ceejay Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 Hi All I have for some time now been looking into the poss of building something to compliment the Flying Flea,s, Luton Minor and English Electric wren that certain mates of mine are well into, the criteria was that it had to be from the same period, 1930,s and a little quirky, so another resident in past years was this fine beast, this will be my first ever scratch build, to this end this morning i got up bright and early to go to a recent friend and fellow indoor flying club members house, who had arranged for me to accompany him to meet a true gent/raconteur and generally a great bloke Richard Granger (yes the same name as the plane above) who is the son of one of the Granger brothers who built this machine in 1930, and incidentally the current custodian of it, whilst it is being restored by him back to flying condition where upon it will return to Old warden. this was an experience of epic proportions it turned out, as we pulled up outside a simple modern bungalow, said hi ti Richard and wife Ula he asked me through to his garage/workshop, my mouth fell open and is still stuck in a stupid grin, i had walked into heaven, on the right on its trolly the Archaeopteryx fus, up with the door and out to the sunshine, this is finished engine rebuilt all metal work replaced/refurbed and waiting for the wings work on the wings is currently underway, woodwork all but done. the all moving wing tip control surfaces are done and awaiting some engineering for the pivots and covering Oh! and the car its leaning on a 1910 Stanley Steamer in full working order and ready to drive in 20 mins from lighting the boiler what a morning Oh! and he has all the drgs measurements for the Archaeopteryx, well why wouldn't he!! some fantastic photo,s and one for the flying flea lovers, a photo of Monsuir Minet sat in the Archaeopteryx,s cockpit circa 1930/31. any hoo too long a story short version is i will shortly have some drgs and files to investigate the procces of building one of these fine machines.........in half scale of course wotcha recon mad or what!! chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Bennett Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 not mad but inspired. do it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted March 16, 2014 Share Posted March 16, 2014 As long as you can eliminate any slop in the control pivots to prevent flutter I think it will be an inspired choice. Unique just doesn't cover it! Edited By Bob Cotsford on 16/03/2014 08:24:27 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceejay Posted March 16, 2014 Author Share Posted March 16, 2014 well not only does the man have all the info you could ever need for this, he also has all the info/drgs etc for another aircraft his father and uncle had a hand in called a Linnet, as far as he knows there has never been a model built of it and again there was only ever the one full size. the Archaeopteryx history is fascinating, both his father and uncle flew it regularly for 5 years, until both were told to stop it and be sensible by their future wives.... women EH!!! chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flying Flea Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 Hello ceejay, Any chance of you posting a copy of the Henri Mignet photo, I'd love to see that. I've always liked flying wing designs and I am really looking forward to following your project. Is the info on the Archaeopteryx freely available? Thanks, Kieran. Edited By Flying Flea on 17/03/2014 12:38:03 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceejay Posted March 17, 2014 Author Share Posted March 17, 2014 As yet i dont have a copy of the photo, i assume the info can be made available. i am off to see the owner of it all again pretty soon so i will ask all the right questions, chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Banner Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 What a fantastic day that must have been Chris. I love the look of that plane, very unusual isn't it. I was looking at the 1/4 scale plan that is available through RCM&E just the other day actually. There was a feature on it in the January 2011 edition of the magazine. I think the plan is REF: RC2080 if you fancy looking it up. That said, if you have original drawings to refer to, why would you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceejay Posted March 17, 2014 Author Share Posted March 17, 2014 so a few sizes and scribbles done today to start the ball rolling, span....................................164.5 inch length...................................89inch wing chord at root .............40 inch wing chord at controller .....19inch (i found the edit button) today i have started by printing out the root rib and wing tip rib outlines (this is the rib at the point where the wing stops and the controller starts) i will do this for all 10 ribs and 9 riblets then the same for the controller ribs, all this information is from copies of the handwritten notes made by the granger brothers for the original, Richard has kindly scanned them for me and i can transpose all the figures onto paper to get the components such as the main spar, the ribs have been converted to DXF files for me by Trevor this is the club mate who introduced me to Richard, i have also saved them as simple drg files.