Martyn K Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 A very long read Parliament Link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Bisset Posted July 11, 2019 Share Posted July 11, 2019 Oh dear. Mr Ellis demonstrates that he does not appear to understand that as Minister of State he should apply critical thinking, not simply regurgitate the party line. As a Minister of State he should be able to think for himself. Really must do better (though admittedly with the examples around in Government just now he probably feels he is doing well ! ) PWC's 'estimate' is ludicrous pie in the sky stuff, as he would realise with a few moment's thought. They have taken the most optimistic figures from Amazon and others without applying any thoughts on practicality. Rather similar to what seems to happen far too often in auditing - figures are accepted without enough challenge. At least some folk are listening and understanding. Well done those who got through to Mr Loughton. I shall try sending another note to my local MP, who so far has not responded at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted July 12, 2019 Author Share Posted July 12, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken anderson. Posted July 12, 2019 Share Posted July 12, 2019 this thread like many is quickly becoming as clear as mud..... ken anderson...ne..1....mud dept. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted July 12, 2019 Author Share Posted July 12, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Bastow Posted July 12, 2019 Share Posted July 12, 2019 Percy, Mr Phipps did indeed mention that the BMFA has its own achievement scheme. I would agree about the Baroness, came across very arrogant and smug to my eyes. Edited By Cliff Bastow on 12/07/2019 17:05:22 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john featherstone 1 Posted July 12, 2019 Share Posted July 12, 2019 for Cuban 8 above?? the person who really should be giving it to them large is the PATRON OF THE B.M.F.A. he should be called upon to take our side in this mess if not why bother having him we may as well have chubby brown at least we could have a laugh also I think this may have stated with the phrase unmaned aircraft we should have stood our ground and said MODEL AIRCRAFT unmaned aircraft lumps all things that fly without a human together not good its all a play on words Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Christy Posted July 12, 2019 Share Posted July 12, 2019 Good point, John, and that card has been played in the past. Protocol dictates that at a meeting with government officials, they must provide someone of equivalent "rank" to your representative. I think it was possibly during the CB crisis that the BMFA dragged our President (?) - a then very senior former RAF man - along to a meeting, and the Home Office had to provide a civil servant of equal stature. Not sure how much it achieved at the time, but we did eventually get what we wanted - 35 MHz! -- Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted July 13, 2019 Author Share Posted July 13, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Christy Posted July 13, 2019 Share Posted July 13, 2019 Posted by Steve J on 12/07/2019 10:27:50: I finally forced myself to listen to Ms. Vere's evidence. Contrary to what she said, the EU delegated regulation does not require all UA over 250g to have electronic identification and geofencing. Only UA with automatic flight modes are required to have direct remote identification and geo-awareness. I got the impression that the meeting with the associations didn't go very well... Steve Steve: Have you got chapter and verse on this? ie: at what time in the feed she said it, and also a link to the document with a reference location? I ask, because my understanding of proceedings like this (and I am not a lawyer!) is that misleading a parliamentary committee is as serious as misleading parliament and demands at least an apology and correction or a resignation! We need to feed this info to David Phipps so that he can follow it up. If I can get the precise timings and locations, I tempted to write to the committee chairman myself to complain about it! -- Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted July 13, 2019 Author Share Posted July 13, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Christy Posted July 13, 2019 Share Posted July 13, 2019 Posted by Steve J on 13/07/2019 18:04:36: I'm hoping that she won't survive the ministerial reshuffle that is coming at the end of the month and we have a more sympathetic aviation minister in August. You and me both! And probably a lot of others, too! But please keep us updated on this. You obviously are more across it than me, and we need all the firepower we can muster to try and get a reasonable outcome. If she has mislead a committee, she could be in serious trouble! -- Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Dilly 1 Posted July 13, 2019 Share Posted July 13, 2019 I've just ploughed for the second time through the Baroness's evidence here:https://www.parliamentlive.tv/Event/Index/1a8ec4dc-78a8-4b76-9dce-ff663ad71067 The parts that specially touch on model flying are at the roughly following times into the session: 10:44 (electronic conspicuity), 10:57 (again), 11:19 (electronic i.d. mandatory, retro-fitting?), 11:22 (clubs registering for many pilots), 11:26 (beeping drone in wrong place easy to ID, nothing about non-beeping one!), 11:28 (geo-fencing now mandatory), 11:33 (is the offence owning or flying?), 11:34 (why is our safety record ignored?), 11:35 (the idiot flying near LHR). The fact that she keeps referring to what we do as a 'hobby' rather than a sport, which it is, can't be helping us either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Christy Posted July 13, 2019 Share Posted July 13, 2019 Thanks, Martin! