Martin Dilly 1
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Posts posted by Martin Dilly 1
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3 hours ago, Learner said:
Call it what you like, to most people were just a group of sad old men that haven't grown up playing with toy planes!
Why the words do matter is that local borough councils and other national authorities have (or, in these straightened times, had.. ) funding available for local sports organisations. If we keep referring to model flying as a hobby or a pastime we’ve rather shot ourselves in the foot before we’ve started. If you don’t care that’s fine; it just possibly screws it up for other flyers and leaves still more for the footballers.
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35 minutes ago, Fly Boy 3 said:
“All modellers are fliers, but not all fliers are modellers”
Cheers
That pretty much says it. Having been involved for around 20 years in the negotiations that finally got model flying recognised in the early 1990s as a sport by the Sports Council (now Sport England) and the Central Council for Physical Recreation (now the Sport and Recreation Alliance) I can assure you that the semantics are actually important.
When we took the first steps towards recognition of model flying as a sport we soon found that two major hold-backs were the title – Society of Model Aeronautical Engineers – and the words ‘hobby’ and ‘aeromodelling’. There’s nothing wrong with hobbies; stamp collecting, model railways or making a model of the Houses of Parliament out of a thousand matchsticks are pastimes that give people a lot of harmless enjoyment. Making model aircraft, whether Airfix plastics or ones that fly, can be a hobby too. But, as Fly Boy says, what we all enjoy is model flying and that is without a shadow of a doubt a sport; it’s a man-and-machine as well as a man-versus-the-elements one, whether we fly recreationally or competitively.
Every time we fly a model, whether we’ve spent many hours building it or many pounds buying it, we’re enjoying a sport. It’s not a dirty word. It doesn’t imply cut-throat pot-hunting competition or trying to fly better than somebody else. If there is any competition then it’s you trying to make this flight just a bit better than your previous one.
Why does this matter? Moast UK Councils have a Sports and Recreation Committee which can provide funding and facilities for local sports clubs, including model flying clubs, and permission to use sites. So please, please, please can we satop referring to 'the hobby' and give model flying the respect it deserves as a SPORT.
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Staying on the Bond Minicar topic (thread drift?) Tony Young of the Croydon club was a British team member flying F1A glider at the 1965 World Free Flight Championships at Kauhava airfield in Finland. He drove there in his Minicar and took a spare Villiers engine with him as well as his model box, just in case. The photo shows him filling up at a Finnish gas station. Worth the drive, as Britain won the glider team trophy against 21 other countries.
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Before this thread grinds to a halt or is euthanised could I make an important point.
The words we use to describe what we do, in our case model flying, can have far reaching effects that can sometimes do us all a lot of harm. For instance, there’s nothing wrong with hobbies; stamp collecting, model railways or making a model of the Houses of Parliament out of a thousand matchsticks are pastimes that give people a lot of harmless enjoyment. Making model aircraft, whether Airfix plastics or ones that fly, can be a hobby too. But what we all enjoy is model flying and that is without a shadow of a doubt a sport; it’s a man-and-machine as well as a man-versus-the-elements one, whether we fly recreationally or competitively.
Every time we fly a model, whether we’ve spent many hours building it or many pounds buying it, we’re enjoying a sport. It’s not a dirty word. It doesn’t imply cut-throat pot-hunting competition or trying to fly better than somebody else. If there is any competition then it’s you trying to make this flight just a bit better than your previous one.
Why does this matter? Most local UK Councils have a Sports and Recreation Committee, which can provide funding, facilities for local sports clubs, including model flying clubs, and permission to use sites. In the early 1970s the first steps were taken towards recognition of model flying as a sport. We soon found that two major hold-backs were the title – Society of Model Aeronautical Engineers – and the words ‘hobby’ and ‘aeromodelling’. Because of the inaccuracy of the SMAE name, a working title of The British Model Flying Association was adopted in 1988. In our presentations to government we compared model flying disciplines with other sports, - combat flying and fencing, aerobatics and figure skating, free-flight and orienteering, - and got documentary evidence from numerous overseas nations whose governments already funded model flying as a sport. Finally in 1993, over 20 years since we first started negotiations, Sports Council (now Sport England) recognition finally came, benefitting all British model flyers.
