jeffrey cottrell

Stephen Jones Hi Steve, PM sent Jeff

Hi Kim Interesting. Had a look at those LiPo's you are using and, if HK dimensions are accurate, yours are even longer than mine, 129mm against 123mm. Anyway, no matter. While I was putting the model together I though of a number of areas I would like to change more to my liking. Eventually decided there was no point changing anything until I was sure the model would fly, and I would like it. So, jury still out till the maiden. Cheers Jeff

Hi Guys, thanks for the quick replies. Capt. Kremen You bought an airframe only, then fitted it out with top of the range gear. In your opinion, is the basic airframe good enough to warrant that expense? I know, having wasted so much on the Ruckus, that I decided to go with the supplied gear as much as possible. Disappointed too in the battery holder. I have loads of Turnigy 2200 packs, but they are all puffed slightly. Turnigy's do that but still work ok. However, any puffing at all and the battery bay is too shallow for them to fit. I had hoped to use some 3000 packs instead, but they only just fit in the bay, leaving no room for the wires. Assuming it flies ok, a re-think might be in order. I know the c/g is adjusted to taste, but I wanted to start at a conservative position for the first flights, just to get a feel for the model. Pulled the nose weight out at first, but that gave me a c/g of 95mm. Re-fitted it but that only took it back to 90mm, which is the rearward limit according to the manual. Eventually I'm sure I will take that weight back out again but wanted it docile for the first few flights. One thing did intrigue me You mentioned replacing the metal snakes. Did you replace the outers as well? If so, how did you get them out? Couldn't see how to do that without major surgery. Jury still out on HK c/g machine, only just got it. Does the job, I suppose. Kim Good to know it will fly with a rearward c/g. I think I'll end up there as well, but I wanted it conservative for the first flights. So, you got the overlong pushrods as well. Century reckon about 1 in 100 come with the long rods, so that makes 198 satisfied customers and us two. Ho hum. At least you got the conversion bits in the box, I had to find my own. Leads me to wonder. Obviously Century can't measure each pushrod in each kit, so should they have added the extra bits to all their kits. I missed out on that. Did the wing bolts up until they were just starting to crush the foam, but didn't seem very tight to me, so I added a bit of Loctite as an insurance policy. We'll see how that goes. You may well be right about the rotating bits on the balancer being to acommodate dihedral, but I can see a situation where you catch those arms while putting the model on, one of them rotates and the upright bit goes through the wing. If it can possibly happen, it'll happen to me. Jeff

Hi Guys Well, looks like the Riot is as ready as it will ever be for its maiden. Hope it flies better than it goes together. Pushrods are still stiffer than I'd like, but the surfaces centre ok, so I'm going with it in case they free up in use. Also wing bolts don't really do up tight before starting to crush the foam. What do you all do? Meanwhile couple of other thoughts. No-one came back with their opinions on c/g position. I have now got one of those c/g balancers from HK, and can confirm that the balance is 95mm back from the LE. Currently re-fitting the steel weight in the nose. Mistake to take it out in the first place. Also, I believe the issue with the previous Ruckus was a combination of c/g position and very light wing loading. I worked it out to be less than 15 oz/sq ft. Just done the same calculation for the Riot, and its even less, about 13 oz/sq ft. I have the all up weight as 3lb 7oz. Does than sound about right? Anyway, re-fitted the nose weight and the model now balances slightly nose down, but at 90mm. That's the rearward limit according to the manual. Done fiddling with this. It either flies that way or it doesn't. We'll see Jeff P.S. Anyone using those HK c/g balancers? Under the balance pads there are two grub screws. Can't fathom out their purpose, apart from maybe stopping the pads from lifting off upwards. That's not likely to happen.Also why have they made the measuring arms rotate in the horizontal plane, rather than just the vertical. Must be a reason, Am I missing something? J

Hi Denis Think you deserve the points, even though it was known a 'Wings of the Apache' over here. Well done Jeff

