Chris Bott - Moderator Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Posted by Andy Green on 05/07/2012 12:59:15: To be honest with a couple of noticable exceptions not many buildt last years mass build, Andy Apart from the 84 models built by 60 builders that were added to the rollcall in the end... and there are still some builds going on. Personally I think talk of next years is a little premature. I like the idea of leaving the vote until September. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 My suggestion would be a general warbirds theme. This would be anything that can be legitimately be given a military colour scheme, so could cover funfighters, Flair scouts, plan builds, edf jets, WW2 and WW1 fighters, BirdDogs and Austers - and lots more. It would give an opening for anyone and everyone from scratchbuilders to RTFs. Otherwise I'm ok with funfighters or retro, both are in stock Lots already have Wots, so that would have a limited appeal as new builds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Concorde Speedbird Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 The Wot 4 idea was mine, and like I said on page 3, forget about it, no one is interested apart from me Funfighters sounds alright, and it is the most popular from what I have seen. Club 25 would provide a wide range, including Pegasus Jester biplanes of which I am a big fan. What about own designs? It would be nice to see more people designing their own planes. CS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bandit Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 I'm up for fun fighters / war birds, and it should not exclude the people who do not want to build their own models. I do feel that there should be an upper size limit, iether wing span or motor size in order to keep cost down and therefore enable the maximum number of people to partake should they wish to do so. OD's, plan built, kit built, ARTF and RTF's should all be elegible and IC Electric should be a matter of coice for the individual. It should also not be restricted to singe engine types as long as a maximum wing span is stipulated for twin and four engine types ie 48" for single engine and 72" for twin and up to four engine types. There's kits and plan wood packs on the market at reasonable prices for anyone who wants to go that way. Just my two pennth's worth. Cheers, Chris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olly P Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Any Fun-Fighter or warbird should count in MHO. If you want to build something at peanut scale (and I Probably will) then that is fine, if you want to build a 14 ft, quad engined monster, then that should count too, and so should ARTF/OD/Plan/Kit etc. I think they are all valid for a mass build - the more the merrier! I might even be tempted to build a peanut scale one with a tiny motor and then a larger version for PSS. Olly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bandit Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Ho Olly, I'm probably being a bit slow, but what Does MHO mean!. I agree with the more the merryer, and I'd like to see a 14 foot monster Lanc, B17 or such but the average builder shouldn't be put off building or flying with what they can sensibly cope with. How do you get two channels and a power train in a peanut scale job , I'm struggling with the West Wings stick and tissue jobs. Cheers, Chris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martyn K Posted July 5, 2012 Author Share Posted July 5, 2012 Hi Chris. I think there is an 'I' missing - it usually means "in my honest opinion".. Regarding the buildathon,I don't really care what we decide on, but it should be consistent so that similar models are made available next June. Regards Martyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinstar Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Id like to see a mass build model that can be flown either power or pss, something like a yak 130 or alpha jet with strteched wings for the Pss version. link or how about a hotliner glider ? or a valiant becase you done see them done as RC models very often, or, heck why not all three of the V bombers (vulcan victor and valiant) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Kearney Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 +1 for something for a 25 and also +1 for something retro. Ive been pondering building a smaller El Gringito (link to plan on outerzone) recently, 25 up front, EFlite (or similar) electric retracts, mini pattern ship from the 70's! r. Edited By Robin Kearney on 05/07/2012 22:26:13 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bandit Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Posted by Martyn K on 05/07/2012 21:44:11: Hi Chris. I think there is an 'I' missing - it usually means "in my honest opinion".. Regarding the buildathon,I don't really care what we decide on, but it should be consistent so that similar models are made available next June. Regards Martyn Hi Martyn, Thanks for the clarification, TBH I'm a bit slow with abbreviations , and regarding the buildathon I agree it should