So, please, please, please can we all stop referring to ‘the hobby’ and give model flying the respect it deserves as a SPORT.
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2 hours ago, Nigel Heather said:
Anyone got a link to the BMFA responses. I got sent an email last week and I planned to go through the response over the weekend but I can't find the email - might have accidentally deleted it.
Cheers.
Nigel
Since nobody else has bothered, here's the link. A couple of days to the deadline.
https://bmfa.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/08/BMFA-Response-to-CAA-Call-for-Inputv2.pdf
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3 hours ago, kevin b said:
I think in the future that the International competitions will probably be monopolised by the Ukrainians.
Too late! They've been right at the top internationally for several decades. Just a few from the podium at free-flight World and European Championships in the past few years, - Andrjukov (now in the US team), Kulakovsky, Stefanchuk, Alexandrov, Babenko, Stamov, Verbitski, Vivchar. And they seem to have a pool of top-class young flyers as well.
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3 hours ago, leccyflyer said:
They haven't disappeared. They were posted in the thread The Big Question, not in this thread and they are still there.
Thanks, Leccy. Brain fade strikes again. Probably time for a nice lie down...
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Yesterday there was a post that ended by mentioning "silly old duffers with boring toy planes" or words to that effect, to which I replied, urging people to respond to the CAA questionnaire. Both posts now seem to have vanished. As far as I am aware, neither was offensive. What happened?
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On 27/08/2023 at 09:06, RICHARD WILLS said:
The current email from the BMFA is very ominous and unlike Football and Cricket nobody will miss those silly old duffers with their toy planes .
So lets come together and enjoy what we have .
Much more to the point, make sure to read Dave Phipps's comments and complete the CAA's questionnaire yourself. The deadline's Sept. 7th. It's a lot more ominous if the CAA get very few responses. Let's flood their in-box with sensible replies, preferably in line with those of the BMFA; model flying is by far the biggest air sport in Britain, so make the CAA aware that the people who take part in it care enough to offer their advice. Don't be one of the silly old duffers who didn't bother.
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Peter F and others make a very important point. Many of us have never bought a model aircraft in our lives, but the tenor of the CAA proposals is that they are regulating a commercial product, ("product requirements", "manufacturer standards", "product labelling"); there seems a serious risk that unless we stress that many members of Britain's largest airsports organisation, the BMFA, have been designing and building the aircraft they fly and compete with safely for over a century (sometimeas it feels like that personally...) then they risk being legislated out of existence. The BMFA bumper sticker sums it up well, - Model Flying - Sport with Built-in Satisfaction.
Many of the aircraft we fly weigh under 250grams, - F1B Wakefields for example and a lot of other free flight competition and recreational types, - and the imposition of any sort of remote ID device would be a serious weight and possibly safety penalty.
The STEM benefits of what we do - designing, building and trimming an aircraft for the best possible performance - are too valuable to allow legislation primarily aimed at commercial products to swamp them.
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When you go to the multi-event Nationals at Buckminster over the August 27-29th Bank Holiday weekend whatever else you do, do make sure to take in the BMFA Centenary Exhibition in the Goldsmith hangar. Whatever you fly yourself, you’ll find there’s a lot more to model flying than that, and the sheer range of historic, successful and famous models will be an eye opener.
There are the actual models that have won World Championships or set world records, models that you probably built when a lot younger or that got you hooked on our sport, as well as those that marked the significant developments in model flying that we take for granted today. With over 130 models from all disciplines, from a one gram indoor duration model that flies at less than walking pace, to a 29kg half scale radio glider that replicates the original exactly, there’s something to intrigue and fascinate everyone, so don’t miss the show; it closes on Aug. 31st and it’s free.
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Just a thought, but do you think it might help if we all referred to what we do as a sport, rather than a hobby? The Sports Council (now Sport England) recognised model flying as a sport 30 years or so ago and it doesn't help if some of us continue to call it a hobby, - like stamp collecting or embroidery. Maybe that's how some outsiders see us.
