons lookinmg at the models I now have in my collection,, Now I'm not saying I'm getting old... well I hope I'm not ... not yet I hope seeing as I'm only ( almost ) 51,,,, and also since coming back to the hobby my I find my flying style has changed from the mad capped fly it like you stole it style to a more relaxed and gentle style of flying....

Looking at my Model Room.... apart from the Ruckus & Turbo Timber ,,, It seems this time round in the hobby,, & forgive the use of the term,, I seem to be putting together over the past year ,,, A more " Old Timers Collection " of models,,,, So that got me thinking ,,,,,, Currently in my collection...

Listed in the Category I feel them to be in....:-

 

Vintage - ( Pre 1970's ) 

Ben Buckle Scorpion

Ben Buckle Junior 60
Ben Buckle Super 60

 

 

Classic - ( 1970's, 80's / 90's )

Avicraft/Perkins Panic

2x 7.5PG Diesel Gliders

2x Waterhouse & Eley Superfly     

DB Centurion

Hirobo Shuttle ( Plus 2 )

TT Raptor 30

 

Modern - Within last 10 years

E-Flite Turbo Timber 

Max Thrust Ruckus

 

So the Question Is...... "" At what age does a model become a Classic or a Vitage .....? ""

 

 

 

 

[J D 8 - Moderator]

 Going to be a bit like the same question about car's. Ask a dozen people and get a dozen different answers I recon.  Veteran, Edwardian, Vintage are pretty well defined but when it comes to classic ??????

[Geoff S]

Not sure about cars but the terms are defined by the Vintage Motorcycle Club (VMCC).  Vintage is pre-1939 and veteran is pre-1914 IIRC. PVT (Post Vintage Thoroughbred) is pre-1940.  Things get a bit vague after that because the VMCC introduced a 25 year rule which means motor cycles I owned new are now classed as eligible, which is somewhat disturbing.  It's always surprising to me that machines like Honda etc, which were unknown when I started riding in 1956 can be used in VMCC events.

 

Once you get past models that were initially designed for free flight (or single channel) then it's just a matter of opinion.  I would have thought ARTF 'foamies' could be in a class of their own but apart from that, who knows?

[Engine Doctor]

Classic , Old timer etc has surely got to be a model thats been out of production for 20 plus years or so  ? In the case of VED and cars  its 40 years . Many of us modellers  must be in the classic or veteran era/bracket 😉 although Mature sound much nicer .

[leccyflyer]

The recent build threads of Vintage RC models from Aeromodeller and RCM&E on RC Groups had Vintage defined as at least 50 years, so models built from plans pre 1973.

 

The Vintage Radio Control Society has their own definitions 

PIONEER - prior to January 1, 1955
CLASSIC - prior to January 1, 1965
NOSTALGIA - thirty-five years before January 1 of the current year.

 

It's going to be a moveable feast and also vary by location - models deemed to be Classics over here certainly would include some that don't fit those criteria - by common parlance over here the Wot 4 and Mick Reeves Gangster would deemed Classics, but I think those would be a bit later than 1965.

[Keith Billinge]

You could have the same argument about what's "Customary" and what's "Traditional".

It's rather an arbitrary thing.

KB

[Martin Harris - Moderator]

3 hours ago, leccyflyer said:

The recent build threads of Vintage RC models from Aeromodeller and RCM&E on RC Groups had Vintage defined as at least 50 years, so models built from plans pre 1973.

 

The Vintage Radio Control Society has their own definitions 

PIONEER - prior to January 1, 1955
CLASSIC - prior to January 1, 1965
NOSTALGIA - thirty-five years before January 1 of the current year.

 

It's going to be a moveable feast and also vary by location - models deemed to be Classics over here certainly would include some that don't fit those criteria - by common parlance over here the Wot 4 and Mick Reeves Gangster would deemed Classics, but I think those would be a bit later than 1965.

Are these definitions applicable to models built from plans dating from before the cut-offs or models actually built before them?

[Tim Hooper]

Old is just old........

 

Tim😉

[Geoff S]

2 hours ago, Tim Hooper said:

Old is just old........

