Advice on faulty goods

[Tim Kearsley]

As per the subject, I'd like to hear opinions and advice on a matter regarding faulty goods.

 

In March this year I bought a Prolux LCD sealing iron.  I've used it to cover an autogyro project I built and was part way through covering another build when it ceased working.  It's the fourth Prolux iron I've had in four years and every one has failed with the same error - Err 2, which I think indicates the heating element has burned out.  This latest one has lasted just four months.  I have emailed the vendor but have received, as yet, no reply.

 

Do you think I have any right to request they offer me a replacement?

 

My other intended course of action, if the vendor doesn't respond, is to email the UK distributor, who is CML I believe.

 

Any thoughts?

 

[Martin Harris - Moderator]

Your contract is with the supplier but while you might get some assistance from the distributor, they have no legal responsibility to do so. 
 

You most certainly have a legal right to receive goods fit for purpose and of merchantable quality, with a reasonable expectation of service life.  
 

Was this mail order from a reputable supplier or a random internet seller?  Either way, you have a legal claim on them if they are based in the UK - good luck if they’re further afield!

 

You may have some recourse if you used PayPal or some other accountable method offering buyer’s protection. 

[Tim Kearsley]

Thanks Martin.  Yes, it's a very well known UK model shop.  As of yet they've not replied to my email but I'll give them a bit longer.  If still no reply then maybe phoning them is the next step.

 

I did pay for the goods with PayPal.

 

[Robert Cracknell]

Credit card insurance is only for transactions over £100 but if a dispute cannot be resolved then the banks have a chargeback scheme for debit card transactions where a claim can be made for a refund. Keep copies of all correspondence and notes of phone calls. Your bank can explain more.

[Robert Cracknell]

Sorry, just saw you paid via PayPal. Don't they have a dispute resolution scheme?

[Tim Kearsley]

Yes Robert, PayPal do have a dispute procedure.  I really hope it doesn't come to that for 35 quid's worth!  The silly thing is that the likely result is a replacement which I don't want.  After four of the things failing on me I've completely lost faith.  I started to wonder if I was doing something wrong but I switch it on, set the temperature and iron on the film.  I can't see what else you can do!

[Simon Clark]

Hi Tim,

 

If you would prefer a refund, then it is always best to make that clear and you may get one without any arguments or hassles. However, legally they are not obliged to do that. For anything older than 28 days and within the warranty period, the seller has the choice of either replacing, repairing or refunding regardless of what you might ask for. However if they send you a replacement or repaired item and that then subsequently fails, then they need to send you a full refund if you request one. Having said that, many retailers (especially larger ones) tend to try to ignore the law if it suits them. I had a problem with a laptop bought from a very well know retailer and after the first repair did not work, I asked for a refund which they did not want to supply. When I reminded their customer service that this was the law, the reply was 'Yes, I know that is the law and that legally you can a have a refund but that doesn't matter and we follow our own procedures' Eventually, I got my refund but only after four repair attempts!

 

Good luck

Simon

[Tim Kearsley]

Thank you Simon.  Crikey, it seems you had a nightmare with the laptop!  I would indeed prefer a refund but I'll accept a replacement if that's the offer.  There doesn't seem to be many options available in sealing irons.  There's an Irvine one (which is what I'm using at the moment, thanks to a loan from a clubmate) at around £55 or so and I may buy one of those.

[Futura57]

2 hours ago, Tim Kearsley said:

Thank you Simon.  Crikey, it seems you had a nightmare with the laptop!  I would indeed prefer a refund but I'll accept a replacement if that's the offer.  There doesn't seem to be many options available in sealing irons.  There's an Irvine one (which is what I'm using at the moment, thanks to a loan from a clubmate) at around £55 or so and I may buy one of those.

Hi Tim

I highly recommend the Irvine Pro Sealing Iron with the rounded underside. I recently replaced mine after 15+ years service and a great deal of use.

 

 

 

 

[Frank Day]

If you paid by paypal or credit card and the retailer isn't responding go  straight to them

[Rich too]

I bought a leather travel bag in April for a trip June/July. The first trip I’ve used it for and the zip broke. 
 

I contacted John Lewis and they told me there was no warranty on it and as it was a few months old, all they could offer me was £25 as goodwill.

 

i said I wanted a replacement and quoted the consumer rights act 2015, and they soon changed their tune and arranged an exchange - I was disappointed it came to that though, especially being John Lewis.

[Tim Kearsley]

13 hours ago, Futura57 said:

Hi Tim

I highly recommend the Irvine Pro Sealing Iron with the rounded underside. I recently replaced mine after 15+ years service and a great deal of use.

 

 

 

 

Thanks John.  The iron I'm borrowing at the moment, to finish covering the Top Quark, is an Irvine.  Having used nothing but the Prolux irons, which have a completely flat plate, it's taken a bit of use for me to get used to it but the rounded hot plate does have its advantages.  I think that is what I shall buy.

[Cuban8]

A telephone call is the way forward. Ask for the shop manager if there is one, as the counter assistant(s) may not be in a position to help with this sort of problem.

A refund after this period of time is unlikely but you are entitled to a replacement item after such a short time  (unlikely that they'll have the option to repair these days, especially a relatively inexpensive item). 