Hi Engine Doctor Good thoughts all, but it's never that easy, is it? Model in question is a moulded foamie. I would assume the pushrods were fitted at the moulding stage. Outers are firmly bonded to the fuz, and the inners have a 'z' bend at the servo end so can't be slid out. Only idea is to dremel the 'z' bends off, slide the rod out then use some other form of connector at the servo end. I have a packet of those barrel connectors with the grub screws. Ideal for this, says I. So, cut the bend off the elevator rod.That looked straight enough, so the issue must be in the outers. Polished with a bit of fine emery and a spray of silicon lubricant. Also spoke to Century who came up with a couple of other ideas. Did all that, seemed a little better but not ideal. Now come to fitting the new connectors. What I hadn't noticed was that the pushrods exit the fuz below the level of the servo arms. No issue with the z bends, but can't use those barrels because the locking grubscrew would be on the bottom, no access. Finally, figured a way round that one, connected it all up. Although I'm still not happy with it, looked to centre ok, so prepared to fly that way, see if it will loosen up with use. Anyway, decided to set the rudder up as is, z bends an' all, just to see how well it centred. If it was ok, might hold my nose and fly it as is. Never got that far. With it all rigged up, couldn't get the clevis screwed on anywhere near enough. The full length of the thread, and on to the smooth bit still wouldn't line up. So, back on the phone to Century. Oh yes, says he, about every hundred kits does come with overlong pushrods. Why me, why me? So, back out with the dremel, cut that z bend off as well. At least I know how to fit the upside down connectors now. Here we are now, almost ready for test flight. Touch and go whether it flies at the field or into the trash can. Long been a tradition with me that if any kit is wrongly put together, missing bits or just plain bad, it will find its way on to my bench sometime, but this is an artf for pete's sake. Really shouldn't need all this fettling just to get it to an almost flyable state.Just need to sort out the rats nest of wiring under the wing, then 'see if the damn thing will fly'. Pop quiz. That line came from a helicopter movie that was so bad it was almost good. Starred Nicholas Cage, Sean Young and Tommy Lee Jones./ Bonus points for anyone who can give me the title. Meanwhile, for all you successful Rioters, what c/g are you flying at? I pulled the steel weight out of mine, but I might have been premature. With both the 3000 pack and the 2200 one the c/g comes out at the rearward limit of 90mm. Would this be ok, or should I put the weight back in? Jeff

Hi Guys Thanks for all the quick replies, and the pretty positive reviews. Certainly seems to be a better bet than the Ruckius, but then again, anything would be. Anyway, here's the state of play, and another issue I could use some advice on. So, changing the u/c axles for ht ones is a no brainer. Bent both on the Ruckus and replaced with ht, so just pinched the bolts for the Riot. After all, the Ruckus won't need them any more, will it? Not sure how the motor mount bolts got mis-positioned. Only one bolt hole was drilled, the others were just marked. After a bit of lateral thinking and harsh language managed to get new holes marked up and drilled, and more by luck than judgement, the motor shaft came out dead centre of the cowl. I know you can't see any difference when it's 200' up in the air, but I'm anal like that. I have a small moulded box with a couple of holes in the ply at the bottom. Is that what's supposed to be the receiver box? If so, no way will I get my receiver in there. I'm thinking to epoxy a small piece of ply to the fuz side then attach the rx with double sided tape. Now to the issue. Both the elevator and rudder pushrods are stiff to move. Checked on my wrecked Ruckus and although the elevator rod is a little stiff, the rudder is very free moving, and neither is as bad as the Riot ones. So, what to do. Been moving them back and forth, to see if they free up a little, but no sign so far. The Elevator one seems a little freer if you hold it away from the fuz, which suggests it might have a bend in it. Could try running a little oil down the inside, but not sure I'll ever be happy with it as is. My thinking at the moment is to take both pushrods out. This will mean cutting off the 'z' bends, but I'm sure I have some of those screw on connectors around somewhere, and they would make a good alternative. Perhaps someone else has an idea that is less 'surgical' Over to you guys Jeff

Hi Guys Seem to be an awful lot of Riots about, but the last entry on the official Riot thread on here was back in 2017, so thought I'd start a new one with some thoughts and questions on the V2 version. First, bit of a back story. Recently moved to a new area, so I don't have anywhere to build yet. Looking round for an artf I decided on a Max Thrust Ruckus. Heard good reports about the model, but tbh I was never comfortable with mine. Only got 4 flights with it before I cartwheeled it into long grass and broke the fuz. Not keen on spending more on a new fuz for a model I didn't really like, but the electrics were still working fine so I decided on a Riot airframe I could transfer them into. So, initial thoughts. Fuz does look more substantial, thicker foam etc, so that's good news but does leave less room inside for the gear. I did read a comment that the battery bay was too small, and required foam to be cut away even to install a 2200 3s. Seems like Century were listening because the bay is now far longer. Have to say it's a little shallow to hold a 2200 if it's even a bit puffed, but it will take a 3000 flat pack without any issues. Also incorporates a velcro strap to hold the LiPo in place rather than rely on the plastic hatch clips. All good news in my book. Still has the steel weights in the nose, but they do look easier to remove than the ones in the Ruckus. That's the good, now the bad. The wing servos were a tight fit in the ply plates. Got them in eventually, but I hope I didn't damage the output wires when I forced them in. Working fine on the bench so fsr, so I may have dodged a bullet there. The wires for the tip lights now terminate in some tiny XT plugs, rather than the servo plugs on the Ruckus. Apparently the aircraft used to be supplied with a small circuit board which these plugs and the aileron servos plugged into. Talking to Century, they found so many owners were plugging in to this board incorrectly that they discontinued it. Going to change these plugs for servo ones which plug directly into the receiver. Probably more reliable that way, but a pita if I need to take the wing off for any reason. No real biggy. More of an issue is the motor mount. The Riot and the Ruckus share the same motor, so should be a straight swop. Trouble is the holes marked in the ply mounting plate do not match those in the motor mount. Simple enough to mark and drill new ones, but I have to find a way to mark them such that the motor shaft comes out central to the cowl.Wouldn't look to good any other way. Need to get the brainbox to work on that one. Ho hum. The instructions say there is a moulded recess in the underwing compartment to hold the receiver. Can't see this one anywhere. Anyone flying a Riot, where are you mounting your rx? Finally, instructions recommend movement on ailerons and elevator of 10mm each way. On the Ruckus it said 15mm, but even this was not enough for a good performance. Anyone flying a Riot, is this movement sufficient or should I raise it? Your thoughts? Jeff

