IDD15

Depends on what battery tech they eventually choose really. You don’t really need lithium for these big static jobs and flow battery’s like this recent site in China use quite benign and cheap chemistry. China Flow Battery comissioned HTH idd

How it started IS the issue. It should not have started, period. Regardless of motive power type. As the Liverpool fire proved you don’t need an EV to have a dangerous multi storey car park fire. Idd

If no other company does it and adopts their “standard” then my guess is that battery swapping for cars will not be viable in the future. It is by no means new this battery swapping tech either. As this gently amusing 20 minutes of EV history shows… Fully Charged - Early ev enjoy idd

Further to the recent discussion about battery swapping and its viability I was quite surprised to read this: Elektrek - NIO pass 30 Million battery swaps. It obviously works for some drivers. cheers idd

NIO battery swapping and wireless EV charging. Fully Charged - NIO Battery swap and EV Wireless charging It’s gone very quiet on the wireless charging front since this episode of FC, though Tesla have bought a company that was developing it. I think there are now 26 NIO swapping stations in Scandinavia/Northern Europe and they just commissioned a newer version that does not jack up the car. The NIO vehicles can still fast charge in the conventional sense as well as battery swap. cheers idd

New V4(?) chargers have longer cables and contactless payment for cards as well. There's a new open hub at just off the M6 at Trentham got them. All credit to Tesla, they do not hang about banging in chargers and growing the network. Could not believe they'd doubled the number of chargers at Rugby when we visited the other week. All in less than 2 years! cheers idd

So the results of a typical Sunday trip to visit relatives in a couple of separate locations oop here in the NW. Conditions were quite grotty here with heavy rain in the morning so it was lights on, AC on, wipers on etc. Fortunately it dried up a bit for us on the afternoon and early evening parts of the journey. Travel was the usual mixture of motorway, dual carriageway, 30 and 20 zones, and of course roadworks. The spray on the M6 was pretty phenomenal, I swear there was more water on Thelwall viaduct than flowing underneath it! Its all very well building 8/10 lane stretches of motorway but no one seems to taken account of the amount of spray vehicles throw up. Perhaps we should consider compulsory reduced motorway speeds in the wet like they have in Germany? Probably best we don't go there...🤪 Our 58 kWh Born never "broke sweat" really, and as you can see thinks it can do another 134 odd miles on the 50% battery remaining. However after 4 hrs driving over quite a long day I'd had enough and was more than happy to sit in front of the telly! In my 30 kWhr 1st gen Leaf of 6/7 years ago we would have had to consider charging enroute to do the same trip. Bit tricky as very few chargers then. If we had been in the 40 kWhr Leaf of 3 years ago it would have done it without charging, but probably only just given the road conditions. So a completely unremarkable journey but shows just how far modern EVs have come on in quite a short space of time. Cheers idd PS must dust the interior!

Looks like they may be here. But personally I would not be putting a deposit down on one just yet, when they’ve got a few million miles on them in the wild perhaps…😉 JAC Sodium Battery EV. Cheers idd

I think it important to call out those sections of the media who are quite literally waging an information war against EV’s. What we are seeing is literally a rerun of the FUD campaigns used to promote smoking by the oil industry. Big oil is hugely successful and is estimated to receive $6 billion worldwide in the form of government subsidies alone. Just this week old “seven bins” has pledged £500 million in subsidies/tax breaks to develop a new oil field. They’re not going to give up all that money without a fight… There are more delegates from big oil and their lobbyists at this years COP conference than there are from the countries most affected by climate change. The president of this years COP is actually the head of a gulf states oil company… When the Torygraph first announced in crowing terms in its first edition “seven bins” push back on the ban of ICE cars for another 5 years, on the same front page was a piece about how Russia and Saudia Arabia were colluding to restrict supplies of crude to push up prices… You couldn’t make it up really, needless to say that piece disappeared off the front page on subsequent editions. cheers idd

The chances of an ICE powered vehicle catching fire are I think we would all agree is pretty small. In over 40 years of driving I have only ever seen three vehicle fires. Factor in again that an EV is TWENTY times LESS likely to catch fire than an ICE vehicle then the chances of ever seeing one are tending towards unlikely. Certainly a lot less than the FUD pedlars of the dead tree press would have you believe… That factor of twenty is only going to get bigger as time goes on because EV batteries are rapidly moving towards Lithium Iron Phosphate and even Sodium based chemistries that are much less prone to thermal runaway. Over half of Teslas production (around 2 million EVs annually) already have LFP cells, and MG and other manufacturers use them in some of their vehicles. A second key driver to these new chemistries is the fact that the cells are cheaper to make, so invariably their use will become more widespread. If an EV does catch fire it can be difficult to extinguish, no two ways about it. However methods and equipment is being developed all the time by the emergency services to help tackle these events. Examples include vehicle sized fire blankets to portable water tanks with closed re circulation systems. As someone who has been trained to fight fires by the RN and Merseyside Fire Brigade (with and without breathing apparatus) my advice to anyone regardless of the type or nature of the fire is just get well away from it and the smoke. All fires are toxic. cheers idd

