Best Trainer ?

[Phil 9]

There are many ARTF trainers on the market most of which are pretty similar.

Some like the Wot trainer being an advanced trainer and even makes a good sports model for more advanced pilots. Compared to more docile flyers like a Tutor 40 or telemaster.

 

What I am asking is what type model would be the best to take you’re a cert test with. So it would need to flatter your flying to make it look good for the test.

 

It would not need to do anything else ie be cabable of aerobatic training or be a very docile first model like an easy star (the easy star although a good model is not suitable for the A test)

 

I am very interested in hearing some of your opinions and experiences

 

The model might not even be a designated trainer. I read on the forum Big Phil passed his A with a panic biplane. I have a Tango as well as a Boomerang. The Tango is a fun fly but I have it set up on very low rates and the thick wing section means it can be flown very slowly and is very stable( but not self righting like the Boomerang)

 

I was also wondering if a 3CH trainer might have an advantage in the test situation

[Jonathan Lewzey]

tutor 40 is the best trainer and a cert model. it will also teach you aerobatics - i learnt to fly inverted circuits with mine due to the semi symmetrical wing section. Definitely best with a 46; a standard 46LA gives adequate power. Definitely a 4 channel trainer. 3 channel obsolete with the buddy box system

[Phil 9]

I wondered if the semi symmetrical wing would be an advantage or not.

 

My current trainer a Seagull Boomerang has a semi symmetrical wing but not having flown one I often wondered if a flat bottom wing woul be more steady?

[Marko]

Hi phil l think you may have answered you own question in your second sentance ...... A wot trainer ! A good plane for you test Cheers mark

[Jonathan Lewzey]

flat bottom wing is just more boring. my dads arising star was very non aerobatic with a flat bottom wing compared to the tutors semi symmetrical. the tutor is still as stable and nice to fly (if a bit sedate) just like basically any other trainer. Stick with the boomerang though, it'll be fine and its semi symmetrical too so you should be able to learn loops, rolls, immelmans, reversals and inverted with it. Wot trainer has lots of dihedral? not too keen on styling myself either.

Edited By Jonathan Lewzey on 17/03/2010 14:45:08

[Phil 9]

Interesting feedback Thanks all

[Eck]

My son passed his S.A,A. Bronze (Scottish equivalent of 'A' Cert.) last week with a Wot 4 ARTF, while I'm having difficulty controlling pitch up in winds with my Wot Trainer....

[ken anderson.]

hello phil b- i would say go for the 'arising star'...if a trainer is what you want...it will give you the 'feel good factor' for a cert test....ie:-it wont catch you out.......if you are beyond the trainer stage........any high winger will get you away..wot 4 and some of it's look alikes as well...........

 

 ken anderson...ne 1.   

[James40]

Hangar 9's Alpha 40 is a nice trainer and when used with the Evolution training engine is a good all round introduction to RC/IC flying.

[Phil 9]

I hope I am up to A cert standard but as yet not taken the test. My club should be holding a test day soon and I want to be prepared for it both with my skills and the equipment I am using.

My club has a policy of no solo flying without an "A". Although a good rule I am at the stage now where it is a bit frustrating as I want to progress to more than basic manoeuvres and models.

I have been at the club  for over twelve months now and there has not been a test day within that time. The club does not have its own examiner and has to book one in. This can only happen if there are enough students to make it worthwhile.

As test days are so few and far between I want to give myself the best chance of passing first time.

[Jonathan Lewzey]

the boomerang is just fine for the job. just practice practice practice and if you want to progress - do! - it'll improve your flying and make the easy a cert maneouvres seem really really easy. I used to find it tricky, but now i think i could do the whole test (except landings/take offs ) indoors, rolling, at just a few feet above the deck .

 

practice as much as possible, especially on the sim. my dad also flys and he never practices on the sim and i'm a much more advanced and disciplined flyer than he is. sim practice makes all the difference, and fly like a complete idiot on the sim too to push yourself and your reactions. my current fav is a no aerodynamic drag, 5:1 power to weight EDF F-16 (modified) that really sharpens those reactions .

[Phil 9]

Thanks for the advice

I have not used my sim for a while. To be honest I got a little bored with it

[David Davis]

Phil, may I re-phrase your question?

 

What is the best trainer for me?

 

I agree that the Tutor 40 is excellent and that the Boomerang should fly similarly due to its semi-symmetyrical wing section. This will allow the beginner to fly inverted circuits in a wind.... But wait a minute, if you can fly inverted circuits in a wind are you really a learner?

 

In my experience young people learn how to fly very quickly and either of the above trainers will be excellent for them. I believe that the Tutor 40 is being re-released with a longer fuselage which should make it even smoother to fly. However, older learners I have taught, have slower reactions and seem to lack the confidence of youth. They find the relative instability of a four-channel model difficult to manage and are much happier flying a "boring" three channel vintage model of at least five feet, (1.5 metres) in the wingspan, whether on a buddy box or not. Yes, you have to restrict your flying to fairly calm conditions but with a few flights under the belt the nervous beginner soon makes the transition to ailerons without too much difficulty.

 

The Junior 60 a 5 foot vintage design is avaiable from Flair as an ARTF .

[Phil 9]

Hello David

 

Yes the question I was asking was indeed what is the best trainer for me.

 

I did look at the Junior 60 but the ARTF version is no longer available ( I could only find it in kit form.(steve webb does not have the ARTF anymore)

 

 

Posted by David Davis Telemaster Sales UK on 20/03/2010 08:12:48:

 

 

"But wait a minute, if you can fly inverted circuits in a wind are you really a learner?"

 

 

 

 

 

This was my thinking to. Many say these semi .symmetyrical  trainers are good because they alow you to progress and therefor are good VFM. But I was not looking for a model to progress with just one to get me through my "A". I can get another model to progress with afterwards.

