Show and event reports in RCM&E

[David Ashby - Moderator]

Tell us if you'd like to see fewer or more flying show and event reports in RCM&E. See the front page link for more information. We'd welcome feedback, many thanks. David.

[Tim Mackey]

I think you probably have it about right, although maybe a few reports from the foreign shows ( nice jolly for Mr AW ) would be possible? - as many modellers already attend the big ones here, and therefore have seen the stuff in the flesh as it were.

I you would like to send me 2 first class tickets to some exotic location, I would be glad to do a report, with pictures, absolutely FOC

Alternatively, more reports from small local club fly-in events and the like, then we get to see what other club modellers are actually doing /flying, rather than just the big, hugely expensive, and mainly impractical beauties that dominate the big shows. Dont misunderstand me, I really enjoy seeing and reading about these objects of desire, but for balance, add some everyday club events too, after all, this sector makes up the very vast majority of your consumers.

[Brian Daniels]

I like the odd show report, its a nice change to reviews and information. It would be nice to see more reports/feedback from some of the competitions (heli and fixed wing) that are held around the country.

 I also think that they are a good chance to see some very nice models that you may not otherwise get a chance to.

[Grant Darnley]

[QUOTE]Alternatively, more reports from small local club fly-in events and the like, then we get to see what other club modellers are actually doing /flying, rather than just the big, hugely expensive, and mainly impractical beauties that dominate the big shows[/QUOTE]

Perhaps a column where clubs could send in details and a few pics of their fly-in, the qualifier being that it was advertised in the mags calendar section prior?

[Bravedan]

You probably have it right in it's currently reduced form.

I'd particularly wish to avoid the situation where x'S latest overpowered, oversized overweight and in most locations I'll ever be able to fly from totally unsuitable and unflyable jet model (this weeks' one as distinct from last week's) gets even more airtime.......again...............  (JOKE)

By all means highlight a particularly deserving show scene model, and do a full article on it..the show report tells me nothing worthwhile about it or how it flies.  I can go and see it fly if I can ever find the time, but close up detail??

I buy the US magazines, have no interest in European shows.

I LIKE the Club idea above!!! 

[Peter Miller]

Club News was always popular in the old Aeromodeller.

Quite frankly most people that I talk to have the attitude that they are not interested in competition reports. Those who are were there it those who were not don't care.

I feel that the space would be better used by meaty artilces of use to builders.

[Malcolm Fisher]

I'm with Peter re Club News - even though I'm no longer a member of a club. In the Aeromodeller days of yore, I was also a non club member and flew mainly C/L models with a few mates, but kept abreast with what was happening elsewhere with that column. I have similar views to Peter about competition reports - I have absolutely no interest in taking part in competition - I build and fly for relaxation and enjoyment.

I do like reading about some shows even though in all my years of model flying have only been to a couple as a spectator and was involved in the organisation for a few years in one held in my area of which I thoroughly enjoyed taking part. However I'm somewhat concerned about the ever growing emphasis on ever bigger, more expensive to build and operate, models which seem to predominate - most of us "ordinary mortals" don't have the space to store and transport these large aircraft, and most normal flying sites couldn't accommodate them.

[Steve Nash]

It would be good to see some pictures and reports from some of the many small club open days that go on throughout the country. It is interesting to see what other club members actually get up to and what sort of models thay are flying.

Don`t get me wrong, I`m very impressed with the superb models that are flown at some of the big shows, but it can be equally interesting to read about the thousands of aeromodellers everywhere who are flying some quite excellent planes, most of which are within reach financially of virtually all of us, and I find this very inspiring.

If small club shows aren`t featured, then how about some articles on the clubs themselves ? It would make great reading to find out about some of the characters that are lurking within our many clubs. You know the sort of people I mean: the traditionalists, who are capable of achieving those amazing finishes on their models with tissue or nylon when most of us will just end up with a twisted wreck hidden underneath some very dodgy wrinkly covering (or was that just me ?): the engineering genius, who just seems to be able to make just about anything; the club instructors, who spend so much time getting new flyers in the air; the comedians, who just make life at the flying field one long surreal experience ! You all know the sort of people I mean. There are just so many characters out there that help to keep our hobby alive and I think it would be eye opening to hear about them !