Just back from our EV tour of Bucks, Kent and Oxfordshire. Around 800 miles covered with the longest legs being out(150m) and back(163m) and the Born never missed a beat. On those longer journeys the car averaged 4.6m/kWh at motorway speeds so easily 240 to 260 mile range if pushed. I know we can all get a bit hung up on EV range, but the longest journeys in terms of time/distance covered where the two trips around the M25. My first time on it in over ten years, hated it then and loath it now! I pity the poor souls using it every day. Rapid charged once on the way down when we stopped for a comfort break at Moto Rugby. Did not need to but old 30kWh Leaf habits die hard and half the chargers were not being used mid morning! Second time was at a pub near Hastings for an evening meal on our way back from visiting Rye and Dungeness. The pub had three new rapid 75kW chargers all of which were available on arrival. Rest of the time we used the fast chargers at the properties we stayed at to charge overnight, dead easy and no stress. A bit of planning beforehand using Zap Map to find accommodation with chargers makes EV touring no different to when we had an ICE car. First ever visit to Kent and really liked it, especially the frequent flypasts over our holiday cottage of Spitfires and Tiger Moths which I'm guessing were doing air experience flights from Biggin Hill(?). idd

TBH I knew when I typed that I was perhaps oversimplifying things! However, given most EV drivers will be charging at periods of low demand, on different days and have different use cases then the “diversity factor” is probably still applicable/valid. Also we now have effectively smarter chargers as well to help things out I don’t think we will see many cases of street cables acting like a fuse. I have read of the odd instance on EV forums where people have had a few issues installing an EV charger due to their home supply, but fortunately it does seem rare. cheers idd

You may find the following video allays your fears somewhat re our electricity grid melting down. Given the video is 2 years old and further capacity (wind, solar and interconnectors) has come online since then I think you will agree the numbers are moving in the right direction. JW's delivery is perhaps a bit dry but is I think thorough and well balanced. JW - EV Meltdown? I have not seen any evidence of where underground cabling cannot cope with more than three cars being fast charged on a street. A fast charger pulls less power than a domestic electric shower, so equally I've not seen any instances of people being banned from buying or using showers for this reason. The charger cannot pull any more power that what the house main fuse allows, so if the DNO has decreed that 100 houses in a street can pull a maximum 60A then their cabling will be rated for that load. In addition it must be remembered that EV drivers generally do (and will) charge overnight because they are financially incentivised to do so with off peak rates. It is also the case that in the last couple of years new home chargers have additional protection in the form of randomised start times, and the ability to throttle the charge if the domestic load is approaching the home main fuse capacity. The charging infrastructure has been developing at some considerable pace, yes there can be some queuing at busy times at particular chargers. The most famously reported where those at Tebay on the M6. However as is often the case the media never went back a few months later to report that Tesla had effectively more than doubled the capacity and throughput of the chargers there. C'est la vie... Dave takes it on - Tebay Update Balancing the charging infrastructure growth with that of EV uptake is always going to be tricky and I fear this government u-turn will slow that growth. Ironically the largest charging facility in the UK has just opened this past week. NEC Hub >As stated at the start, they are vulnerable. Any power cut, for whatever reason, leaves the car devoid of power. Unless a driver has been particularly stupid and got home with 0% to find there is a power cut, then an EV is NOT devoid of power. In my own particular case I always ensure there is a minimum of 30% in the battery in case I have to make a dash to support an elderly relative. It is interesting to note that one of the big selling points to buyers in the US of the Ford F150 Lightning truck is the fact that it can happily run a home for a considerable time as their domestic electricity grids are not as robust. HTH Idd

The Rowan Atkinson opinion piece has been widely debunked and has had at least three “official” amends since published. This is particularly in response to using a single report on EV emissions that had not proven accurate and wildly inaccurate claims about the life of lithium cells. No mention of their use in secondary systems for grid storage etc. This is a shame as he does make a very good point about “fast fashion”, 3 year leases and consumerism in relation to car sales. But this part of the argument has been overlooked in all the controversy. Whereabouts did you read about the energy bill? idd

Thanks for taking the time for such a comprehensive reply. Much appreciated. I need to be a bit careful about adding more Solar as I strongly suspect Eon who are my FIT “supplier” may use it to say I have to give up my existing contract which I do not want to do. It’s one of the reasons I decided to buy into the Ripple scheme. So I may end up taking the VAT hit. Anyway we’ll see… Thx again idd

Hi Matty Can I ask whose home storage battery you went for? Having now got a Zappi charger my intention had been to go for a Libbi on the basis of one app to rule them all.. Thx idd

