Taking the plunge - FPV

[Simon Dale - Firstpersonview.co.uk]

I don't follow RE my "offending web link"?   I can view the thread without issue.  What do you mean?

 

I'm sorry to hear that you have had problems - and a crash!  Eek!

 

> "The fact that there isn't a huge amount suggests to me that this isn't yet for enthusiastic amateurs like me but for a dedicated few with lots of technical knowledge and an unlimited budget"

 

There must be thousands of FPV videos online. 

 

I've never known anyone to have so many problems before.  Did you range check before flying?  Have you ever flown the plane without the video gear turned on?  Have you ever used the Tx before on other aircraft? 

 

What channel are you using for RC?  I had a problem last week whereby I was using channel 55 and a synthesized Rx which seemed to lock to 55 perfectly well until I did a range check and found that at more than 10 metres I lost signal.  Further investigation revealed that the receiver can only lock to between channels 60 and 90.

 

I know that the Futaba Tx was new to you, and from the posts about the propeller I guess you are new to electric RC?  I guess you need to get back to basics and get your plane in order first of all.  Depending on how you have laid out your aircraft the ESC could be interfering with your receiver - I've never heard of that with a Corona RP6D1/ RP8D1.

 

Could you take a load of detailed photos of your layout, connections (since its all in bits perhaps photographing it all laid out on a table how it would normally be connected would be best), and send them over to me/ post them here.  Perhaps we can see what you've got wrong. 

 

It shouldn't be this hard!  Most people just stick the FPV camera on and connect it to the battery and go flying! 

 

I was doing formation flying (which descended into dog fighting fairly quickly) on Thursday with two planes bolted together in about 30 minutes each.  Photo of the two "Polymersions" attached.  (Our Easystar is undergoing a brushless upgrade at the moment hence not being out that day) [Can't work out how to upload a photo!?]

 

All the best

Edited By Simon Dale - Firstpersonview.co.uk on 13/03/2010 16:36:57

[Simon Dale - Firstpersonview.co.uk]

Ah - I do see what you mean now - the width!

 

Can I edit my post?  I can't see an option to edit it?

[Tim Mackey]

You can only edit your post as long as another post has not followed it IYSWIM.

What do you want doing...I will sort it for you.

Seems you could do to read up on the forum guidelines Simon on how to paste links, and insert pictures - its all covered in various tutorials

Edited By Timbo - Administrator on 13/03/2010 16:41:08

[TonyS]

Hi Simon,

Where do I start....

 I'm sort of new to all model flying. I started in earnest last year after a 30 year break (when I was young I flew a bit of control line and built and flew what is probably regarded as a 'vintage' Ben Buckle kit with my pals - not very successfully.

I've been flying my EDF a fair bit and my Easystar lots so I feel comfortable with flying electric. The issue with the prop was a bit dumb. I remember when I was a lad using pusher props - but hen we all used nitro motors. As Timbo rightly pointed out, these are now redundant when all you need to do to reverse the motor is swap a couple of wires around. I guess that was an easy lesson to learn.

I've only used a Spektrum Tx since coming back to the hobby. I did find the Futaba strange to get the hang of at first but find myself whizzing around the menus now.

I'm reassured to hear that it shouldn't be this hard. As for "just sticking the camera on, connecting the battery and going flying" however I think you are more than over-simplifying the process particularly if you want twin receivers for the video, and recording.

I've got a couple of errands to do then I'm going out with the Funjet. After that I'll try and get the pics you suggested. All help is very gratefully received believe me.

 

 

PS  Thanks Timbo for sorting the link.

[TonyS]

Right, back again, heart pumping. I still terrify myself every time I fly that Funjet - it's a real monster since I turned the prop the right way round  .

 

Anyway, back to the FPV...

I thought about the pics but they're already done - the set-up is exactly as I've described in the thread...

Plane as follows

The top half has only one servo(elevator) and the camera battery.

The bottom has Rx in the nose with antenna running down the bottom of the fuse and into the tube. Above this is the little LED that plugs into the flight battery and lights when I'm down to 15% ish. You can see that the ESC is mounted internally with air-scoops and vent holes cut into the fuse sides and the 'exhaust' under the motor. The servo extender is seen as a little red box in the fuse under the LE of the wing mounting hole.

The pan/tilt is as follows:

 The Tx for the cam is on a velcro patch behind the camera.

The Field box is set up like this:

The only difference today was that the patch antenna was mounted on a mini tripod next to the box when flying.

Inside the box:

The 12V Pb battery supplies the two camera receivers and the Diversity box. The Diversity box feeds the goggles and Archos DVR.

o far as I can tell it's pretty much exactly as it should be. (I know I'm no genius but I wouldn't class myself as dim either and this set-up is as near as I can get to the recommended/ per the manuals.)

So, your thoughts and recommendations please.

In the absence of any other ideas I'll plough ahead with the plan for mounting the ESC way up above the wing. 