 

At the end of the day though I can see now its my flying skills that need attention more than what model I use. I was just geting a little nerves

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Jonathan Lewzey]

the boomerang will be a good intial aerobatic trainer when you've done your A as you'll be used to its flying characteristics. you'll find yourself a lot more comfortable flying a model you're familier with and have many hours on than transitioning straight away to an aerobatic ship. As has been quoted many times in RCM&E, don't dump your trainer too soon as it can still teach you a lot after your first solos and A cert. Here then, the bommerang and tutor are the best and i disagree with david here. instability? i find my 3 channel mam'selle vintage model far more unstable than i ever found my tutor 40 . it dutch rolls just like any other vintage model with plenty of dihedral, particularly in the climb and i always find myself wishing i had ailerons

[David Davis]

Jonathan

 

1. Not all vintage models dutch roll in the climb. You are not trying to make it climb too steeply are you, thereby getting the model to approach its stalling speed?

 

 

Phil

 

1. You are quite right when you say that you can take your A Certificate on any model, i.e: you don't have to take it with a trainer.

 

2. You have to use a model with which you are comfortable and this can be anything from a docile vintage model to ..well anything. I have flown the following trainers and these in my view are amongst the best: Tutor 40, Alpha 40, as recommended by James and Jonathan, and the Thunder Tiger Trainer. I've limited experience of the Boomerang but it has a semi-symmetrical wing section like the Tutor 40 so should have similar flying characteristics, i.e: it will not balloon so much into when turning into wind like a model with a flat bottomed wing section and it should be fairly stable in a Force 3 or 4.

 

3. If you are at the stage where you can put a model where you want to put it in the sky, then a WOT 4 would be a good option as recommended by Ken. I've never owned one of these but have flown several so I can be quite objective. They are exquisite fliers but, with that flat wing, lack some of the in-built stability of the models listed in 2.

 

4. If you feel that you need something more docile than any of the models listed above, the Sig Kadet Senior would be a good option.

 

5. FWIW, I took my A certificate on a Telemaster.  

 

 

[Jonathan Lewzey]

Posted by David Davis Telemaster Sales UK on 21/03/2010 06:45:30:

Jonathan

 

1. Not all vintage models dutch roll in the climb. You are not trying to make it climb too steeply are you, thereby getting the model to approach its stalling speed?

 

 

 

 

 no, i don't think so . although it has been quite windy (8-10ish mph) when i've flown it before (only on our club's 'vintage days'). It does have quite a lot of power though (OS15 for a 52" model ) so i may have overdone it a bit . I like this engine though with the model - it causes so muttering among the dyed in the wool vintage flyers when i pull square loops . lol.

 

i too like the tiger trainer; my cousin had one and i've also flown another. they fly very well and are very stable, but perhaps not as good in stronger winds as the tutor and boomerang as i've found they tend to fly slower.

[Phil 9]

The flying site I use does tend to have strong wings.

 

Though I do prefer the more docile flying models

[Phil 9]

I am thinking I will get a Sig Kadet Senior.

 

It a little larger than most trainers and I like the look of it

But I think I will have the blue version.

 

I will need a new engine if I get this model I have a choice of three

 

JEN .47               £60 approx

OS 46 AX            £100 approx

Saito FA  61a      £190 approx

 

I know they would all work fine but I would also like to hear your opinon

 

I have not used a four stroke engine before and know very little about them. At the moment I am leaning towards the OS

[Bruce Richards]

If money is not an issue then go for the OS. Personally I would fit an ASP/SC 2 or 4 stroke. Thats because I'm tight.

 

Just my view.

Edited By Bruce Richards - Moderator on 24/03/2010 07:14:08

[Phil 9]

2 stroke or 4 stroke? that is the question!

[David Davis]

You won't go wrong with either an OS or a Saito.

 

Personally I prefer the sound of a four-stroke. They might take longer to run-in, and they are a little more complex but provided you use the recommended fuel and check the valve clearences once or twice a year depending upon use, you should have no problems. I'm sure someone at your club could advise. Saito only make four-stroke engines and have a reputation for quality. I've never owned one so can't speak from experience.

 

OS also make excellent four-strokes, I've five of them as well as a couple of their two-strokes all of which are fine.

 

I've also got three Thunder Tigre four-strokes, two 91s and a 54, which I'm also very pleased with. I expect the 54 would fly the Senior but they make a 75 now which should also be worth considering. 

 

The Senior will make an excellent slow-flying trainer, but I'd advise against using it in a strong wind until you are used to it.

[Tim Mackey]

I agree....about the engine choice I mean

[Jonathan Lewzey]

there's no need to spend £100 on a .46AX as the trainer will fly fine on the standard .46LA (£60 ish). Or you could buy second hand. Loads of people are moving over to electric flight so there's lots of good engines on the marketplace right now. For example, my dad bought a OS40FP which runs beautifully in his travel air for - get this - £2! . This is a pretty special price, but its not uncommon to see a 46FX going for £25-30.

 

2 stroke is fine for a trainer, four stroke does sound better, but is a lot more expensive.

[Phil 9]

Maybe you are right Johnathan.

 

My thinking was to buy a quality engine that would last and be used in future models.

 

I have had my eye out for second hand engines 40 sizes engines are out there at but cheep .46 engines seem to be a bit thin on the ground.

 

And second hand 4 stroke engines seem to hold there value more. So much so I think I would  want the peace of mind of buying one new. I dont have the skills to sort out a 4 stroke that was not running quite right.

 

Maybe I am in too much of a rush to send my hard earned. I guess looking at all the new kit in the mags has drawn me in .

 

Perhaps I should save my cash for now and keep my eyes on the classifieds