An alternative to roof top solar that may be of interest to some people here would be to purchase shares in the Ripple Energy co-operatives for solar and wind farms. Further details can be found here: Ripple Energy My declaration of interest is that I am already a member of the Ripple Energy Kirk Hill wind farm and solar farm co-operatives. The wind farm is currently being built and so I have received no payments at this time on my initial investments. That is all set to change hopefully early in 2024! Obviously I absolutely can't advise whether this is a good investment or thing to do for anybody. The important thing any person thinking of investing must do is read and understand the Ripple share offer documents and FAQ's. Hope this helps idd

This point is really important and is what can make people reluctant to take some form of action. The flawed government initiative for us all to buy diesel cars only to be told later that perhaps it wasn't a good idea inevitably reinforces this view. This situation is also compounded by the fact that the oil industry is not going to give up without a fight. Last year the G20 countries subsidised the oil industry to the tune of $6 Trillion dollars, that buys you a lot of influence and one serious FUD campaign. Fossil Fuel Subsidies This "anti green agenda" has been very successful, they've even managed to hijack the COP Climate conferences courtesy of their lobby groups! On the positive side @Cuban8 will not have to worry about any initiatives or scientists telling him what to do from that conference later this year... 😃 When I was getting solar panels fitted at the end of 2012 I was reading anti solar stuff that suggested my panels would need replacing in 10 years. 26.84 MWh of generation later I don't think so... But quite how do we get through all this FUD and make the right decisions?

I beg to differ! 😃 You need to take into account the displacement and efficiency effects in your calculations. If we are generous and assume an ICE car is half as efficient as an EV then clearly twice as much fuel is required to go the same distance. As you progress back up the supply chain the inefficiencies at each stage (transport distribution, storage, refining, shipping, storage, dewatering, well pumping) progressively get larger with a knock on increase in emissions. So by removing the need to use fuel in the first place, effectively displacing it you can have a much larger effect than the straight one for one replacement you suggest. I must apologise but I can’t find the study that explained this much better than I can, but fundamentally if you replace fossil fuels you need much less renewables than you would think. There are also benefits to be had in terms of health which are not insignificant. You’re quite right of course the sheer scale of what we face is enormous but for some of us sitting and waiting for some future unproven technology is not an option. However, I promise not to glue myself to a road… 😀 idd

Hah! Good one.😃 about the same as those hydrogen pumps then!🙃

In 2016 there were about 40,000 EVs on the road, you had a choice of Tesla S, Tesla X, Nissan Leaf and Renault Zoe. The charging infrastructure was to say the least sparse, with just 150 rapid charging stations which if you were lucky might give you a 50kW charge rate. If you wanted to drive a hydrogen vehicle things were not much better with only the Toyota Mirai saloon and 9 hydrogen filling stations available across the UK. Fast forward to 2023 and there are 839678 EVs on the road with a choice of 224 models (battery sizes etc) across nearly every manufacturer. This fleet is now serviced by 45737 devices across 26,000 locations. Approx 9000 of these chargers are rapid and ultra rapid with some of these chargers now capable of delivering 350kW. In addition it is is estimated that there are over 400,000 domestic fast chargers installed. In addition to EVs there are also 520,000 plug in hybrids on the road. So that's over 1.3 million vehicles kicking a big hole in their emissions and oil company profits. In 2023 on the hydrogen front you can now choose between the Mirai and Hyundai NEXO and fill them up at possibly/maybe 15 filling stations. Had read some had closed or were non operational. I think that the EV fantasy is a lot more rooted in reality than the hydrogen fantasy. In reality I think our fantasies will meet in the middle at some point. Hydrogen will most likely have a role to play but I see very little evidence of progress save for a few commuter trains in Germany. Meanwhile humanity managed to deforest an area the size of Switzerland in 2022 and, in 2023 forest fires in Canada have already destroyed an area the size of England. I think it is high time to "stop poking the bear" by using the atmosphere as an open sewer for all our sakes. idd

Oh I don't know. In June this year the SMMT reported that sales were 117,266 vehicles. EV sales were 31700 (There were barely 40,000 EVs in total when I started driving one in 2016) units with a market share of 17.9%. When compared to the same month last year EV sales have grown 39.4%. Significantly the various flavours of hybrid vehicle also performed strongly, so much so that around 100,000 of those vehicles sold use electrons to help propel them to varying degrees . More detailed figures can be found on the SMMT website. Significant things can happen when people start exerting their wallets... idd

Secondhand market is now starting to develop, from little acorns etc... SMMT SH Market Report There be bargains to be had as well... EVM 5K Challenge All good news and should hopefully expand ev ownership. idd

Interesting update video on this project, it’s engineering and subsequent developments. Electric Aircraft update Cheers idd

Not just socks either, there’ll be lots BIC biros in there as well! 🙄 idd