[Bravedan]

Malcolm, Spot on!!!................"However I'm somewhat concerned about the ever growing emphasis on ever bigger, more expensive to build and operate, models which seem to predominate - most of us "ordinary mortals" don't have the space to store and transport these large aircraft, and most normal flying sites couldn't accommodate them".

This increasing size trend is potentially a very serious threat to the whole hobby, along with the fact that the latest electric systems give pretty much anyone the ability to fly very very fast models........and some will fly faster and bigger/heavier than is prudent in the area they operate from.

Park flyers (legal site ones like me) should be very keen that magazines do not fuel this trend. Flying bungee launched 100mph plus models or large heavy yet still quite fast moving models in a park environment populated with people who do not understand the basics of RC flight is a potential for incidents, increased legislation and loss of sites.

My 27" 270 gramme Delta is not inherently "threatening" in the same way as even a 72" model is. The other day in a public open space I watched modellers fly 1. A 150 mph plus Hotliner and 2. a large scale Mustang which consumed a large slice of the park at very high speed in order to land. Innocent fun or desperately irresponsible, you decide!!

Don't think because you fly "private" that this doesn't apply.......in this cramped country you are never very far from people and property!!

The fact is I COULD store, transport and afford the big ones, but for my (and many other people), these models are environmentally unsuitable. The sad fact is that the more magazines report, advertise and appear as a result to unrestrictingly promote them, the more likely it becomes that the hobby will suffer greater legislative restriction. 

For example, the bodies controlling the setting of and responsibility for Bylaws are likely to change soon, with complete rewriting probably following.  Nobody wants to be a killjoy, but lets see some more pro-active promotion of the more environmentally suitable model types please.

[country flier]

The content of RCM&E seems always quite good. Adding the show and event segments is one way to illustrate what occurs. From my vantage point here in the States that is a way to get a look at how folks in the UK approach aeromodelling.

Living in a rural area makes venues like RCM&E all the more valued for the variety of subject matter. The in magazine plans are one attraction surely. Needless to say I did activate a subscription and would welcome such items as air show/events in the coverage; pictures being worth a thousand words and all.

Harold 

[Peter Miller]

For years I have been concerned about the flying of large and giant models at shows. This is for two reasons.

First, Joe Public gets the impression that that is the way that they have to go and they don't want to fly smaller models. Recently a club member was in a model shop where a customer wanted a huge trainer with a big petrol engine as  a first model.

The second reason is even more important. If (or rather when) a giant model goes out of control and ploughs into the crowd it is goinng to cause more harm to the hobby that all the shows in the world do good. Only last year a relatively small and slow biplane killed two and injured several others in Hungary. The cause was interferrence.

Imagine if the B-52 of a year or so ago that crashed off the airfield had gone the other way into a  crowd.

I know that the organisers like big models because they are spectacular and easy for the public to see at a distance.

Let's pray very hard that the spectacle is in the flying only and that the public don't get a much MUCH closer view of them

[Flanker .]

Please please keep up the show reports, I do not live in the UK so I can't go to the shows.

when ever I see a show report featured, that is what I read first.

Also yes, more from around the world would be great, ie whos biggest, fastest, highest, fattest, stupidist, smallist etc, I know you can't affors to send hacks all over the globe, but I bet there are amature photografers all over who would share their snaps if asked.

I like the content that you have now, I'd just like more detail on things, who made the first model turbo prop, how do they work, juicy photos of their insides, what happened to JPX engines ? what are Futaba planning ? etc. Keep it up. F 

[Malcolm Fisher]

If spetaators want to see large aircraft in operation then, IMO they should go to the full size air displays where they can see the real thing being flown from on board rather than a half or two thirds size copy being operated from the ground - however exciting that may be.

 Even at full size shows, accidents can happen.