( if i want to i can now laser cut the profiles,) but i,m going to build the ribs as near to the original was as poss, i dont have any weight calculations as yet but i intend to build it as light as poss, ot was built as an ultra light after all, and with 102 square ft of wing area, thats all for now, i have just heard the Eastenders theme...so that means its shed time !!! chris Edited By ceejay on 17/03/2014 20:23:05 Edited By ceejay on 17/03/2014 20:24:23 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceejay Posted March 17, 2014 Author Share Posted March 17, 2014 oops got the wrong bits of info at the beginning of post, just how do i edit my posts. right at half scale the model will be span ..........................164.5 inch wing chord at root......40 inch wing chord at tip.........19 inch fus length.....................89 inch there thats betterer chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reg shaw Posted March 17, 2014 Share Posted March 17, 2014 I was just halfway through a post to question those first dimensions!!!! Ian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceejay Posted March 17, 2014 Author Share Posted March 17, 2014 i get confused with these electikery things i needed me pen and paper, i have been to B and Q to purchase my drg paper, (1000 grade lining paper!!) so tomorrows lunchtime is sorted, i have a load of measurements for the main spars so i can draw it out full size (well half size) to see what wood dimensions i need, chris Edited By ceejay on 17/03/2014 20:25:57 Edited By ceejay on 17/03/2014 20:29:10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceejay Posted March 18, 2014 Author Share Posted March 18, 2014 by ekk this drawing lark makes me brain cell hurt!! today i have been mostly rubbing out!! but i finally have some lines an a bit of paper that resemble a wing outline, hmmm, i will endeavor to take some pics soon, note to self,,,charge up camera..., you dont half need a big bit o wood for a drawing board, 8x4 plywood served the purpose !! chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Hooper Posted March 18, 2014 Share Posted March 18, 2014 Posted by ceejay on 18/03/2014 17:54:33: by ekk this drawing lark makes me brain cell hurt!! It takes your brain to all sorts of new places, doesn't it? tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ton van Munsteren Posted March 18, 2014 Share Posted March 18, 2014 Chris, Great chioce I helped Dick van Mourik with his drawing for the model to put up for publication in RCME the plan earlier mentioned and must admit Dick did a great job. Here is a pic of his model for motivation; Here some more pics ; Archaeopteryx And two more models build from his plan ; buildblog Keep up the good work and looking forward to this build it really is one special plane. Cheers Ton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceejay Posted March 18, 2014 Author Share Posted March 18, 2014 Well thanks for that Ton having just read through the build blog on the ;ink you sent i have to say i was quite alarmed when they said it was difficult to loop it, Pardon!! it was never meant to loop, i have the original balance point and centre of pressure point, and i have just had a good read of the specifications and weights, it should be the same place for both, the take off description of the full size one needed no up to be held in, if it was the drag it produced stopped it achieving flying speed,!! i suspect the balance point may be to far forward on their model but it seems to fly fine, the balance point on the full size is quite critical i,m told, with a range of only 2" (52mm) this was checked for different pilots and ballast added or subtracted to suit, there is a little hatch at rear of fus for this very thing, i am quite excited by this project, not only for the subject, but as my first scratch build its a totally new learning curve and quite a challenge, and at half size should "i hope" fly exactly as the full size chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceejay Posted March 23, 2014 Author Share Posted March 23, 2014 well things are progressing allbeit slowly at present, basic wing plan is drawn as are all the wing rib profiles, need to finish the wingtip control surface drgs now, and plot the wing rib shapes, the reason for the slowness is that this is my first experience of drawing my own plans so i am learning as i go and doing a lot of mistake making and erasing!! but progress is being made, i have also just acquired a set of 1/4 scale drgs for reference as talking to the owner of the real plane he tells me they were drawn from info he supplied to Dick Van Mouren, Incidentally i have just been told that there is a 1/4 scale one in the classifieds so orf i went for a shuftie, and too right there is, BUT i have to correct the info, the Blue scheme is not the original its the one OW painted it in 1975, the green you see in my oics here is the original colour from the codes for the paint and will be the scheme mine is done in, Actually talking to Richard Granger, the owner, the original colour scheme was gold all over with a siloette of the Mythical Archaeopteryx painted on the side just under the cockpit, but after only a few months the gold turned a nasty shade of baby poo brown and green/silver was its new colour, i promise to remember to take my camera to work tomorrow to take some pics of where i am so far, but my brain does have holes in it so no promises. chris chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Hooper Posted March 23, 2014 Share Posted March 23, 2014 It's all go, innit? The drawing stage really makes you think several steps in front. So, I'm expecting a full set of working drawings, either submitted to a magazine for publication, or for sale in their own right. After all, you wouldn't want to keep this design all to yourself, would you? tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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