Model flying, and certainly RC flying, has a lot of the elements of other sports, - man and machine, man versus the elements, hand and eye coordination, fast reactions, so let's not sell ourselves short.
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5 hours ago, Wilco Wingco said:
What about the FAI how long have they been in existence ??.
The FAI is the international federation responsible for all air sports. It was founded in 1905. It consists of a number of commissions, each responsible for one air sport, - gliding, parachuting, aerobatics, ballooning, model flying and so on. The commission for our sport is CIAM, the Commission Internationale d'Aeromodellisme, on which Britain is represented. Here's a link to part of their website:
https://www.fai.org/news/over-3000-model-aircraft-air-once-bmfa-centenary?type=term&id=28
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GPS trackers have been used for competition free flight aircraft for some years now. Try Googling "GPS + iCare 2" . Frederic Aberlenc's Mini Flying Neurone system weighs about 3 gms and has a 20 km range.
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On similar free-flight applications like the bunt line on F1A gliders I use a small pair of round-nosed pliers and make two crimps at 90 degrees to each other. That would be with ali. tubing of about 18 or 20swg about 5mm long.
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I have a large quantity of copies of Aeroplane Monthly dating back to the 1980s and Richard Riding's editorship that are full of fascinating articles and photos likely to appeal to any scale enthusiast. Not sure of the number but they're in a large box too heavy to lift without risking injury, hence collection only. I'm in the Croydon/Bromley area. PM me to arrange collection.
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Thanks, gents, for the suggestions. I'll certainly chase up the Magazine Exchange site.
The BMFA archive is physical rather than digital. Getting it more accessible is, along with progressing the model flying museum project, one of the things that a big Premium Bond win would accelerate (or our 30,000 members all kicking in an extra quid a year).
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Alan, we're singing from the same hymn sheet. We clearly need to get something more in BMFA News, though it's rather wasted if members don't actually read it. You can lead a horse to water... Meanwhile the quest for a good home for the Aeroplane Monthlies continues.
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The BMFA archive and library at Buckminster and at Chacksfield House is for model flying rather than material concerning manned aircraft. I've tried the National Aerospace Library at Farnborough and also FAST, also at Farnborough and well worth a visit.
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I have had passed on to me about a hundredweight of back numbers of Aeroplane Magazine, going back to the Richard Riding editorship. They are too interesting to bin and would be free to a good home. I'm in the Croydon/Bromley area, as they'd need to be collected. PM me if that sounds interesting, and they're yours.
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"We trained hard—but it seemed that every time we were beginning to form up into teams we were reorganized. I was to learn later in life that we tend to meet any new situation by reorganizing, and what a wonderful method it can be for creating the illusion of progress while actually producing confusion, inefficiency, and demoralization." Petronius, 66 AD
Still seems to apply. Just a thought!
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I totally agree. The present system is far too cumbersome and narrowly focussed. It seems almost to have been designed to prevent people from finding out what else is on offer apart from what they are originally looking for. It's a bit like the difference between ordering a book from Amazon and going to a bookshop, where you may well stumble across a title even more interesting than the one you thought you wanted in the first place.
Let's get back to the straightforward earlier system; select a month and then you have the whole range of what the BMFA and its clubs are doing, - shows, contests, seminars, fly-ins, jumble sales, AS workshops, the lot.
Something to look forward to on the telly
in Chit-chat
Posted
Nothing to do with repair programmes but well worth a watch is a programme on BBC Alba (the Gaelic language channel) called Bill agus an Spitfire. It went out on Feb. 20th at 2230 but you can catch it on I-Player. It's sub-titled and features a 90-year old brought up on South Uist who flew as a National Service pilot and later flew Rapides with BEA on the service to the Hebrides and Shetlands, landing on the beach before flying Viscounts and later wide-bodies with BA. His son finally gets him a flight in a Spitfire at Biggin Hill. The whole programme is slow-paced and laid back, without any of the contrived 'funny' bits that spoil so much TV today. In fact several of the Alba and BBC Scotland programmes are 'played straight' and don't seem to feel the need to bring in contrived bits of emotion or fake suspense. Worth keeping an eye on when you're not building.