[nasa_steve]

hi all

   i think the relatively small and slow biplane you mention was actually a 1/2 scale pitts or something around that mark, far from small or slow in my eye's. the crowd line at that particular show was only a few meters from the display line meaning if anything did go wrong as it sadly did the model would be in the crowd a lot sooner than it would have done at one of the excellently run large model events held in this country. normal pre 7kg models fly at a minimum of 30m from a crowd line in the UK anything over has to have failsafe built in and 20kg plus has to have double redundant systems and fly 60meters as par for the course which i'm sure you are aware.

     as far as i was aware there is no one to my knowledge actively promoting large or 100mph+ models as park fliers they are far from that and should never ever be promoted as such. on top of that anyone who is flying models like this in a public place deserves to have them taken away as they are asking for trouble in a big way.

i personally think RCM&E could cover a few more fly-in type events as well it would be nice to see what else is going on apart from the show scene which i do see a lot of as i fly at a lot of them.

nasa

[Clive Moore]

I'd like to see more focus on local clubs and a bit less on large shows. It would be good to see some more articals on models that have been built and flown with detail on the problems encountered during the build and how they were overcome etc.

A bit less focus on all those ARTFs would be good. I'm not suggesting that you shouldn't do reviews of ARTFs but they do seem to dominate the content each month.

A few more articals on building from plans / kits would also be great especialy scale. 

[Peter Miller]

The report of the Pitts that I saw said 6 foot span but I know that newspaper reports are normally wrong. I suspect that it was a lot slower than say, a 1/3rd scale Me 262 or any other jet for that matter and 70 meters or what ever is not a lot when interferrence has wiped out the radio link on a jet.

Good to see that lots of others agree with wanting more meaty articles on the technicalities of the hobby.

[Flanker .]

Sadly not all that is fun can be 100% safe, and sadly 100% safe is boring, ask any motorcyclist or mountain climber. The important thing is already done in the UK, you DO do the dangerous stuff, but set good safety rules and stick to them, and change and improve them as necessary.

The greater worry in the UK, where it seems that the fun police never know when to stop is fast jets. 250 mph is now affordable to many and is getting RTF and cheaper all the time, a serious accident WILL happen and how the authorities respond is anybodies guess.       It worries me because the high end of this sport brings  tech developments that benefit us all.

How do you police fun ?

Would you still fly jets if you had to do a "driving test" ?

Or big models ?

Or Small models,

Would you buy a park flier if you needed a licence?

Would paperwork and tests prevent accidents ?

On a small over crowded island sports that need space to be safe are a REAL issue.  I think with big models the public are no more at risk than at a real air show and much safer than at a motor rally, let alone watching a footie match ! How many members of the public have been killed at full size air shows in the UK over the last 50 years ? How about in eastern Europe ? Hmmmm  Come on lets not start this tedious winging about small vs big again ! Aero modeling is cool FULL STOP

[Victor Saliba]

Dear David, I came to Sundown 5 years ago and to wings and wheels 2 years ago thanks to adverts and articles in RCM&E. I spent a fortune since I had to come from Malta. I was lucky enough to meet late Paul Landels on both occasions, plus I had some excellent bargains. Please publish more shows packed with pictures.It also helps tourism.

[nasa_steve]

peter

    i can assure you it was more 12' and powered by a westlake 350cc twin if memory serves me correctly a fair bit different than the 6 foot model reported in the press i have seen the video footage from the scene and the model was flat out when it went in to the crowd. i don't think speed has any consequence when you are talking about models of this size anyway.  it was also apparent that there was very little if any safety barrier at this particular show. i am aware of your love of small models but that don't float everyone's boat!!

     with regards to model jets being affordable you must have much deeper pockets than i and a very understanding wife because i don't see £1200+ as affordable for engine alone.

back to the job in hand me thinks maybe this part of this thread should be taken off to the moans and groans section as the fun police are surely out in force here!!!!!

p.s you are supposed to do a "driving test" to fly any model in a show enviroment and another to fly large models as well!!

[Peter Miller]

Hi Steve.

As I said, I only read the newspaper report and know how inaccurate they usually are.

I wouldn't want to stop anyone flying what they want but I am concerend about the fun Police and what they will do to modelling  in general in the event of a major accident.

We only have to look at the hysteria after Dunblane. All legally held guns used for target practice banned. Olympic sportsmen who have to go to France to practice for their event. Of course we all know just how effective that has been at stopping gun crime, don't we.

Testing people is faily useless if driving on the roads is anything to go by but at least it proves that the tested person knows what they are supposed to do. What they actually do is another matter.

Thinking of the fun police again. I recall about 20 years ago a council decided that no model larger than 36" span should be flown on council ground. Try a Club 20 racer going like stink, not quite what they had in mind but it would have been legal but more lethal than a 72" span Piper Cub.

