Futura57 Posted August 4, 2023 Share Posted August 4, 2023 Following the success of my Top Quark design I created a variant I call Bottom Quark. Basically I have switched the wings around so the front wing is at the bottom of the fuselage and the rear wing is mounted halfway up the fin. I have created and flown a Depron prototype in the last couple of days. My intention is to build a balsa version as soon as time permits. Granted, it's not the most attractive aircraft. But when modelled in balsa with a curvaceous fuselage and tasteful covering scheme it will be passable 🤣 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyB Posted August 4, 2023 Share Posted August 4, 2023 1 hour ago, Futura57 said: Following the success of my Top Quark design I created a variant I call Bottom Quark. Basically I have switched the wings around so the front wing is at the bottom of the fuselage and the rear wing is mounted halfway up the fin. I have created and flown a Depron prototype in the last couple of days. My intention is to build a balsa version as soon as time permits. Granted, it's not the most attractive aircraft. But when modelled in balsa with a curvaceous fuselage and tasteful covering scheme it will be passable 🤣 Very interesting model. There is a guy in the US who has designed multiple iterations of joined wing canards for the slope, they seem to fly surprisingly well all things considered… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Walsh Posted August 4, 2023 Share Posted August 4, 2023 And there's me thinking a Bottom Quark was what you did after three pints of Guinness and a chicken vindaloo! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyB Posted August 4, 2023 Share Posted August 4, 2023 Your model also has some similarities to the Synergy Aircraft Doible Boxtail prototype in some ways. Sadly that project has been mired in politics for many years, though apparently having sacked the founder they are now nearing completion of the first manned prototype… (25% proto, v18 of 32!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Z Posted August 5, 2023 Share Posted August 5, 2023 My OD Diamona 2.0., perfect flyer. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyB Posted August 5, 2023 Share Posted August 5, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, Max Z said: My OD Diamona 2.0., perfect flyer. I knew there was another one I’d seen on here some time ago… great design! https://www.sarikhobbies.com/product/diamona-plan/ What did you change in v2 - just the necessary tweaks for lipos and a brushless motor? Edited August 5, 2023 by MattyB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Futura57 Posted August 5, 2023 Author Share Posted August 5, 2023 I was expecting a number of similar designs to come out of the woodwork, given that the Warren-Wing and Box-Wing configurations are not new. I had already seen the Rombus and Infinity wing designs (very recently). My excuse is I started by resurrecting a 1980 design of mine from when I was oblivious to these. No prizes for reinventing the wheel though, right. As my late dad used to say to me about my modelling hobby, 'At least it keeps you off the streets son'. 😢 Yes, but not off the fields. The Continuum glider is very graceful looking and soars beautifully. I only learned recently that you can slope soar on a tiny ridge, but not over a sleeping policeman 😜. The Synergy has given me an idea. The Diamona is very compact. Interesting these designs have a straight(er) rear wing. Personally I prefer the front wing on top, as per my Top Quark. I guess the only USP of my Quark designs is that they have a simple plank wing and suit the ubiquitous 3S 2200. Also, the fuselage design is a simple box with triangular strip corners for rounding off like, say, TN's Lightning mini jet and others. Next up will probably be Strange Quark - a ducted fan variant. Let me know if you can find such a design 🤣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Z Posted August 5, 2023 Share Posted August 5, 2023 5 hours ago, MattyB said: What did you change in v2 - just the necessary tweaks for lipos and a brushless motor? Basically, yes. The old one had a speed400 with an extended prop shaft, for weight distribution reasons. The new version's small and light brushless motor sits at the extreme end of the fuselage. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyB Posted August 6, 2023 Share Posted August 6, 2023 11 hours ago, Max Z said: Basically, yes. The old one had a speed400 with an extended prop shaft, for weight distribution reasons. The new version's small and light brushless motor sits at the extreme end of the fuselage. Good stuff, I always liked it. Did you use a zero pitching moment flying wing sections all round that have built in reflex, or does you use another aerodynamic approach to give the necessary pitch stability? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Z Posted August 6, 2023 Share Posted August 6, 2023 4 hours ago, MattyB said: Did you use a zero pitching moment flying wing sections all round that have built in reflex, or does you use another aerodynamic approach to give the necessary pitch stability? I did use a slightly reflexed airfoil (8% HL80), but pitch stability is mainly achieved by setting the front and rear wings at some 1-2 deg. difference. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piers Bowlan Posted August 6, 2023 Share Posted August 6, 2023 (edited) I was tempted to build Max’s very stylish Diamona when it was featured in the EFI mag some years ago but other projects (and life!) got in the way. Are there any aerodynamic advantages with a box wing configuration, possibly reduced wingtip vortices and drag reduction? Maybe it’s USP is that it looks cool 😎! Edited August 6, 2023 by Piers Bowlan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyB Posted August 7, 2023 Share Posted August 7, 2023 On 06/08/2023 at 08:45, Piers Bowlan said: Are there any aerodynamic advantages with a box wing configuration, possibly reduced wingtip vortices and drag reduction? Yes, that is pretty much it. See here for more info... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyB Posted August 7, 2023 Share Posted August 7, 2023 On 06/08/2023 at 08:34, Max Z said: I did use a slightly reflexed airfoil (8% HL80), but pitch stability is mainly achieved by setting the front and rear wings at some 1-2 deg. difference. Cool, I will have to dig out the plan and take a look - I am pretty sure it is in my stash in the loft! