Harold J Towner plans, has anyone here built from them?

[martin collins 1]

I am looking at some of the more unusual scale planes that Harold J Towner did plans for many years ago, they can be found on the Outerzone website. I would like to try building some of them including the Bristol Beaufort which was for twin .049 glow engines at 37" span. Has anyone on here built one of his designs, i believe the plans or kits were sold by Astral.........Martin

[kevin b]

I think you will find many modellers have built from his plans over the years, so expect a lot of feedback !

They are "of an age" and are no different to other plans drawn at that time by other respected designers. I will assume that you are building electric powered, in which case you should be able to lighten the build in a few areas to allow for the battery weight (.049 engines usually had integrated tanks and din't carry much fuel).

[PatMc]

The plan on OZ has been re-drawn & probably altered in number of respects to suit more modern building methods.
The original Bristol Beaufort by HJT certainly wasn't powered by ,049 glow engines. It was almost certainly rubber powered if it ever flew. There's a fair chance it was never more than a static model, albeit well built & detailed. I think that it's most likely that the vast majority of those built from the Astral kits were only ever envisaged as static display models by their purchaser.

[brokenenglish]

Pat, I don't think your assumption is correct.

All HJT's early designs were rubber powered, and I have actually seen a couple fly, although, at the time, as you say, many were probably "static".
However, over the latter part of his design "career", HJT designed quite a few power models, usually control-line.
You'll no doubt remember his super scale Tiger Moth plan (RC or FF), published in Aeromodeller (March 1972), but he also published (all in Aeromodeller) a Lancaster, a Beagle and a Dragon Rapide, all ic powered and all control-line (I think). And maybe others, these are just the ones I remember.

Finally, if any of his ic power plans had been "modified" from an earlier rubber model, then no doubt someone would come up with the earlier rubber powered version at some time and, personally, I've never seen one single case of that occurring.

[mal brewer]

I wouldn't have thought that any of H J Towner's rubber powered twin or four-engined models ever flew. The rubber drive motor was angled from the nacelles to a central anchorage point in the fuselage,at an angle of between 30-40 degrees. I would say that the system was quite unworkable. I remember an 'Astral' kit for a 'Beaufighter', designed by H J T employing this system.It was a wartime kit,and all part were printed on what appeared to be obeche,which further lessened the chances of success.So yes, I would say most,if not all, of the mult-engine models were built as static models........................Mal

[Alan Gorham_]

I've got an old Aeromodeller from the early 1990s with an article devoted to the Astral rubber powered twins. They were built and flown by Doug McHard and the article had several obviously genuine flying shots.

As to whether they would make decent r/c powered models, well the fact that nobody seems to have done so speaks volumes.

[mal brewer]

Hi Alan, that really does surprise me. As I stated, I would have thought the system completely unworkable.Obviously I was wrong ( once again ).I suppose if anybody could get it to work it would be Doug McHard,he built a few off=beat models himself.I still take some convincing though !..........................Mal

[PatMc]

Posted by brokenenglish on 21/08/2020 21:32:39:

Pat, I don't think your assumption is correct.

All HJT's early designs were rubber powered, and I have actually seen a couple fly, although, at the time, as you say, many were probably "static".
However, over the latter part of his design "career", HJT designed quite a few power models, usually control-line.
You'll no doubt remember his super scale Tiger Moth plan (RC or FF), published in Aeromodeller (March 1972), but he also published (all in Aeromodeller) a Lancaster, a Beagle and a Dragon Rapide, all ic powered and all control-line (I think). And maybe others, these are just the ones I remember.

Finally, if any of his ic power plans had been "modified" from an earlier rubber model, then no doubt someone would come up with the earlier rubber powered version at some time and, personally, I've never seen one single case of that occurring.

Brian, I didn't say that the Beaufort didn't fly, I said that if it had flown it would almost certainly have been rubber powered. I based the latter on the date quoted by OZ.

As for being the Beaufort being modified from rubber to 049 glow power, I wasn't suggesting that HJT modified his own plan, I was speculating that it was re-drawn by someone else. OZ credits the plan to Astral & dates it at 1940 but text on the plan mentions the aircraft being in service until 1943. Also, as you will know, glow engines were not "invented" until some time post war, the engine drawn on the plan appears to be a non specific 049 but of late '60 on style but untypical in being shaft induction & beam mounted .
Steve normally goes to some trouble to check the provenance of OZ plans but there are some obvious anomalies with this one.

[brokenenglish]

OK Pat. Steve does a great job, but there are many dating errors, simply because people have given Steve wrong information.

HJT's early plans (forties) were published through Astral, and I think they are all rubber powered.

This Beaufort plan isn't Astral, it's one of the small glow-powered plans that HJT drew during the sixties. There are many examples (Antonov, Anson, Grumman Duck, etc.).

So IMO, there is no anomaly "on the plan". It's a problem of plan identification. It's not a forties Astral plan, it's a sixties HJT plan, end of story.