How Vintage is Vintage?

[John E ( Puffin Models )]

I was thinking about a "vintage" model for my next project, and then I received my latest RCM&E (yes, I am a reader!) but the question from me is what is considered a reasonable cut off date for "vintage" in the 2012 mass build?

 

I have a few ideas, the most recent being 1968 - before the Super 60?

 

Time to build some off the "must do" list, or revisit an old project

 

Please be gentle

 

John

[Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator]

Hi John,

 

the "rules" such as they are for the Vintage Mass Build are deliberately very loose so as to allow as wide a participation as possible.

 

The nominal cut-off date is that the original should have been designed pre-1965. But, you could be modelling a derivative that came later. Also the rules even allow new designs(!) as long as they are in the "spirit" of a pre-1965 model. Although as far as I know no-one has taken up that option!

 

BEB

[John E ( Puffin Models )]

Thank you BEB (are you who I think you are?),

 

Two I was thinking of were the Dactyl ('68) which I will do again at some time (4S electric this time of course), and the Sig Kadets, but they are post '65.

 

Astro Hog, whilst suitable for 4S, really goes into the 5S and 6S area for me, so the Smog Hog looks good right now - and aerobatic!

 

Regards,

 

John

[Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator]

Posted by John E ( Puffin Models ) on 18/12/2011 13:34:06:

Thank you BEB (are you who I think you are?),

 

 

Possibly John but I don't know who you think I am! To be honest I doubt it as I don't think we've met!

 

BEB

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]

[Geoff Smith 1]

Posted by Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator on 18/12/2011 18:34:10:

Posted by John E ( Puffin Models ) on 18/12/2011 13:34:06:

Thank you BEB (are you who I think you are?),

 

 

Possibly John but I don't know who you think I am! To be honest I doubt it as I don't think we've met!

 

BEB

I've met him, once seen never forgotten. lol

 

Geoff..............Foot in mouth dept.

[flytilbroke]

Posted by Geoff Smith 1 on 18/12/2011 19:19:17:

Posted by Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator on 18/12/2011 18:34:10:

Posted by John E ( Puffin Models ) on 18/12/2011 13:34:06:

Thank you BEB (are you who I think you are?),

 

 

Possibly John but I don't know who you think I am! To be honest I doubt it as I don't think we've met!

 

BEB

I've met him, once seen never forgotten. lol

 

Geoff..............Foot in mouth dept.

Agreed, by Flytilbroke,,,,,,,,,Seconder dept.

[Big Bandit]

Hi John and welcome to the forum,

 

We have never met, but I've heard and spoke to you, and brought a number of items from you over the years, like BEB, said this is a loose very open Vintage build to encourage as many as possible to take part, and as importantly a choice of power options to suit the individual,

 

I, for one am a dedicated electric flyer but now and again prefer to get the old diesels and glows out.I suppose it's horses for courses as it were, or what ever floats your boat. Think I've got the original plan for the Smog Hog, need to look at that one .

 

Cheers,

 

Chris.

Edited By Big Bandit on 18/12/2011 21:31:16

[Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator]

Posted by Geoff Smith 1 on 18/12/2011 19:19:17:

Posted by Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator on 18/12/2011 18:34:10:

Posted by John E ( Puffin Models ) on 18/12/2011 13:34:06:

Thank you BEB (are you who I think you are?),

 

 

Possibly John but I don't know who you think I am! To be honest I doubt it as I don't think we've met!

 

BEB

I've met him, once seen never forgotten. lol

 

Geoff..............Foot in mouth dept.

 

Yeap - I certainly couldn't be a bank robber that's for sure! Bit too distinctive!

 

BEB

[John E ( Puffin Models )]

You guys have been gentle with me - thank you .

 

My early engines were diesels with just about the full range of DCs bought through the local sports shop - Wenmac .049s and an AM 10 were the exception. Through time in the Air Force (15 different addresses!), I tended to move round with radio and .40 engines, and build what excited me at each address - Dactyl was one of those, but I still have a huge "must do" list! Understandably all of my modelling over the last 10 years has been "commercial", but I have a nearly complete Sig 4*20 wing here on the table - a return to modelling for leisure, and long overdue!

 

I will e-mail Sig to find out when the Kadet Senior was designed (they started in '51), and really, somone SHOULD be kitting the Smog Hog! (Smog Hog is in the RCM&E X list) . Emphasis on kits? There is little room for my band saw and disc sander in my London bedsit!

 

Regards,

 

John

[John E ( Puffin Models )]

I e-mailed Ben Buckle this morning but so far no reply. I was asking about the age of their Fokker D8 (Earle Stahle design?), does anyone know if it qualifies?

 

Another thought: I used to spend a huge amount of time teaching people to fly on Super 60s, so yes, I do know a lot about them! One thought is a stock Super to relive old memories of rolling them "don't they go well with ailerons?" no, it didn't have ailerons!

 

Yet another thought was the low wing Super 60 that never happened, and it should! You did say derivatives, didn't you?

 

Regards,

John

(trying not to be too controversial!)

[Big Bandit]

Hi John,

 

To me the Super 60 was a free flight or a Rudder only tail dragger with an escapement / escapements on single channel, galloping ghost rather than propo servo's, but for reliability and safety it has to be 3 channel these days and a period RC engine as far as is reasonably practicable. Also it has to be covered in nylon and dope.

 

I think my Smog Hog plan is an original from MAP, Allen House (haven't had time to check it out yet) but certainly one for the future build list, along with a few dozen others.