I don't know who said jets are affordable, (not to me) but it is amazing how many there are around now.

[Malcolm Fisher]

Once again, IMO, Peter is "right on the ball.

I expected that my earlier posts would class me as a "winger", as I expressed concern about large models.

Many years ago I saw an accident involving a six inch span catapult launched all balsa glider. It was launched by a child on a Holiday Project and just as he released, another child ran across the flight path and the glider hit him in an eye - a chance in a million? He had to have hospital treatment and, fortunately only suffered minor damage which didn't affect his sight., but the incident created a situation where model aircraft were effectively banned from the project in succeding years even though many of the participating children had thoroughly enjoyed making and flying the "chuckies".

[Dave Bran]

I suggest if people consider speed not to matter relative to size/weight they arrange to stand in front of a moving car at 10 mph and then hobble in front of it again at 50 mph, then come back and repeat their thoughts.............  if they can     .

I was a display pilot in the 70's.......fetes, etc up to Sandown, Kempton, etc. We were often asked to fly in ridiculously bad locations...........we didn't........but we knew other teams that did, once offered after us!!!

Yesterday two of us were flying in a park, quite legally, quite alone......when Granny with two dogs and toddler (and so not in proper control of any) decides to come and see what we were doing, to show Grandson close up.........both of us saw the hazard beginning to appear and as both of us were well down on battery capacity we both immediately landed, showed our models to a future Aeromodeller (!) once they reached us, and gently explained we'd not fly again till she'd moved out of zone.

Back strictly to thread.  I don't have any issue with Show Reports, Big Models or Jets per se but I firmly believe that magazines and reviewers have a responsibility to ensure that readers are aware of the environmental requirements for operation. Without of course ramming it down their throats!!

The Typhoon (latest Special) is a case in point.......super plane, nice model, excellent job in producing it in little time...........want one.........electric of course.............

But, BUT, built as per plan and probably power recommendation, just like the test model, what sort of space to operate does it need (no flaps, I note).....how long a take off run, how steep a climb out is possible,  and even more critically, how long a landing run should I expect??  It's got castoring tailwheel, what's it like on short park/landing strip grass, is it steerable right to stop......does it weathercock?.......all we are told is that it is "uncomplicated"!!

Something this major (and good!) should have been launched with several pilots comments attached!!!!  (Please?)

  

[John Rickett 102]

David,

I would like you to continue with attending and reporting on shows. It doesn't of course have to be only those where the LMA members are presenting and flying their models, though clearly because their models are attractive to the public then these are the most known and attended shows; pictures of the models appear in the magazines from other contributors anyway. I would gladly read reports from the tiniest of shows - provided the models held something of interest to report, unfortunately for me that doesn't include the average ARTF that can be seen at any club field An enthusiastic reporter could write reams on how skillfully the box was opened, unaided, without damaging the contents but I think a modelling magazine should be able to impart more wisdom than that!  

I cannot get to all the shows and I suspect neither can most of those flyers who try to display their models at events. Its also probably the case that most of the readership can't visit them all, so at any show there will always be something different on which to report.

I am inspired by some of the models that are built, especially those one-offs that started from a blank sheet of paper, so any information that can be gleaned and passed on us subscribers and insatiable modellers, would be welcome. I especially like to see the detail, so crisp close-ups of the model on the ground please, the pictures don't have to always show the model airborne, where of course most of the detail becomes just a speck.

Whatever model you home in on, why not conduct a short interview with the builder/flyer asking perhaps what he found attractive about this particular model? what peculiarities did it have during the building stage, or the test flying? Anything special about the construction or finishing? None of this has to be lengthy but it would add a bit more spice and perhaps demonstrate that no matter how many shows are visited there is always something different and new.  

Keep up the good work

Chessiegolf       

[Peter Miller]

HI Chessiegolf.

What you are really asking for is more articles on technique and building etc. because you won't get the information in a show report. You might get a hint or tip if you are lucky.

[nasa_steve]

dave

    you seem to miss my point the model we refered to is over 20kg so whether its doing 30mph or 100mph if it lands or falls on top of you from any height its gonna hurt if it does'nt kill you . it actually killed 2 people so i'm sure given the circumstances it would have caused injury whatever speed it was doing THAT was my point!!!

nasa