Junior 60

[Stephen Grigg]

I have heard about the Junior 60 but until yesterday,had not seen 1 fly.I was surprised at how gently and slowly and easily it was doing touch and goes. It seemed to gain height so slowly and effortlessly.The gent flying it  called a dead stick when quite high and a couple of hundred yards over and glided effortlessly round on a perfect flight path to make a perfect landing.So ,Is it a good trainer?

[Bert]

Stephen

It's a very good basic trainer in calm conditions, but like all these converted free-flight models it can be a struggle if it gets windy.

The other downside to this type of model for training is that after a while you will find yourself limited by not having ailerons and will need another model to progress.

That said, they are good flyers, as you have seen, and if you build your own you will have had the true aeromodelling experience of flying what you build.

Bert

[Ernie]

Hi Stephen, I had one, I could trim it to fly in circles, and lay the tranny down, and go and have a cup of tea. Also, its a good build

ernie

[Stephen Grigg]

Thanks Ernie and Bert, Ihave plumpt for the 73" flair Cub because of the aerolons(lack of)

[Bert]

Stephen

 That's a good model to go for, and as you become proficient you can get an aileron wing for it.

As there is a bit of building involved you will also get the TAE (true aeromodelling experience)

Not that there is anything wrong with 'planes without ailerons, I have several (including a J60) and they are great fun to fly. It's just that you will outgrow the R&E trainer quite quickly as you progress.

Bert

[Howard Tomlin]

I learnt on a super 60 rudder elevator only,

then progressed to a rudder elevator tinker  biplane,

then a hepcat, rudder elevator vintage thing,

then a howard metcalfe models (are they still around?) moonraker a smy first aileron trainer,

Acrowot

Wolfgang Matt "joker" pattern ship,

 and on and on and on up to the models i have now which are mix of scale,3d, pattern mono and biplanes.

having a plane which will fly itself (if all else fails) is a bonus,  the confidence you will have when moving to ailerons will be much higher if you have some rudder elevator experience.

I still fly rudder elevator, and the guy i'm teaching to fly at the moment is using a radio queen on rudder elevator and is doing very well!!

[Stephen Grigg]

Thanks Bert andHoward, Today was a bad flying day I had 2 Aerolon models, 1 Eletric Pioneer that took off left when I had right rudder  flipped over and destroyed itself.I then flew aProtech Azzura with my instructor and landed it for the first time.After lunch a 2nd  Instructor Took off for me but when he handed me the controller I was disorientated with the model and it seemed to be flying much to fast for me,and I froze, unable to decide what to do. The model was cming towards me At a fairly steep dive and before I could react had buried into the ground.I  was    devastated.My local shop has a S/H Junior 60 with an OS.15  and radio gear complete for £130. Ive offered £100,which he has refused.I want to continue with aerolons because
I want to do more than potter. Am I running before I can walk

[Howard Tomlin]

well its horses for courses, you'll know when you're running before you can walk as your instructor will tell you so (and tailor your lessons to suit)or you'll attempt a flight on your own too early and possibly stuff it in.

You'll gain confidence quicker with a model that you're not frightened of, and believe me there's nothing frightening with a junior 60.

With the right instructor and a standard aileron trainer you'll get your confidence in time, and you will be straight on to ailerons

 the timescale is down to how quickly you get your confidence up and in some cases its easier to get confidence with a slow flying easy to take off / land model like a junior 60 and then move on to a  4ch.channel model.

One advantage with a 4 channel trainer is that they generally have more "penetration" in windy conditions as any model with a light wing loading and loads of dihedral (junior 60 etc.) can be flipped around when a gust gets under the wing.

 Why dont you try someone elses 4 channel trainer with your instructor to see what the difference is and see which you think you will make more progress with?

 I'm also a very keen advocate of flight sims ( phoenix etc.) as these can teach you the basics, in any weather , from your living room. Stick time is everything and a sim can give you that stick time to get you confident with the model. Of course its only 90% realistic as in real life when you stuff it in you need to repair not just reset, but you will find that you can be adventurous with your flying and learn what works and what doesnt. I'll bet you money you'll pull off a nice (sim) landing within a week....

BTW. are you flying buddy lead?- this makes a big difference to the time allowed for the rescue of a plumetting trainer - if your instructor is on the ball the situation shouldnt arise in the first place....

Howard

[Ernie]

Hi Stephan, Don't let it get to you. Thedisaster happens to every model flyer, you simply have to accept that you will bin bag things from time to time. My own solution is to always try to have enough cash put aside so that when I bin one, I can get something new. Also put the broken bits away for a few weeks, its amazing what can be fixed when your mindset gets more positive. I'd always go straight to 4 chanels, much as I love the 60, Howard is dead right, It's a lovely plane for a calm evening, but not so good in a wind..I'd get that flair cub in hand...built up wing, and ailerons.

ernie

[Stephen Grigg]

Hi Ernie Ive got the kit and the engine and when i finish the Magnatila and Boomerang it will be underway for the spring

[Howard Tomlin]

To be fair (or Flair!!) the magnatila is a good trainer.

[Stephen Grigg]

I need it to be at the moment Ernie

[Stephen Grigg]

Id like to get a Junior 60 and I understand there is 1 coming up that has been built two thirds normal size ,any comments?

[Ernie]

Hi Stephen,

Bigger the better, Easier to see, seems to fly slower, definately flies smoother, looks more impressive on the flightline, I'd go for a big one

ernie

[Stephen Grigg]

Thanks Ernie.

[ken anderson.]

hello stephen you've allready had loads of words of wisdom-i learnt to fly radio models in 1988-89 and after my second model the flair magnatilla-i built a junior 60 for the summer evenings in 1991-i still have it complete with it's second engine--the only trouble with going onto a jnr 60 at the stage you are now at is-you will be totally comfortable with one (but)when you move onto something faster and more responsive you won't know whats hit you--liken a milk float to a sports car--buy/build -- one but master the basics first and step back to a jnr 60.magnatilla will give you loads of confidence--good luck.

                                                                                                                      ken.

[Hamish]

Had my Magnatilla up yesterday and it scared the wits out of me.  It was too windy and it got carried away (I lost control) and was heading for tera firma at a high rate of knots.  Luckily I responded before the inevitable but took the immediate action of bringing it safely down.  Although on reflection I got a buzz out of the experience, with some unprompted aerobatic moves and landing on the runway, it was not what I wanted as a learner.  I will keep the Magnatilla for calmer days as hopefully I can continue to get a lot of entertainment from it, as it is a good trainer.

Then took my rebuilt Boomerang up and although still being buffeted about I had a bit more confidence.  Found as I had adjusted aileron throws, as recommended, I had little turning ability in the wind and need to use rudder, which was a new experience, again part of the learning curve.  Further adjustment and back up  in the winds which had receded slightly although I consider you do advance your learning in the wind rather than perfect conditions all the time.

Roll on next outing.

 

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]

[Stephen Grigg]

Hamish did you figure out what caused your boomerang to crash and Eric thats what Ive learnt ,hence the buddy,and Ken thats how I feel.

[Hamish]

Stephen   I have no exact reason why it crashed. I have subsequently changed the transmitter and receiver. The Sanwa has a button for trainer mode away from the  spring switch which I now have in Futaba. I suspect that unfamiliararity and not communicating very well may have been the reason.  I now do not use the buddy box however would advise you to make clear who has control.  As I said I do not no exactly why   and have just put it down to learning

[Stephen Grigg]

My instructor makes it very clear who has control, very military" you have control,"I have control "In a load voice  back and if I dont reply"Do you have control"  Possibly