 

I grew up on KK rubber scale series models and later KK, Veron and Mercury control liners and free flight with engines that I still have, but prefer to use clones these days.

,

As for the Vintage build, I'm well through the Super 60 3 channel with a Merco 35, and have the Matador kit (for an ED bee or PAW 1.5 lined up next, followed by the Astro Hog with a Sharkface somewhere between for a quicky and DC Bantam or Merlin power.

 

It Must be a right pain to be trying to build models in a bed sit, I didn't bother, left the models at the parents house and brought a drum kit moved into a flat, joined a band, got kicked out out of the flat, then rented a larger flat, still kept the drum kit, but built models and played with the band until the band took over and the modelling stopped. Then I got a proper job at the gas board and part time at a model shop, quit the band and got an even proper job in education then settled down. Apart from riding big bikes it's been bikes, models, drums, bands, on and off for years along with a full time job. In the end the models won. drums and bikes gone well settled down into early retirement and enjoying every minute building models.

 

Cheers,

 

Chris.

Edited By Big Bandit on 19/12/2011 23:13:16

[Olly P]

Right. IF I can repair th Easy Fly, finish the Webbitt, finish the Wing, finish my HiFly, Then I will start a vintage wing for which I have found a free online plan (IF my A3 printer ever turns up)

 

I will however be making it RC not FF, and possibly making the ailerons a little larger. The plan was drawn in the mid 50's.

 

Oh, I'll also be using Solar film. If this one goes well I'll build another but plank and glass it.

 

Olly

[Danny Fenton]

Hi John, great to see you joining in. I am electric only these days, but had to join in and take the trip down memory lane. Has been great fun, even to the point of buying and running the mighty diesel P.A.W .8 in the garden. The finger still works after all these years but I think I will stick to Electric

Not as easy as plugging wires in, the challenges are elsewhere with electric flight, but a wonderful nostalgic trip none the less. I am not sure that we should be so critical on the age, but that's just my opinion, more important is to join in and enjoy the nostagia.

 

Cheers

Danny

[Olly P]

Oh, and mine will have no power. A proper glider type - saves messing around!

[Danny Fenton]

Ahh but Olly sometimes the messing about is what its ALL about

[Olly P]

Yes - When you have time!

[John E ( Puffin Models )]

I am oh so tempted to pull the old Dactyl plan and rib template out of the garage, I could have one together by the end of next week! Power would be Mega 22/30/4 with 11x5,5 on 4S 3300s, very similar to the Enya 40 that I flew mine on.

 

I also noticed that Push Moth (RC895) is 1965, and at 42" and 1lb is perfect for 400 size power systems and modern full house radio.

 

On the other hand I have a Super 60 rib template and a low wing S60 in my head - and the plan number (RC 659) for the Smog Hog!

 

Oh, and a 4*20 and 4*120 to finish before I go back on the 2nd - nearly there!

[Bob Cotsford]

John, according to this thread the D8 design goes back to the 50s or 60s. I'd have thought it was in the right spirit regardless, after all it's not a competition with rules, is it?

[Danny Fenton]

Maybe you should do them all John? if you are going to stroll down memory lane make a day of it, and turn it into a long walk

Cheers

Danny

[John E ( Puffin Models )]

Yes, D8 looks good (it does look good!), and also, according to that thread, Dactyl would be legal for VC/RC? Well, I went into the garage to find bits and plans in "my box", and came out with - a Galahad plan!

 

Dare I say that I never really "got" artf, and I am now in a new phase of model building for fun. I never did go with the flow, so I see some different stuff happening in the bedsit! (I never did watch much TV either).

 

The point of electric? Well, I know how to do it to the point of fitting a prop knowing exactly how the model will perform, and having the same prop fitted for years. Building is far quicker with no fuel proofing required, and the model can last for decades with no deterioration.

 

That said, I did toy with the idea of a project using a 10cc diesel (Astro Hog?)

[Big Bandit]

Posted by John E ( Puffin Models ) on 20/12/2011 16:38:20:

 

That said, I did toy with the idea of a project using a 10cc diesel (Astro Hog?)

 

 

Hi John, now that's talking turkey, and assuming it will be a 60 size PAW.

 

 

Cheers,

 

Chris.

[John E ( Puffin Models )]

Hi Chris,

 

The 10cc diesel is the MVVS, which I am happy to buy for my own use, but we REFUSE to sell them due to the current consumer "protection" - a story I would rather forget, but the full cost of a 2,5cc diesel plus carriage costs came directly out of Sandra's pocket, and the engine is still running in competition on fuel that actually has some ether in it with the contra piston in the right position, not pushed right down into the cylinder......

 

Another garage find! Brand new 54" RM5 Stringalong bipe plan (Frank Knowles design), and taking the plan numbers back from RM48 Dactyl of '68, makes it ' 64 or '65. The guys used to fly them on Merco .61s and they were very pleasant aerobatic models.

 

Cheers,

 

John

[Big Bandit]

Hi John,

 

If I remember correctly Stephen Grigg had a Stringalong, a very nice looking model. There's a photo on the forum somewhere. Think it had a Merco 61 up front too.

 

Cheers,

 

Chris.

[John E ( Puffin Models )]

I received a response from Sig - interesting.....

Dear John,

The Kadet Senior was designed about 1983. The only kits we have that were designed before 1965 are the SIG Astro Hog and the SIG 1/6th scale Cub.

Best regards,

Andrea Martin
Marketing Manager