Hi Bruce Thanks for your thoughts, but: Agreed Leeds do have the Waot 4 kits in stock, but my question was regarding the ARTF versions, specifically the smaller 43" built up one. These are distributed by Ripmax, who seem to be having an issue fulfilling orders at the moment. If you happen to know of a shop that has that specific one in stock, I'm all ears. The reference to the Crescent Bullet was in answer to a post from Old Geezer, who suggested Pegasus Models as a possible source of an alternative to the Wot 4. In the post he mentioned the Galaxy Wasp model as being similar to the old Gangster. I mentioned the Bullit as being also Gangster'ish, but a lot prettier imho. That's where it came from. Jeff

Hi Guys, thanks Leccyflyer Started off with four bands and never had a problem until recently. Model can't be more than a year old. Having found a source of cheap bands I have now gone to six and will stay that way. Guess I needed to know how often they should be replaced, or if there were any early signs that they were reaching the end of their life. Bought a big bag of bands off e-bay, so I could replace them every year as a precaution. I don't leave the model assembled and the bands under tension, and it is stored in a shed so exposure to UV is only when it is out flying. Don't think that's too much of a risk. Bob This one's electric, so no fuel contamination. Glad to hear the brown bands last longer. Good news to my wallet. JD8 Not sure where you got the idea I only used 2 bands. It's always been a minimum of 4, and now I'll use 6. fly boy3 I have found a source of brown bands on e-bay, but these are 10mm wide, so much the same as SLEC ones. Cheers Jeff

Hi David Interesting story, Puts me in mind of something that happened to me a while back, and also begs a question. So, I'm out flying my Limbo Dancer. Normally a well behaved model and fun to chuck around. This flight seemed a little imprecise in the manouevers and had the annoying habit, after a loop, of adding another tight uncommanded loop. Anyway, landed pretty quickly. Mulling over what could be wrong when my mind was made up for me. I spotted that one of the wing bands had actually split and was lying under the model. So, problem solved, but led me to wonder just how long wing bands are supposed to last. I used white SLEC bands and never left the model assembled and the bands under tension. Now replaced the bands with some brown ones, and using 6 instead of 4 and the model is back to its normal good flying. However I am concerned that the bands might have let loose in flight with predictably unpleasant results, so how do I know when the bands need replacing? Over to you experts Jeff

Hi Old Geezer Thanks for the idea of Pegasus. They certainly do have quite a range, but nothing really floated my boat. especially when you look at how many they actually have in stock. Did phone them to clarify something, and ended up having a long chat with a very helpful guy. He had a different take on why Ripmax has no stock. Sounded plausible to me. Anyway, no help to me, guess I'll have to hold my nose and get a Riot. Ho hum. Being a 'glass half full' kind of guy I did see one advantage. The Riot shares most parts with the Ruckus, which means I can buy one, airframe only, and transfer the gear from that rubbish Ruckus lying dead in my shed. CenturyUK have an E-Bay site, so they can do me the airframe post free. Turns a £159 mistake into a 'mere' £100 one. That's my excuse anyway. Meanwhile, had a look at the Wasp. see your point, definitely Gangster'ish. Instead, wonder if you might have looked at one of these: https://www.probuild-uk.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=5130&search=bullet So much prettier, imho. Certainly when I get a build area sorted, a Mini Kosmo is going on the list: https://www.pegasusmodels.co.uk/product.asp?type=&maingp=RC+Aircraft&prodid=1011705#.XWAytXt7mzc That's a real model. Jeff

Hi Old Geezer Certainly been a while since we spoke. Great to hear from you again. Agree with what you are saying. If all things were equal, the full size Wotty would be my choice, probably built from a kit. However all things are not equal (are the ever?). First of all, I am recently retired so money is not as free as it used to be. Makes no sense to make the sizeable investment in a 4s set up, and leave brand new equipment in the shed gathering dust. Also I have recently downsized, so storage space and build area are at a premium. Mind you the whole discussion might be academic anyway. As I understand it, Ripmax have recently moved their warehouse and ran down their stocks prior to the move. Might be a while before any of the artf's are available. One shop is quoting March 2020. Don't want to wait until winter is almost over before I buy a winter hack. Ho hum. My next post might be to ask if anyone can suggest an alternative, similar size and layout, that might be more available We'll see Jeff