 

I should also mention that all batteries had been fully charged before flying with the exception of the DV recorder which was about 3/4 full.

The flight battery is a 1,700mAh 3S. 

Edited By TonyS on 13/03/2010 18:22:57

[flytilbroke]

Tony, some hassles you are having. Possible cause, your RX aerial is VERY close to the "escape" and could be picking up Radio Frequency noise from it.

[Clive Matthews]

Tony, offer still stands of the loan of a Schulze RX to try. It was the only thing which solved these problems for me! They are specifically designed to cope with a 'dense' RF enviroment, with a circuit which rejects signals which are 'too loud'.

[TonyS]

FTB - that's what I'm thinking which is the idea behind mounting the ESC above the wing leaving the antenna on the bottom of the fuselage.

Clive - I will try anything and everything to sort this out and your offer is very gratefully accepted.

It's very kind of you. If you could arrange to have it delivered by a beautiful blonde 25 year old with dubious morals and a poor command of english that would really put the icing on the cake ! (Until my wife finds out!)

Thanks again 

T 

Edited By Timbo - Administrator on 14/03/2010 18:50:56

[Clive Matthews]

Well, amazingly enough, I'm on my way to Broom tomorrow for a week at the Broom Hall Inn  (Gold Cup week ). I will drop it in with a pair of crystals tomorrow.

Found suitable blonde but decided not to share! 

Edited By Clive Matthews on 14/03/2010 15:54:36

[Tim Mackey]

Tony there IS a good reason to not publish personal details on tinternet, and I have removed it for your own protection.

I have PMd Clive with it, as you should have done you lazy so and so

Clive, this forum is all about sharing, so come on, there's a good chap send a piece of suitable blonde

[TonyS]

Timbo,

Thanks I think.... Perhaps I'm too trusting or perhaps I just know how easy it is to find people's personal details anyway (too many years tracing bad payers..)

Anyway. I'll not be so lazy in future....promise.

Clive, sadly I'm not going to be around tomorrow as I have to pick my company's audit partner up from the airport then spend a day begging him to be nice about my accounts. What I will be though is at Cheltenham on Tuesday trying to win enough for another kit (or perhaps that Alfa Sabre that looks ever so tempting).

Thanks again for the loan and good luck this week.

The only hot tip I have for the races is "Don't bet more than you can afford to lose".

T 

[Clive Matthews]

No probs, I can either drop it through your letterbox, meet you at Cheltenham, or you can pop into the Broom Hall Inn. I've PM'd my mobile number.

 

I never bet. I'll be there working on the TV coverage. Show you round a TV OB setup if you're interested. 

[TonyS]

Thanks Clive,

Wicked. The letterbox is probably best as I'm 'entertaining' while at Cheltenham and though I'd probably find a tour of the TV OB set-up more interesting it might be considered rude to leave my guest who's staying from Monday until Wed. If you're around at the Inn on Wed night a swift beer could be well possible?

I'll take your mobile no to Cheltenham though - you never know your luck!!

T 

 

[Simon Dale - Firstpersonview.co.uk]

Hi Tony,

 

I got my colleague to look over your photos as well and he said the following:

 

I'd strongly suggest that he needs to do one thing at a time. Leave the fpv stuff unpowered and get the plane flying and sorted - with zero glitches. Then add the FPV stuff.

 

Might be worth telling him that we have twelve models here of which seven are fpv. One of the fpv models took us months and months to sort out - and in the end it was the r/c receiver. But we had started off assuming that the glitches were related to the fpv gear so every time we took it out we'd be trying some new variation on fpv gear placement etc.

 

Four of these models have been pigs regarding receivers. Only one of those models is FPV. We had used Hitec Electron 6 receivers - but ended up with one that works flawlessly in an FPV Wing Dragon, another that works flawlessly when wrapped in foil in a balsa own design model, and the third one mentioned above that would always provide major glitches.(Amazingly we never crashed the model - but we were lucky!)
 
We have a Schultz Alpha 5.35 in one of the none FPV models - but it is not bulletproof.(Has to be positioned a long way 6 (15cm) from the ESC.) We have Corona RP4S1 receivers in two of our Foxes - but these seem quite variable in that we have had four or five of them and two of them have been bulletproof. (The rest glitched like mad.)

After further internet research we focussed on our friend Thomas Scherrer's receiver tests http://webx.dk/rc/RX-measurements/komplet-listen.htm  and in particular the good test results with the Corona RP8D1. So we bought one of those and it totally cured the lucky model mentioned above. We are using a Corona RP6D1 in our FPV Fox - no problems. And Corona RP6D1s in our 2 x FPV Polymersions - again with faultless performance.

We are now at the stage where we would always fit one of the Coronas RP6D1 or RP8D1s and expect no problems. But we are meticulous with range checks etc and then flight tests long before we fly them FPV.

