Chris Berry

That's fair enough. Hopefully the meeting on the 14th will glean clarification. The previous requirement was ok but the latest one could be seen as worse. Time will tell

So if I read it right it now says that numbers can be inside provided no tolls or equipment is used to access the number? Therefore where does that leave us with a standard sports model like a wot4 in terms of putting the number on the inside as opposed to the outside? Or a model where there are no hatches or clear canopies or a competition scale model such as those at the nationals? Will the BMFA clarify please?

Hi Michael if you have a read of the last couple of news items on the BMFA website it should all become clear. The BMFA also sent an email to all members who have given them an email address. Also if you visit the CAA drones page of their website it explains all including the various exemptions. Edited By Chris Berry on 07/11/2019 15:26:21

Posted by Martin Harris on 06/11/2019 18:57:35: I'm quite happy to sit out the exemption period and register through my renewals while continuing to fly as normal (assuming my flying can be regarded as such!) Meanwhile I'll simply keep an eye on any developments resulting from the ongoing work the BMFA et al are doing with the CAA. The next meeting is scheduled for the 14th of this month, I believe. Couldn't have put it better myself. The 14th will hopefully glean further clarification.

Posted by Michael Adams 3 on 05/11/2019 18:42:58: As I understand it the CAA was supposed to issue a questionnaire today 05/11/2019, for us to answer & send it back to them so as they could issue a permit. where is it, are they in so much of a muddle they do not know what they are doing????? I assume you’re being sarcastic? 😀

Posted by Cuban8 on 05/11/2019 16:35:53: Posted by Chris Berry on 05/11/2019 14:36:27: Posted by Martin Harris on 05/11/2019 14:23:56: I think the Captain's point is that it is very difficult, if not impossible, to be sure you are complying with all aspects of the new legislation in all cases. I agree. The average xmas toy flyer who will fly their drone 4 times a year won't navigate their way through the clunky CAA website. They won't have even heard of the BMFA and won't want to commit to membership and clubs, they just go to smyths toys pay £50 and get a stocking filler toy drone to hover over the cat and next doors garden. The reality is that most drones owned by toy flyers are bought on xmas eve, opened on xmas day flown on boxing day and either lost, crashed or put on top of the wardrobe by New Years day. Those are the people this scheme is targeting and as we all know and have said for the last 2 years now, it will fail dramatically and everyone including the DFT knows it. Targeting the toy drones is all very well but I just wish that their aim was a hell of a lot better - must have been using a blunderbuss seeing as we've had our backsides peppered with their buckshot. BTW, I do keep a lookout on my travels and I haven't seen a drone being flown in a public place for many months - last time I think was one being flown BLOS up and down the beach last spring. Be interesting to see the sales figures for drones over Christmas and whether the signs suggest that the craze is definitely blowing itself out. I can see a situation where toy drone sales decline significantly. Hobby fliers and the likes of us will continue of course. The general consensus on the various news channel facebook pages is that drones are a problem and should be banned or heavily regulated. Of course the Gatwick issue is also referenced as being a prime reason, albeit no evidence.

Posted by Steve J on 05/11/2019 15:52:03: Posted by Chris Berry on 05/11/2019 15:26:38: Posted by Steve J on 05/11/2019 14:46:53: Posted by Chris Berry on 05/11/2019 14:36:27: Those are the people this scheme is targeting and as we all know and have said for the last 2 years now, it will fail dramatically and everyone including the DFT knows it. Not all. Not sure that anyone involved in the hobby in any meaningful way for that duration could not be aware? I was objecting to your use of the word 'all'. I disagree with all the points that you make in that sentence. So who is the scheme aimed at Steve? And if not drone fliers why wasn't the scheme introduced years ago before drones existed?

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Posted by Nigel Heather on 05/11/2019 14:41:33: Labelling aircraft. I thought that there had been a concession that Operator ID labels could be inside the aircraft. But reading the The Drone and Model Aircraft Code, it suggests that the label must be on the outside of the main body, in clear display when the aircraft is on the ground. Cheers, Nigel I'm sure I read that there had been a concession to those with scale models in particular? Maybe confirmation will be forthcoming in a few days. I think clarification/formal confirmation on the following is needed: 1 Free flight over 250g 2 Training and the use of buddy leads vs registration of beginner or flight experience at a school, scout group etc 3 Labelling of aircraft, particularly scale There may be more but that's all i can think of at the moment.

Posted by Steve J on 05/11/2019 14:46:53: Posted by Chris Berry on 05/11/2019 14:36:27: Those are the people this scheme is targeting and as we all know and have said for the last 2 years now Not all. In which case where have all the LMA, FPVUK, SAA and BMFA members been? Consultations galore for 2 years, chatter on here and other media, letters, emails and articles in magazines. Not sure that anyone involved in the hobby in any meaningful way for that duration could not be aware?

Posted by Martin Harris on 05/11/2019 14:23:56: I think the Captain's point is that it is very difficult, if not impossible, to be sure you are complying with all aspects of the new legislation in all cases. I agree. The average xmas toy flyer who will fly their drone 4 times a year won't navigate their way through the clunky CAA website. They won't have even heard of the BMFA and won't want to commit to membership and clubs, they just go to smyths toys pay £50 and get a stocking filler toy drone to hover over the cat and next doors garden. The reality is that most drones owned by toy flyers are bought on xmas eve, opened on xmas day flown on boxing day and either lost, crashed or put on top of the wardrobe by New Years day. Those are the people this scheme is targeting and as we all know and have said for the last 2 years now, it will fail dramatically and everyone including the DFT knows it.

