EarlyBird

That is spot on ML. Here is the plan Steve Edited By EarlyBird on 13/10/2020 18:44:42

Thanks Peter. This is as far as I have got Former positions measured and marked on the inside of the fuselage sides. I then test fitted and found that more adjustments are required. So I will take it apart again. Looks like this is going to be an iterative process unfortunately the number of iterations is unknown I just hope it is not hyperbolic. Cheers Steve

Matt you are welcome. It does what I want. I have a big vice, that I inherited from work, that holds it with a vice like grip. Cheers Steve

4-MAX Here

It works for me Matt try this I bought one from 4-Max not the same but at a much lower price. Steve

Posted by Gary Clark 1 on 13/10/2020 08:13:05: You could make some sort of jigs to allow it to be built over ther plan Earlybird. Just need some scrap bits of balsa tack glued to the fuse sides to raise it up enough to allow the curved ends of the formers to just touch the plan. You just need to make sure it is all evenly raised but very simple to do. Enjoying following your build. Gary Thanks Gary I was thinking along those lines but it is good to know hat it is easy to do. I think I also need to mark the former position on the sides in order to get them in the correct location. Once I have the lines I can use pins adjacent to the lines as a location aid. The pins are necessary because of my eyes and shaky hands, the joys of getting old The upshot of it is, having spent a sleepless night thinking about it, I have to take it apart and start again. No big deal as nothing is glued, which is why I test fit. Cheers Steve

Peter, This is amazing I am speechless. Thanks for sharing as it gives me something to aspire to. Cheers Steve

I forget things from yesterday and the RF-4 was nine years ago. Thanks. Steve

I am not sure If I chock the front up by 1/8" then F4 will sit on the triangular balsa and then I can build over the plan, I like building over the plan. I paid a lot of money for it so I am determined to use it. Cheers Steve

Here is your build photo. Even more puzzled. Steve

I did not glue it because I could not get F4 and F5 to fit. I have now worked out why. As you can see they are not flat bottomed. Which is stopping me building over the plan. Peter looking at you build the rear of the fuselage does appear to be flat on the board. Puzzled Steve

So on with the fuselage. All dry fit at this stage glue tomorrow. Cheers Steve

Chris that worked in edge. Oddly I have never had a problem before.

Well said Matt, What I did find offensive was in the opening thread which inferred to me that my poor English is because I am lazy. Now I let that slide but it made me wonder how many others would be put off by this thread. Thinking about it more, would it not be better to assume that it will put people off. That way people will definitely not be put off. I wish my English was better. So for me it is not trying to shut down a thread, where that has come from I do not have a clue, but us being careful not to put people off. We need people to join in. Not only in this forum but also in model flying. I learned many years ago that if you want to encourage people then say nothing negative. I feel the tone of this thread is negative as it is overwhelmingly about peoples grammatical errors, and like me others can do nothing about it. Do I care yes. Do I expect it to change no. There is nothing we can do to improve others grammar and it is not because they are lazy. In life somethings are just beyond the individuals ability, I gave up trying to figure out how linear motors work for example. I think John Stones 1 summed it up with some thing along the lines that inability does not stop people from being good enthusiastic club members all that is need is encouragement. I can not be bothered to look up the actual quote. Now have I convinced you I am not upset? I am not trying to shut down a thread? There is nothing to shrug off? Cheers Steve

But in this case there is no way of proving one way or the other whether people will be put off or not. I am of the opinion it will, obviously. There is no argument on my part as it is a point of view. As it happens I do care about my poor English but there is very little I can do about it, I wish I could. Before anyone says it no it is not because I am lazy I firmly believe it is because my brain is not wired up to understand English. In my case the more I read and write the less I understand or the more I misunderstand. This has been a burden to me for the whole of my life. So nothing is going to change now. Cheers Steve

All you need to do is accept that I have an opinion that I am allowed to express without it being challenged.

What argument?

