Richard Elliot Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 I've been pondering the design of a new autogyro for a littlewhile. Not to give too much away just yet but one of the aspects of it is a V tail....only because I haven't seen another one so equipped. I was discussing this with Rich Harris and he wasn't sure if it would work either as he did test fly a v tailed pusher design for some one and that didnt work out well apparently. Anyway...mine was to be a tractor not a pusher so I decided to convert my Super 60 autogyro to a V tail and try it. No point designing a new model if it aint going to fly!! Before After Well the results are encouraging. It actually flies well although you have to be a little busier keeping the tail in line. So its onward (slowly) with the new V tail design!! Cheers Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Harris Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 Rich, I like it ! it must be the extra distance from the prop that makes it more stable? Do you think making the vee more accute would improve yaw stability? Also, if it works that way around there is no reason why you couldn't invert the Vee! add a couple of tail wheels to each tip perhaps??? Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Wright 2 Posted October 8, 2013 Share Posted October 8, 2013 Rich E As I am sure you know it should be perfectly possible to fly a well set up model without a tail ,so I think Rich's suggestion to use an inverted tail could work but maybe with smaller area and a with steeper angle to improve directional stability and control , it would certainly look different ,but I hope when your experiments are done the original tail goes back on to keep some of the Super 60 character intact . By the way I forgot to congratulate you on flying my CFL so well at Winterton .....when you were handed the mode one TX . Tom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Elliot Posted October 8, 2013 Author Share Posted October 8, 2013 Thanks Fellas I'd already made the angle more acute than the calculations suggested to give me a bit of yaw insurance...as for inverting the V , I could always go for the full X tail!!......but that would spoil the lines of the new design. Tom, as for flying your crane fly on your caggy handed TX....that just proves how forgiving it is....I wondered why the elevator had a ratchet!!, and yes the Super 60 will eventually go back to the proper profile Cheers Rich Edited By Richard Elliot on 08/10/2013 00:35:15 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Nash Posted October 8, 2013 Share Posted October 8, 2013 Very nice Rich. I remember when Rich H tested a V tail pusher design in Holland. We had some fun trying to get her to fly. Having a proven design (sorry mate can't remember its name, Super 60 Gyro?) and only changing the tail will give an understanding how much of the model flying characteristic has been changed. Good idea you have. So how does it fly, and any video? Regards Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Elliot Posted October 9, 2013 Author Share Posted October 9, 2013 Hi Andy It flies very well, rudders still give good authority and a really tight flat turn if required, just requires yaw correction a bit more often than with the conventional setup, but thats what your thumb's for afterall. No video as yet but I will see if I can tempt the camera man upto the field at the weekend . Cheers Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Elliot Posted October 21, 2013 Author Share Posted October 21, 2013 Having read Daves excellent article in the RCM&E about 3 axis gyros, I wondered if one of these would calm the wondering yaw tendancy that I have with the V tail. Well the upshot is that yes it works brilliantly, the model now having a very "planted" feel in the yaw sense. Thanks for the idea Dave Cheers Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Nash Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 I like this idea Rich. I know very little about these. Please tell me how you setup the device. With a standard autogyro rather than a 'V' tail, how would it respond to the 'right hand turn' problems we have, do you think it would help on the head or is it just rudder control? Regards Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Elliot Posted October 21, 2013 Author Share Posted October 21, 2013 Andy its just a double male servo lead input from your RX and then servo plugs in the outlet. There is a battery port but it works without one plugged in!! Unfortunatly they come without any paperwork although there are some basic instructions online There is also an AUX input so you can turn it off and on from the tranny....I used my undercarriage switch. You adjust the gain on a pot....I guessed a setting and it seems about right. I will see if it will work with the mix I use for DC head control on my DX7....you can select V tail or Delta aircraft types although I left it on normal as my V tail only does the rudder. If it works OK on the head mix I will test fly that aspect on the Super 60. Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big T Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Andy I have used these on a few models as we have a particular problem with rollover turbulence tending to throw models about on landing. They smooth the flight out very well including maintaining height and are marvelous for keeping the tracking straight on takeoff when put on the rudder on a taildragger or nose wheel. Just set the direction and open the throttle and the gyro keeps the heading. However like a heli gyro the pilot's input overides the gyro. As Rich says the later one is switchable on/off which is very usefull if you overdo the gain as you will have a very "stiff" model. As far as the Orange one is concerned it has 2 aileron, 1 rudder, 1 elevator channel. I think it would work on the Panther style head control but dont think it could cope with the RPG type. The other thing that springs to mind is that to keep the model level it would try to pull back stick in (up elevator)!! Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Elliot Posted October 22, 2013 Author Share Posted October 22, 2013 Andy/Tim Yesterday i tried to get this to work correctly with my DC head mix. Unfortunatly , despite trying every combination of everything i could think of , I couldn't make it work correctly on a DC head. That included trying delta wing, v tail and DC head custom mix(kindly programmed in for me by Chas). Not saying it can't be done but it wasn't my intention to have it fully invasive on my Autogyros anyway. To do so would, for me, take away the character of how they fly........wouldn't want to make it too easy now would we?? Cheers all Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Nash Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 Thanks for trying Rich. Yes Tim the Panther head is standard left-right/up-down and the RPG is mixing, but it looks like Rich and Chas could not get it to work. I have not seen Chas for some time, hope he is keeping well. Regards Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big T Posted October 22, 2013 Share Posted October 22, 2013 Andy/Rich I think the answer would be a KK2.0 flight controller set in heli or flying wing mode mode **LINK**. Dead simple to set up via the on board LCD screen. Rich H has one of mine if you want to try it. Tim PS Rich re the Sycamore, I have made a start this week and I have the basic chassis built. Sorry for the delay but I have had a mountain of domestic and business (expletive deleted) to deal with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Elliot Posted October 22, 2013 Author Share Posted October 22, 2013 No worries Tim...I'm looking forward to seeing how it comes out. Any pictures ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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