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyB Posted August 7, 2023 Share Posted August 7, 2023 On 05/08/2023 at 12:18, Futura57 said: I was expecting a number of similar designs to come out of the woodwork, given that the Warren-Wing and Box-Wing configurations are not new. I had already seen the Rombus and Infinity wing designs (very recently). My excuse is I started by resurrecting a 1980 design of mine from when I was oblivious to these. No prizes for reinventing the wheel though, right. As my late dad used to say to me about my modelling hobby, 'At least it keeps you off the streets son'. 😢 Yes, but not off the fields. I rather like the quirky looks of your Quarks and they seem to fly well, so please don't take my observations as criticism. I just thought I'd put them out there as they may lead you to resources that help you to further improve and refine your own model. On 05/08/2023 at 12:18, Futura57 said: Personally I prefer the front wing on top, as per my Top Quark. I guess the only USP of my Quark designs is that they have a simple plank wing and suit the ubiquitous 3S 2200. Also, the fuselage design is a simple box with triangular strip corners for rounding off like, say, TN's Lightning mini jet and others. Next up will probably be Strange Quark - a ducted fan variant. Let me know if you can find such a design 🤣 How do the two models compare in terms of handling? What characteristics of having the top wing at the front make if fly better do you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piers Bowlan Posted August 7, 2023 Share Posted August 7, 2023 Hey Fu (Futura57 is a bit of a mouthful) your Quark seems to fly very well and appears to be a simple quick-build model. Have you considered submitting it to RCM&E for publication as a pull out plan? Tony Nijhuis scale mini 1960s EDFs are really delightful if numerous and Chris Williams scale gliders are things of beauty but how many have we had now? Quark would be different and a quick build to boot. A popular combination. NB, a nice hi-viz Quark contrasting colour scheme might go down well with the management 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Futura57 Posted August 7, 2023 Author Share Posted August 7, 2023 (edited) 34 minutes ago, Piers Bowlan said: Hey Fu (Futura57 is a bit of a mouthful) your Quark seems to fly very well and appears to be a simple quick-build model. Have you considered submitting it to RCM&E for publication as a pull out plan? Tony Nijhuis scale mini 1960s EDFs are really delightful if numerous and Chris Williams scale gliders are things of beauty but how many have we had now? Quark would be different and a quick build to boot. A popular combination. NB, a nice hi-viz Quark contrasting colour scheme might go down well with the management 👍 I am absolutely going to submit a plan to RCM&E. Kevin has been very receptive to my proposal already. I've written a draught build article from when I put the balsa prototype together. I didn't take many pictures though. I received a new draughtman's board two days ago so I shall be drawing a proper plan in due course. Up until now it's been a 'working drawing' on wall lining paper. A couple of friends have agreed to be guinea pigs and each build one from my plan and give feedback so I can refine my build article. There will be a few changes from the "working plan' so I shall also build another myself and take plenty of pictures. Fingers crossed it cuts the mustard. To answer MattyB: No offense taken. Difficult to compare the Bottom Quark performance since it is a Depron prototype only at the moment. It's obviously much lighter on its feet, but there hasn't been a really calm day recently. It will go on the back burner until I follow Top Quark through to its conclusion. I may actually design an EDF version (Strange Quark) next. I am expecting a 50mm 4S EDF from 4-Max any day now. Edited August 7, 2023 by Futura57 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyB Posted August 9, 2023 Share Posted August 9, 2023 (edited) Another interesting joined wing model popped into my feed today, this time a 3D printed variant - if I had a setup to print it I’d be tempted… Edited August 9, 2023 by MattyB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Futura57 Posted August 10, 2023 Author Share Posted August 10, 2023 Yes, I've seen that one too. Yesterday I spent 8 hours flying various models at Epsom Downs. Just got this shot of my Top Quark from a fellow member. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Adams Posted August 26, 2023 Share Posted August 26, 2023 On 10/08/2023 at 08:17, Futura57 said: Yes, I've seen that one too. Yesterday I spent 8 hours flying various models at Epsom Downs. Just got this shot of my Top Quark from a fellow member. I definitely hope you submit the Quark series of designs to RCM&E soon as I'd be interested in giving them a go out of Correx which a friend and Fleet MFC member gives me for free! Incidentally I fly and am a member of Chobham MFC and would love it if you could pop up with them sometime also. I have made an F22 Raptor out of Correx and it seems to be indestructible so far even making a noticeable dent in a metal barrier 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Futura57 Posted August 26, 2023 Author Share Posted August 26, 2023 8 hours ago, Steve Adams said: I definitely hope you submit the Quark series of designs to RCM&E soon as I'd be interested in giving them a go out of Correx which a friend and Fleet MFC member gives me for free! Incidentally I fly and am a member of Chobham MFC and would love it if you could pop up with them sometime also. I have made an F22 Raptor out of Correx and it seems to be indestructible so far even making a noticeable dent in a metal barrier 😂 Hi Steve. Thanks for your interest. Having already made a couple of Depron prototypes of the Top Quark myself, I reckon you could do it in Correx too. I am currently working on the Top Quark plan in between other commitments. I hope to have it completed in the next week or so. Once submitted to RCM&E, and if successful, it would probably not appear until next Spring. Just my guess. Since completing and flying the balsa prototype (40+ flights so far) I am currently building a second Top Quark exactly to my refined plan and taking build pictures and writing the article as I go. Tempting though it is to sell a few copies of the plan beforehand, I wouldn't want it to be copied and distributed physically or electronically and dilute the impact of it appearing in the magazine. I'm doing it for the prestige you see 🙂 In the meantime you are welcome to pop to Epson Downs to see it in action. I will be there tomorrow from 2pm. Message me with your club location and I will get back to you to arrange when I could come over to your club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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