Posted by Steve J on 05/11/2019 14:29:33: Posted by Martin Harris on 05/11/2019 13:06:01: Posted by Alan Gorham_ on 05/11/2019 12:57:55: The LMA are offering to pay the £9 fee for their current members as a one-off gesture. Perhaps they need to review their membership fees if they are awash with spare money? LMA £32/year (new member) and feel able pay the registration fee for their members. BMFA £38/year. LMA 1200 members BMFA 36000 members

LMA have about 1200 members. This whole fiasco is aimed at the xmas toy gang. Its not aimed at model flying, or even FPV/quad racing. Thats why the associations have had enough influence to get multiple exemptions, with more to come. Word has it form other forums that the CAA office is chaos today and although they are trying their best, they are way out of their depth. All publicity has been about drones and all images in the media show drones. Its not us they are targeting, its the people thinking about buying toy drones this xmas. In terms of labelling, i'm not interested in what a silly sketch cartoon image shows. Most of my planes are scale, they will have a number on them probably under the tail somewhere, but its likely to fall off with oil and airflow, so the best location will be inside the fuselage. Access can be gained by using non-specialist tools such as a screwdriver. The reality is that the police are not going to stand and check every model aircraft being flown on a site, public or not. They haven't the time or resource to do that. Imagine a lovely spring day, 30 members at a site, that's a couple of hours work at least!

It can go inside the aircraft. There is another meeting being held with the CAA in about a weeks time so I’m sure things will iron themselves out after that. BBC news a few minutes ago gave a 20 second piece in the headlines about DRES.

Indeed. I don’t class a screwdriver as a special tool, so wings off to reveal a number is easy.

It doesn’t say the number has to be outside. Edited By Chris Berry on 04/11/2019 22:44:21

Sticky label on the inside like what we used do in the olden days and many still do these days.   Bearing in mind its really aimed at xmas toy quad fliers, so has to be written as such. Edited By Chris Berry on 04/11/2019 21:49:32

Posted by Engine Doctor on 04/11/2019 20:22:56: Moki appear to still make a 50cc FS. Stuart McKay distribute them although they are expensive bits of kit . I have one . Excellent bit of engineering but a bit on the heavy side .Power is well down on an equivalent 2s though. Yep they were made by Moki but I think they have stopped making single cylinders now.

Other than Valach and Kolm there aren’t any 50cc 4 stroke petrols. I wonder if OS or Saito....or maybe Jom Harper will bring out a single 50cc?

Shame the likes of OS and Saito don't make a 50cc single

A clubmate rang me today asking for my thoughts on what engine he should put in a new plane he's getting. He wants to put a 40cc FS petrol engine in the model and asked me which one i'd recommend. That got me thinking and searching the internet. There don't seem to be many 40-60cc single cylinder FS petrol engines about. A 50cc FS single would go down a storm I reckon but we're pretty much stuck with 2S engines. Am I alone in thinking that we need a decent 50cc single cylinder four stroke petrol engine to be released?

Posted by Steve J on 02/11/2019 11:30:57: Posted by Chris Berry on 02/11/2019 11:12:06: Posted by Steve J on 02/11/2019 10:56:07: Posted by Martin_K on 02/11/2019 10:27:39: I view registration and testing as simple, and a minor issue. I would rather resources of the BMFA were focused on the major issue of exemptions from the Open Category post June 2020. +1 I've just had a read of the definitions of the EASA regs. Not sure I see an issue with the open category? Can someone point out what the concern is with it please? Potential problems for sites with public access, especially if the CAA gold plate the regulations. Discussed in the locked 'CAA Update' topic on the 8th October. Electronic conspicuity is another potential problem area. Steve Could be dealt with through exemptions. That's the way i'd go with it. It seems the CAA are sensible folks and now that Vere has been stamped on by her boss the CAA have been given a bit more freedom, probably as they wanted in the first place. Although its all to play for in coming months so who knows what will happen, as i'm sure the election in December won't be the last before June 2020.

Posted by Bob Cotsford on 02/11/2019 11:24:23: RE keeping documents on you, I'd suggest that keeping them in the glovebox of your car, ie readily accessible on-site, would be acceptable to most. It's where I've been keeping my BMFA and club membership cards and insurance for years. Is it really such a big thing? Most of us are car drivers so we should be used to keeping the relevant documents ready to hand in the car. Just add your competency to those. Yep i've been doing the same as well.

Posted by Steve J on 02/11/2019 10:56:07: Posted by Martin_K on 02/11/2019 10:27:39: I view registration and testing as simple, and a minor issue. I would rather resources of the BMFA were focused on the major issue of exemptions from the Open Category post June 2020. +1 I've just had a read of the definitions of the EASA regs. Not sure I see an issue with the open category? Can someone point out what the concern is with it please?

Posted by Andy Symons - BMFA on 02/11/2019 10:45:23: Posted by Chris Berry on 02/11/2019 09:52:43: Thanks Andy, so members will have from the 5th Nov to 31st Dec to do the quiz and register/renew. Is there any opportunity to amend the requirements for all members to keep documents on them at all? maybe at sites where there are no uninvolved persons for example. Just a thought. whilst it’s not a big deal, I know many of our members will see it as such! Edited By Chris Berry on 02/11/2019 09:54:19 Hopefully yes members will have until 31st Dec to take the test and 31st Jan to register and renew. I would suggest it's unlikely there will be a change about keeping docs on yourself, a matter of picking your battles I think as its really no big deal and perhaps copies of the exemptions etc can be kept in club huts etc. Thanks, I guess you're right. Doesn't fuss me, but I know some will be.