be consistent. Still fancy seeing a peanut 3 channel job though or a 14 foot Lanc . Cheers, Chris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Hargreaves - Moderator Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 I'm confused by this concept of including ARTFs into a "mass build"....I don't have anything against ARTFs....indeed I have several but the clue is in the title isn't it....a mass.....build!!! Initially I quite fancied the Fun Fighter idea but on reflection I'm more inclined to the RCM&E free plans.....it is an RCM&E event after all & the range is vast....most are quite simple with some very simple designs in there that might encourage people to "have a go" I also think that it is important to have a common "theme" running too......we've had the Webbit build & the Vintage build so all the models at least had something in common....some of the suggestions above are very wide. Obviously all model aircraft will be welcome at the fly in.....thats the idea of a fly in after all but if we are going to have a specific "Mass Build" it should surely be that...a build....& the models should at least have something in common.... Just my 2p..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Fenton Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 I am with Steve on this one, personally I thought the mass buid was to share ideas methods, techniques etc so that a modeller unfamiliar with building could follow along and apply what they see to their own build. I think we are sort of diluting the reason for the mass build by opening it to almost anything. That is just building and, anything is welcome at the fun fly. I think we should all build the same model or at least models from the same range. Hence me thinking Fun fighters was probably a good one to chose. If we want to approach Cambrian and ask if they will do us a deal and raise some money for charity then again I am all for that. We will not have that sort of power if we are not doing it together. I feel the Vintage was a good idea, but the original thought was that we would all build the same one, perhaps specially designed by one of the many great designers/members of this forum. The Webbit worked because we all built the same one, even though we may have done it for the charity aspect more than the models design. Again just my 2p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Hargreaves - Moderator Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 It is a very hard line to draw......I guess ideally everyone would build the same model & much fun could be had in noting the variations in technique etc.......(I know that Danny, as a detailitis sufferer would get immense satisfaction in just comparing the varying degrees of overlap of the covering film.....I can picture him knelt by each model with his vernier calipers...."H'mmm interesting......only 5.2mm overlap around the wingtip on this one.......much less than the statistical average of 9.78mm" However choosing just one model would limit the number of people willing to put scalpel to balsa.....spare time is precious & I for one wouldn't build something I wasn't much interested in. For this reason the range of models needs to be a bit wider, simply to get more participants....but equally shouldn't be too wide or the idea loses its meaning..... I've run out of 2ps now so I'm going to shut up......(sounds of mass cheering!!!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Fenton Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 Ahhh Steve you know me so well......... And it would be rivet spacing surely. Everybody would rivet and panel line a funfighter wouldn't they? film covering ooooooo no no no (where is the tongue in cheek emoticon when you need it) I think you would build one Steve, if it was for charity. Choosing one model resulted in 82 Webbits being built, so I am not sure I would agree Cheers Danny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 but this year there was no concensus, resulting in a few Super 60s, a few Matadors and miscellaneous others, but still a good number of models were built. I think a lot thought the same as Steve- why build a model with no real appeal to me for one day's flying? Vintage was a good theme as these models really are 'builds' resulting in some excellent build threads with resultant discussions - job done. Most used similar construction methods so those methods could be adapted to similar models, but how much building is involved in a funfighter? I'm guessing most variation would be in finishing methods and detailing. I'm thinking that to engage the maximum number of participants we could have two elements to the fly-in. 1) The Build - for those who like to stick bits of wood and skin together while soaking them in blood. Take your pick, a single model or a theme. 