 

We get our Coronas from Giantcod - the RP8D1 is £14.65, the RP6D1 is £15.02: http://www.giantcod.co.uk/advanced_search_result.php?keywords=corona+RP

 

I hope that helps.

 

All the best

 

Simon

Edited By Simon Dale - Firstpersonview.co.uk on 14/03/2010 23:24:02

[TonyS]

Simon,

Thanks for the detailed response. As you'll have gathered from the thread Clive has volunteered a Schultz Rx for me to try in place of my Futaba Rx.

I'm convinced that the problems can be fixed by sorting out the interference problems so, Step 1 the rebuild, moving the ESC as far as poss from the radio gear. 

Step 2 Install with the Schultz Rx and do some range testing.

If I still have poor results I'll try a Corona Rx.

If it's still not perfect I'll try the foil wrapping / shielding approach.

If it still doesn't fly there'll be some very reasonable 2nd hand FPV stuff on eBay.

 

Thanks again and to your colleague.

T 

[Simon Dale - Firstpersonview.co.uk]

Hi Tony,

 

I was just thinking about your reports of the video stopping after a time and I wanted to be a bit proactive and tackle that now. 

 

Can you try running the camera at home for a time and see whether it stops transmitting please - IE if it'll run for 15 minutes on your kitchen table without dropping video then we can assume there is no problem with the camera, Tx and receiver, if it won't then send it back and we'll have a look at it.

 

If it does need to come back to us then that can be done as a parallel task now rather than holding you up after you've got everything else sorted.

 

All the best

 

Simon

 

 

[TonyS]

I'm back just for a few minutes, a few pounds lighter... £30 to be precise. Clearly my ability to pick horses is right up there with my ability to build models 

Anyway I've received the new plane (excellent service from West Wales models BTW), Clive has dropped the Schultz Rx off (Ta Clive) and I've cannibalised all the parts from the remains of the old plane. It was sort of fixable but frankly I didn't want to risk all this stuff in a "heavily modded" aiframe.

Tonight I've shortened the leads on the ESC and worked out where it will go. The hardest bit now is padding out the holes that are in the fuse sides for the elevator and rudder servos as my servos are much smaller. Not too bad at all....

 

Simon,

I'll definitely take your advice and give the camera a test - hopefully I'll be able to squeeze an hour in on this tomorrow. 

Thanks again.

T 

[Sheldon Holy]

Nice to see it's finally in the air!

There are some videos on You Tube about the Corona's having very low resolution - in that servo movements are very jerky, hence rendering them pretty much useless.

Ab bit off topic, but here is another video i've spotted:

 

I hope you like the lovely border i chose for you Although i guess it is somewhat alarming...

 

Sheldon

 

 

[Colin Naylar]

TonyS 

Your most interesting story has gone very quiet. Hope nothing disasterous has happened. Looking forward to it's resumption....

[Klippy]

Second that.

[Simon Dale - Firstpersonview.co.uk]

Last I heard was that Tony had flown the Easystar with the FPV stuff turned off, lost radio control (glitches by the sound of it) and crashed.

 

He repaired it and had another go.  This time he was happy to report a non-crashed flight and was ready to put the FPV gear on again.  He did however report that the throttle opened to full without his input a couple of times and another couple of bits of strange behaviour.

 

I said that this glitching is definitely not OK and he shouldn't fly like that again.  I suggested that he get hold of a Corona RP8D1 (£14.50 from from Giantcod) which we have 5+ of here and they have all been as good as gold - even on aircraft that were previously plagued with glitching with other Rxs (including a Schultz).  If we'd have had one spare I was going to send it to him but it would involved dismantling a model to do that.

 

Hopefully Tony has now received the Corona and can have another go with his Easystar.  I await his next installment!

[Simon Dale - Firstpersonview.co.uk]

PS I'm not sure where you got that info. Sheldon but the Coronas are absolutely perfect.  No jerkiness whatsoever.

[Klippy]

I only use Corona, and apart from difficulty deciphering the instructions, have had no problems.

[TonyS]

Fear not chaps.

Just been really busy the past couple of weeks and the odd moments I've had free it's rained.

I've received the Corona Rx from GC and tonight it'll get stuffed into the Easy.

Apart from the destructions which Tony suggests might be a little 'challenging' I don't anticipate any difficulties.

Depending on the weather this weekend we may see both this, and the Yak 23, take to the air!!

 

[Matt Halton]

Tony, do you have the synth or crystal receiver? I generally use Corona's exclusively, except for a Multiplex synth, which is faultless also,.

 

I have some Corona's synth and some standard, never a glitch.

 

 Good luck with your next RPV flight, I'm going to buy one of these systems in the next couple of months (when I'm in a better financial position to do so) I've been wanting one for ages!

 

Matt, watching with avid interest!

 

Edit: I just looked at GC's site, they are all synth.so that is what you have, undoubtedly. You will be very pleased with it's performance!

 

 

Edited By Matt Halton on 26/03/2010 19:22:26