I always go with the soft approach in these cases for example.........."I bought 'product X' from you just four months ago and although I was very happy with its performance at the start, I'm disappointed that the device has since failed completely and is now unusable"............"could you advise me how to resolve this matter please?" Getting angry and allowing an edge to creep into one's voice only makes things worse.

|I've only had one stroppy model shop owner many years ago who made it as difficult as possibe to resolve an issue I had with a product (he's still in business and although I eventually got my replacement item, I've never spent another penny with him in over thirty+ years), I find customer service in these days of competition between retailers to be generally very good. I'm sure you'll have your problem solved once you speak to the right person.

 

 

 

Edited July 18 by Cuban8

[Cuban8]

15 hours ago, Rich too said:

I bought a leather travel bag in April for a trip June/July. The first trip I’ve used it for and the zip broke. 
 

I contacted John Lewis and they told me there was no warranty on it and as it was a few months old, all they could offer me was £25 as goodwill.

 

i said I wanted a replacement and quoted the consumer rights act 2015, and they soon changed their tune and arranged an exchange - I was disappointed it came to that though, especially being John Lewis.

That's very interesting. I wonder who it was in that large organisation who decided that the CRA 2015 didn't apply to them, yet giving you £25 quite out of the blue for something that they initially thought was nothing to do with them was OK. 

[Tim Kearsley]

Thanks Cuban.  I agree 100% that getting stroppy, unless you're forced to do so, is counter-productive.  I always make a complaint very politely because if you go in all guns blazing from the outset you just make your "opponent" more likely to be difficult.

[kc]

If you look at the  'Which?' website it gives the definitive guide to faulty goods and refunds.  You don't need to subscribe to see that part of their information.

[Tim Kearsley]

Thanks to all who've contributed to this.  Just to feedback, I spoke to the vendor this afternoon and they have agreed to replace the faulty iron.  The guy I spoke to said that they sell several hundred of the iron every year and only receive two or three irons returned as faulty.  I must just be exceptionally unlucky!!

[Simon Chaddock]

Tim

"Four of the same make Iron failed over four years"

That tells me something about optimism.

I hope the replacement last longer.   

[Tim Kearsley]

2 hours ago, Simon Chaddock said:

Tim

"Four of the same make Iron failed over four years"

That tells me something about optimism.

I hope the replacement last longer.   

What's the phrase - "Hope springs eternal"?  Believe me Simon, I don't want another one but I don't think the vendor had any obligation to give me a refund so I took what was offered.  Perhaps I'll be lucky - you never know. 

[Dale Bradly]

7 hours ago, Tim Kearsley said:

Thanks to all who've contributed to this.  Just to feedback, I spoke to the vendor this afternoon and they have agreed to replace the faulty iron.  The guy I spoke to said that they sell several hundred of the iron every year and only receive two or three irons returned as faulty.  I must just be exceptionally unlucky!!

I call BS on the vendors response. (Not on you Tim). 

Based on the assumption your vendor is a UK based retailer: to be selling "several hundred" of these per year? That sounds like approximately one per day. I struggle to think a single store sells one per day. 

Having 2-3 admitted returned per year? Having been responsible for telling the same stories myself, you could easily double or even triple that number to be truthful. And how many dont get returned, or failed just outside of warranty and the owner doesnt follow up/care? It sounds to me like a 10% failure rate wouldnt be unexpected. 

(In retrospect, maybe the high failure rate explains the high sales volume!)

[Paul De Tourtoulon]

18 hours ago, Cuban8 said:

I always go with the soft approach in these cases for example.........."I bought 'product X' from you just four months ago and although I was very happy with its performance at the start, I'm disappointed that the device has since failed completely and is now unusable"............"could you advise me how to resolve this matter please?

That is the way to go, praising the article, then telling them how upset that it isn't working.

[Cuban8]

19 hours ago, Tim Kearsley said:

Thanks Cuban.  I agree 100% that getting stroppy, unless you're forced to do so, is counter-productive.  I always make a complaint very politely because if you go in all guns blazing from the outset you just make your "opponent" more likely to be difficult.

We're all human.........I worked for a small, family run electronics company for a couple of years back in the day and one was expected to have a hand in almost everything. Answering the phone to deal with customers was something I did now and again, and the rudeness of some people was incredible.

[Cuban8]

13 hours ago, Tim Kearsley said:

Thanks to all who've contributed to this.  Just to feedback, I spoke to the vendor this afternoon and they have agreed to replace the faulty iron.  The guy I spoke to said that they sell several hundred of the iron every year and only receive two or three irons returned as faulty.  I must just be exceptionally unlucky!!

All the more reason for the firm to take pity on you and make things right ASAP.

[Rich too]

21 hours ago, Cuban8 said:

That's very interesting. I wonder who it was in that large organisation who decided that the CRA 2015 didn't apply to them, yet giving you £25 quite out of the blue for something that they initially thought was nothing to do with them was OK. 

Indeed, i use JL quite a lot and it was very disappointing..

[Keith Billinge]

The best model covering iron I have ever bought was the Hinari Lifestyle travel iron which is freely available on ebay for about a tenner second hand.

It holds it's temperature better than a model covering iron and has a non stick base easily cleaned with alcohol.

 

I rate it very highly and it's great, because you can remove the handle to get it into tight spaces. I do have a covering iron but I never use it now.