Aphylactic adhesive

[spanner]

Could some kind soul explain to me the pros and cons of using aphylactic ( spelling??) adhesive. Im just starting a new traditionally build biplane kit, balsa, and have heard several recommendations for this but have yet to hear the fors and againsts. Or any other recommendations, Ive generally used thin cyano and /or epoxy to date.

Thanks in anticipation

Spanner

[Peter 'Ivanna Crashalot' Savage]

do you mean aliphatic glue?

Pros: It is slow to dry so you can re position it easier, while its drying you get a drink break! Is very strong

Cons: i cant actually think of any cons, you just need the to use the glue that best suits the job at hand, e.g. when you need to reposition it a few times, use aliphatic glue, when it is a quick bond use CA

[Myron Beaumont]

Spanner

I would use it exclusively  on a traditional build .I still use PVA a lot but where you might have to sand down sheet joins etc  the aliphatic is not as "rubbery" as .PVA  & will take on vibration better than cyano I suspect .I only use it (cyano) for tacking balsa in certain situations to make life easier positioning wise .Having said that I know some folks use CA for everything 'cos it's much quicker  -I must be old-fashioned though 'cos I stiil use balsa cement as well  & that is quick too!   & smells a whole lot better

[Hamish]

I have used Evostick wood glue which I think is a PVA and use this most for general building.

I use Pound Land's super glue, which has just gone up in price, as you now only get three tubes instead of five, for quick stitches as I am not too sure if it could be brittle.

Have just started using Gorilla Glue for my none to accurate joints.  It expands when it sets and is rock hard.  Just change my trainer to a tail dragger.  Epoxied a small piece of ply to the fuselage.  Had a bent bit if wire attached by undercarriage clamp however easily bent.  Cut a small bit of ply and re-enforced the wire.  Where this ply joined to the original on fuselage I have created a fillet using this glue and it is solid.

Use epoxy for joints where strength is needed.

Can somebody please explain what  "aliphatic glue" is

[Former Member]

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[Hamish]

Thanks Phil

I take it, it is a two part epoxy resin, 5, 30, 60 minute or whatever?

[Dave S.]

Alphatic resin is a single part wood glue, usually yellow in colour. Main advantage over PVA is that it is sandable when set. I use it for most of my model building, as it has virtually no odour and washes off with water until set.

[Hamish]

Thanks Dave

 I can see the advantages as the PVA is very difficult to sand.   Will look for next time I am in model shop. 

[Former Member]

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[Hamish]

Phil

"This is the stuff they use in tiny amounts in natural gas so we can smell when we are gassing ourselves or we're about to blow up."

I served my apprenticeship at a high pressure gasification plant which produced odourless gas to which we injected a substance to provide the safety requirements you refer to.   An individual took some  solution home to put outside his house to scare away dogs,  Next thing the gas board are digging up the street.

Used to hate working on these motor/pumps as you threw away any clothing afterwords

[Myron Beaumont]

Phil

You said " would you make glue of this ? " ---- Well !  I still use proper brown wood glue made from boiled up bones I believe --It's been used for furniture for centuries & has a characteristic  smell all of its own  ( If you were a cannibal you'd know what I mean)  It' s heated in a cast iron pot   over another pot of hot water ( like you do vegetables ) I wonder what the chemical formula is for it ?

PS  I don't use it for model A/C  by the way   ( I bet Eric does   ) It'd be alright on his narrow boat if he ever gets round to getting up to date (ie the last century)

[Former Member]

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[Former Member]

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[Myron Beaumont]

Phil   That is very interesting   I always wondered why my Grandpa told me --Never over heat it ! Hence the cast iron pot etc  Yes it is the only glue to use in furniture renovation for the reasons stated

 You tell young people --They won't believe you   Thanks for the info    Myron

[Former Member]

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[spanner]

So in a nutshell, strong,easily sanded and gives time to reposition and no real cons?

Thanks for all the advice ... and the interesting asides on animal glue, I seem to recall using cascamite, a paste glue mixed with water whilst in woodworking class at school many years ago, is it stil around and ony use or is it simply superceded by modern glues?

[Bruce Richards]

You can still get Cascamite bit it is called Extramite. Link

[Myron Beaumont]

Spanner       It comes in powder form to mix with water .Very good wood glue but very brittle in lumps  . If you chisel off dried dribbles -Mind your eyes !!! Brilliant for plywood in modelling applications or where there are mortise & tenon type joints ie not much movement lightly to be encountered .However slow setting epoxy is probably the best bet  for maximum strength and anti- fuel properties Stick with alphatic or PVA for general modelling -  pun not intended  !.There are also quick grab variants available  if needed  Craft shops stock it.One made in Sweden is excellent  but cant remember its name