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted July 15, 2019 Author Share Posted July 15, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martyn K Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Posted by Martin Dilly 1 on 13/07/2019 19:22:28: The fact that she keeps referring to what we do as a 'hobby' rather than a sport, which it is, can't be helping us either. Many people (including many model flyers) do seem reluctant to accept that Aeromodelling/Model Flying is a recognised sport and if ever there was a time to ditch the hobby or pastime moniker, now is that time. Martyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerOC Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 A point I have made to my MP (Leader of the House) is something that has never been mentioned at all; Local Bye laws. When i started flying some 8 years back I took the trouble to look at our local Bye laws and they ban the flying of all model aircraft above 100g within the borough. I live close to Dartmoor National Park and their Bye Laws are that all powered models are banned but they welcome model gliders. I am sure that this is not unique to our town. Rob Edited By TigerOC on 19/07/2019 22:29:03 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Christy Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 Posted by TigerOC on 19/07/2019 22:28:24: A point I have made to my MP (Leader of the House) is something that has never been mentioned at all; Local Bye laws. When i started flying some 8 years back I took the trouble to look at our local Bye laws and they ban the flying of all model aircraft above 100g within the borough. I live close to Dartmoor National Park and their Bye Laws are that all powered models are banned but they welcome model gliders. I am sure that this is not unique to our town. Rob Edited By TigerOC on 19/07/2019 22:29:03 I also live close to Dartmoor, but Torbay Council appears to take a more enlightened approach. Parkies who have approached model flyers using public land for silent flight and electric models have indicated that as long as the pilot has BMFA insurance, they are happy to let them continue. They probably wouldn't be so happy with a noisy IC model, but as long as common sense prevails, there appears to be no problem! (Unlike 50-odd years ago when the C/L club I belonged to got kicked off public land by a parky!) -- Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Christy Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 I see that the new Minister for Transport is Grant Shapps. IIRC he is a keen aviation enthusiast, holds a PPL and has his own 'plane. He has been a staunch defender of General Aviation against intrusive legislation, and at the back of my mind is that he has also been a friend of model flying. Does anyone else remember this? Anyway, now that we have an aviation enthusiast in the job, maybe - just maybe - common sense will prevail! -- Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrman Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 Grant Shapps is the MP for Welwyn Hatfield. If he's a fellow forumite's MP could I suggest they write/email him? I know he will probably be busy but it might be an "easy fix" for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerOC Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 Posted by Peter Christy on 25/07/2019 14:01:54: I see that the new Minister for Transport is Grant Shapps. IIRC he is a keen aviation enthusiast, holds a PPL and has his own 'plane. He has been a staunch defender of General Aviation against intrusive legislation, and at the back of my mind is that he has also been a friend of model flying. Does anyone else remember this? Anyway, now that we have an aviation enthusiast in the job, maybe - just maybe - common sense will prevail! -- Pete In fact as Chairman of that Committee he actually wrote to the Minister requesting justification for the inclusion of the Model Flying community in this draconian system. His letter was published by the BMFA but we have not seen the response. Probably the standard response that everyone else got; Don't confuse me with facts as my mind is made up. Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Christy Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 Interesting! I wasn't aware of that. To be fair, it will probably take him a few weeks to wade through all the stuff on his desk, and I doubt if our problem is his highest priority. In the meantime, he will just parrot the line he is fed by his civil servants. However, if he still hasn't taken any action in (say) a month's time, perhaps it might be worth reminding him of this fact! Perhaps someone with an MP who is on side might like to prompt them to remind the minister of this? -- Pete Edited By Peter Christy on 02/08/2019 22:23:03 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted August 3, 2019 Author Share Posted August 3, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Christy Posted August 4, 2019 Share Posted August 4, 2019 Thank you for your input, Jeremy. Very useful! Many of the members here started off flying control-line, and some still do! Indeed, I still have a few down in the garage myself, though I haven't flown them for a few years. Also, I recall reading somewhere that control-line flyers will also be required to register under the proposed legislation. This makes the proposed rules even more nonsensical. I have no doubt that the BMFA are working feverishly behind the scenes on our behalf. I am taking the silence coming from there as "no news is good news" at the moment, as it implies that delicate negotiations are ongoing. Anyway, welcome to the forum, and again, thank you for your interesting input. -- Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted August 4, 2019 Author Share Posted August 4, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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