Yes it will put people off. No I am not trying to convince anyone. 'That's apparent and conversely, you have nothing in your replies to convince me otherwise. The subject has touched a nerve with you, you don't like it being discussed so are scrabbling around, clinging onto unproven belief and playing the victim in the hope of getting it closed down. You're clearly in this for an arguement.' Yes I think you had better as I do not appreciate what I take to be a personal attack whether intended or not. Cheers Steve

As before my opinion is that that having this discussion will put people off joining this forum. I am not trying to convince you of anything. Your last paragraph is uncalled for. Cheers Steve

Obviously you have missed my point that having a discussion about poor English on this forum will put people off. Your English is not poor. Mine is therefore I feel I am in a better position to judge. There is nothing in your replies that convince me otherwise. Cheers Steve

Posted by Doc Marten on 11/10/2020 09:56:15: Posted by EarlyBird on 11/10/2020 08:39:06: In order not to annoy those with a good command of English, because of their good education, I will stop posting. I wonder how many people with less than perfect English have been put off joining this forum. For some writing is easy but equally for some it is hard. For those that find it hard you should be encouraging them by not be critical in any way. Comments not aimed at a particular individual can still be received as offensive and have the potential to put people off joining this forum. So, now that has annoyed some, can you be less critical and more encouraging please? After all that is what you all do with regard to the quality of the builds on here, I have not seen one negative comment. Cheers Steve Steve, The idea of the 'Chit chat' section is so members can post non model related topics, that includes subjects that annoy them in general, the criticism of the standard of spelling and grammar is a regular subject both online and in conversation, having a sound grasp of it is not to do with someone having a good education. Nobody on this forum is perfect in the use of their English, all of us can be criticised for it and all of us find some things easy and some things hard, however due to advances in IT there is a multitude of help, both auto and searchable to enable us use the language correctly. I think you'll find by reading through the thread again that nobody is saying that a member with a poor grasp should not post, Martin earlier posted a perfect comment to sum up a given analogy that help is there if you want it. Anyone who chooses not to join a forum because they are offended by a general annoyance being voiced by others really should also avoid public places or cover their ears to protect their sensitivities. The forum is stuffed with encouragement, you even state this in the closing sentence of your reply so why can we not also offer constructive criticism? Balance is another rapidly diminishing commodity which we once held with pride. Whether you continue to post or not based purely on your own annoyance that members wish to discuss that the standard of language and grammar has become noticeably poorer and harder to understand is your choice but personally, I think it's an overreaction. ' having a sound grasp of it is not to do with someone having a good education.' So how do you acquire a sound grasp of it if not through education? You seem to have missed my point. There are people who like me recognise that their English is poor and even though they could make worthwhile contributions to this forum do not. This thread is not going to encourage anyone with poor English to join in. 'I think you'll find by reading through the thread again that nobody is saying that a member with a poor grasp should not post, Martin earlier posted a perfect comment to sum up a given analogy that help is there if you want it. Anyone who chooses not to join a forum because they are offended by a general annoyance being voiced by others really should also avoid public places or cover their ears to protect their sensitivities.' I did not say they should not post and are you accusing me of being over sensitive? 'Whether you continue to post or not based purely on your own annoyance that members wish to discuss that the standard of language and grammar has become noticeably poorer and harder to understand is your choice but personally, I think it's an overreaction.' I am not annoyed, why do you think I am? My understanding of this forum is to encourage and help with model flying and for me this thread is counter productive in that it has the potential to put people off from joining in. Matt 'Have you ever criticised someone for their driving or parking? Of course you have, whether publicly or not. Should you not be more understanding of people who find driving and parking difficult?' No I have not and yes I do understand people do have difficulties that make them less than perfect, which is why I do not criticise. I did not say that it is wrong to criticise did I? I never suggested that we should tread on eggshells. This is not the right forum to be correcting peoples English. One last point and I am sure I am not the only one, some replies to my posts make me feel that I am not allowed to comment, not only on this thread but other threads as well. Cheers Steve