2) The Fly-In - for everyone, builders and flyers. While welcoming all models we could still have a theme for the day whether it be Retro, Vintage, Club 2(0)5 or Warbirds, maybe with a couple of time slots just for themed models. This might encourage the ARTF flyers to join in as well. Edited By Bob Cotsford on 06/07/2012 10:48:28 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olly P Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 Bob - the 'funfighter' I am thinking off, will be a scaleish peanut size 3 channel job built from plans, originally intended for FF.... To me 100% built from scratch, including some significant mods to add none rubber based power (careful) and control surfaces! I think by fun-fighter I took it to mean anything that looked like a 'warplane' but not neccessarilly a 100% bonafide scale model! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Hargreaves - Moderator Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 Interesting Olly.....I think the term "Fun Fighter" referred to a specific series of kits. The term was initially coined by Cambrian kits in the late 70's & referred to their range of models...a Spitfire, a Mustang, an ME109 (I think) & I'm sure there was a 4th model too..... Cambrian went bust ages ago but several others have resurected the kits....currently available here Basically they are simple quick build models around 40" span for a 20 or 25 sized motor.....great fun but not really designed to appeal to the scale purists..... Oooops I said I was going to shut up...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Hargreaves - Moderator Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 My gen-u-ine Cambria Funfighter Spitfire circa about 1980.....I still have the pilot..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 To me, Funfighter means a .20/.30 size character scale model of a WW2 fighter along the lines of the Cambria models Steve linked to - around 1/8 scale IIRC. Anything else just comes under the term 'warbird'. Ain't semantics great? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Fenton Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 This was mine circa late 70's you might even see the odd camm lock picked out above the exhaust.... early sign of the onset of "Detailitis" I am sure....... Cheers Danny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 ps - cross linking threads, Galaxy do a nice Typhoon, unless I got the final one last week! Edited By Bob Cotsford on 06/07/2012 11:07:59 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bandit Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 Hi Bob, Just had a look and it's not listed now, Also looked on the Cambrian site, 4 listed, Spitfire, P51, Hurricane, and ME109 all at £69.99 All 42" except the Hurricane at 43". I'd get out more but it's raining so I've gone through the 79 pages of RCM&E plans The Mk 9 Spit from Tony Nijhuis looks good at 46" for a 25 with a full pack available. RC1325/6 Dogfight double plans 401/2" Spit and 421/2" ME109 for .20 IC. MAG 156 Mitsubishi Zero 40" for a 25, and the build article's available. Theres also two small models, Zero and F4U electric at 31 1/2" . RC2023 Tony Nijhuis Mosquito for electric at 38". and a 47" version for electric or IC. RSQ1697 Sea Fury at 48" for a 35 to 50. RM481 P51 40" for a 25 MAG124 Hurricane Mk1 from Dave Boddington 47" span for a 25. And theres always the option for scaling rubber or IC FF plans and adapting to suit your favourite building methods I recon .25 IC or electric equivalent is about right for power, and detail down to the individual but they could all qualify as fun fighters. Cheers, Chris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Bott - Moderator Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 That's a decent list Chris, if funfighters is the mass decision. There's a few others here too, designed for electric. RBC Warbirds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bandit Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 Hi Chris, As it's raining I thought I'd get a list of possible builds together, the list I've done is actually much longer as I've looked at some scale jobs and Peter Miller designs at about the same size. I've already got a Turbulent Plan and was looking at the Tipsy Junior both for 25's. As I'm bored now I'll look at Tim Hooper plans later. Cheers, Chris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 ok, Im bored too. I don't actually own a .25, I do have an Evo .36 and a Galaxy Tiffie kit though. While the Evo could be squeezed in quite easily, the other option would be electric. So fun fighters - around 4lb be right? Say 5-600W needed. All my Lipos are 3 cell, so I'd need to be running at around 45-50A for 3s, so I'd need two packs to get the current. Wire them in series and we're talking around 25A, much nicer to deal with. A 2200 weighs 200gms or thereabouts, so that's 400gm for batteries, say 120gms for a motor, 40gm for the ESC, 30gm for a UBEC - what's that come to - around 600gms. Against 360ish gms for the Evo, 40 gms for a servo and what's a tank? 50gms? 450gm total for IC. Thats about 6oz less. Back to electric with one pack and we're in the same ballpark on weight, but limited to 350 or so watts or a short flight and hot pack. I can't help feeling that a funfighter on 350W wouldn't be a lot of fun. Opinions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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