 

Tim😉

 

... and don't I know it!  I've just sent an email to the 8 year-old twin sons of my nephew.  They sent us a couple of cards last week and asked what we did at Easter. We didn't do anything but we used to ride a long distance trial (The Land's End), often on a sidecar outfit and I sent them a picture of us winning the sidecar class in 1973 (so long ago) and another of us riding our tandem more recently (1999) -  we were nearly 60 then but it's 24 years ago 😞   Neither of us has turned a pedal this year and I haven't flown much either.

[Frank Day]

I have "Classic" foamies, Robbe Concorde, Parkzone 49" Mosquitoes, Multiplex Sonic Liner etc. Classic in my mind because they came and went whilst out of the hobby and still survive in various states, some even have limited spares available.

[Outrunner]

Any secondhand airframe or engine on eBay seem too be listed as vintage 😅

[Frank Day]

True, ploy to sell olde %@#$, face book is worse.

33 minutes ago, Outrunner said:

Any secondhand airframe or engine on eBay seem too be listed as vintage 😅

 

[Robin Colbourne]

I'm just wondering if it more years now from when some Ben Buckle kits were released, than from when the originals were released that Ben Buckle copied?

[John Wagg]

Sam 35 rules:-

A vintage model must be built in accordance with a design that was first flown, published or kitted prior to 1st January 1951, (January 1951 issues of magazines are accepted as published in 1950). 

A classic model must be built in accordance with a design that was first flown, published or kitted after 30th December 1950 and before 1st January 1961 (January 1961 issues of magazines are accepted as published in 1960).

https://sam35.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/SAM35RulebookNo3AL3.pdf

 

 

[Martin Harris - Moderator]

Looks like my Sterling Stearman and Cessna 180 are both "genuine" classics then - although the only original part in the Cessna is the steel cowl saved from my mid-70s build from the kit.

[Frank Day]

But who made up those rules. I can smell the moth balls already!

 

Sounds like a sketch from the 80's Only Fools and Horses comedy about Triggers broom. Original broom but its only had 14 new handles and 17 heads! 

 

Edited April 26 by Frank Day

[Robin Colbourne]

4 hours ago, Frank Day said:

But who made up those rules. I can smell the moth balls already!

 

People to whom the 1930s, 40s and 50s were as significant as the 1970s and 80s are to most of the contributors here.

For the Americans, the golden years were the 1930s when balsa wood and petrol engines first appeared in large quantities.  Over here, power flying was banned in the war, so the mid to late 1940s and 50s were of greater importance.

The question is whether vintage should focus on the models or the participants?  In car terms, the Ford Model T may be more significant to the development of the automobile, however a Mk1 Escort or Capri is more likely to evoke more memories for those with the time and money to buy and restore them now.

Edited April 26 by Robin Colbourne

[Fly Boy 3]

In suitable weather I fly my Super scorpion with the much maligned MDS engine which over the years has proved faultless. Built in 1973 I call my “best “ flier lol.

[David Davis]

2 hours ago, Fly Boy 3 said:

In suitable weather I fly my Super scorpion with the much maligned MDS engine which over the years has proved faultless. Built in 1973 I call my “best “ flier lol.

 

Purely from observing the tribulations of others, I have to say that the majority of people who bought MDS 18s or 38s were quite satisfied with them. As for the rest of the range, they are in my opinion, justly much maligned.

[Fly Boy 3]

I agree David. I was told the smaller cc size engines were fine, but larger ones had a different carb and were not so reliable.  Cheers

 

[J D 8 - Moderator]

22 hours ago, David Davis said:

 

Purely from observing the tribulations of others, I have to say that the majority of people who bought MDS 18s or 38s were quite satisfied with them. As for the rest of the range, they are in my opinion, justly much maligned.

 More Dead Stick's we used to call them but agree with the above, friend had an 18 and it was a singer. My 40 something I chucked in the bin!

[David Davis 2]

...then there was a clubmate who built a large Druine Turbulent powered by the biggest MDS obtainable. It threw a rod on it's maiden flight!

 

Ok it might not have been the maiden flight but you get my drift...

[Jim Hearnden 1]

Just been recommissioning a couple of old models & a few new ones bought recently. One of my own design is looking tatty. But thinking back it dates to around 1990. So 34-35 years old. It came as a shock because I still tend to think of the 70's being 30 years ago rather than the 50+ they actually are.

Edited May 5 by Jim Hearnden 1