Sad state of affairs

[michael birks]

It's with a great deal of frustration i write this article,i have flown r/c heli's for over twenty years now, and was taught by a vhs vdeo cassette starring Jim Davey "from the ground up",no internet back then for knowledge just the local library and a copy of "MHW" for reference,didnt even have a gyro back then for 3 years,gone are them days and things have greatly improved in this hobby with the advent of lipo, brushless motors and one thing and another,fantastic!,it's so ewasy for a newbie to pop into the local model shop and get started for less 60quid,(i am referring to a co-axial type of heli",which in a way is a good thing but it does however have some serious drawbacks,i have sold a number of helicopters in the past two years but with great regret the last one was my \Blade Msr,it was nothing but trouble, heres a snippet from the buyer's complaint, "the helicopter lifted into the air but after 5 or 6 seconds it started to drift sideways and backwards no matter how i trimmed it this happens and on one occasion when i increased the throttle it tipped ove something is wrong",Grrr," and secondly one of the skids hangs lower than the other",he then continued to tell me how he had this problem with a trex-450 he had bought and he even left a review warning all newcomers to avoid these machines as they are poorly setup??",its a sad state of affairs when people dont even understand the basics of helicopter flight,im still gobsmacked when i was told a futaba s148 would not hold the tail,i just replied i actually like to fly my heli's,oh and how i need a 100quid gyro and a sixty quid servo for the tail,people honestly are expecting to raise the collective and watch as their new heli rises awaiting patiently for their next command!,sorry to moan guys this only applies to a small minority i was quite impressed last summer when a young lad and his dad approached and asked is it true a helicopter wants to shake itself to pieces,a very good question,the next impressed me even further how high before its out of ground effect good lad i thought,just strikes me how i have never in any forum come across any of these questions,but people more and more are viewing helis as just toys and dont seem to realize they are real aircraft,sorry to moan on guys and gals but the frustration!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! happy new year all, mike

[Ross Clarkson]

Too true Michael, these reasons are why i left Heli's to go fixed wing. (.....and money!!!!)

 

I used to be a member of Heliguy.com forum and i have even seen the question "Why does my Heli tail always want to go to the left?"

A genuine question!  

[michael birks]

lol,yes i must admit i do love fixed wing,cheap to run hassle free,just cant seem to stay away from helis though tinkering at the kitchen table etc,i only indulge when i happen to have some spare cash which isnt very often,i sold my blade msr and dx5e to upgrade to a dx6i to go in the new raptor,i had a laugh on some of the forums though i was taken aback by some of the advice been given out,people putting weights on the heli skid to level it out as one hung lower than the other (Lead and Lag) one blade advancing one retarding etc etc), but one chap[ on ebay who i sold my msr to,is still adamant somethings wrong the heli lifts but then wants to be off in all manner of directions,i pointed out to get out of ground effect a bubble of air the heli is riding on,he thinks im talking gibberish to him to confuse him.i sent a wiki link to ground effect lol.

[Doug Ireland]

I bought a Raptor 30 V2 some years ago and all I managed to do was wipe out three sets of main blades. The problem I faced was not understanding (still don't) the likes of "pitch curves", "idle-up" and so on and not having anyone nearby to ask. So the poor thing is sitting on a shelf with stubs for blades and gathering dust!

[ben hall]

as a regular visitor to heliguy forum. i see a lot of silly questions like michael mentions . i mean come on its not hard to read about stuff and learn . i been flying helis since last april and i am self taught . mind i must say internet helped alot

 

just bought my self a new heli raptor 50 v2 cant wait for it . another heli to add to my fleet . but a least this one is nitro mmmm noise and smoke . the only time i get that witj my other ones is when the esc gans up in smoke

[Allan Bennett]

I see no problem with "silly" (i.e. very basic) questions on forums -- at least it shows that the writer is thinking about the subject and, hopefully, is ready to listen to advice given.

 

But the example of michael burke's buyer seems to be, unfortunately, symptomatic of today's society in which nobody is personally to blame for anything -- it's always somebody else's fault and, if you can sue, so much the better!

[ben hall]

its not the silly questions that bother me its the way they cant be bothered to read . most forums have stickys and it only really takes so long before most questions of problems are asked . i just get the feeling some are to lazy to read or search for there answers. i myself if i dont know my first stop is google followed by as must reading as it takes to understand what i need to .

always someone else's fault  i agree there . no one takes responsibility no more . its down to the where there is blame there a claim attitude.

 

 

i noticed there is not much activity on here regarding helis is there prodominatly plane flyers . would be nice to see more heli stuff posted 

[michael birks]

have to agree with you their,i always tell people ask questions no matter how silly you think they are,but again with the advent of the internet people on a whim can purchase a heli readyset  for under a hundred quid,get it a couple of days later charge battery etc and be prepped for flight with no basic understanding of helicopter flight,they seem to then think they raise the collective and the machine will rise steadily and await their next command,and assume its faulty or badly out of trim as it wants to do its own thing,i tell people time and time again it has to be flown from instant of lifting off,it needs constant input on cyclic,best advice i give is get a sim,

Edited By michael birks on 17/01/2010 21:13:48

[ben hall]

dont know about you but i have had people talking to me when am flying . non flyers . who get the impression there easyer to fly then planes . cause u can just take ur hands off and they will just hover and the other daft people that let there dogs chase the heli . not knowin that it would slice and dice it up . there certainly not toys as they can be easly been preceived to be but the non flyers .  i got a raptor 50 v2 comin soon i cant wait to get that up in the air should be nice . not be trying nowt silly with that tho few quid a crash with that big bird

 

 

[michael birks]

lol Ben yep i have definately had the dogs chasing my helis and you wont believe it but i have had kids run under my hovering heli and follow it i, i had to land some distance away as kids thought it fun to follow underneath it,one guy even asked about my trex 450 as his 5year old daughter that was with him would like one for xmas,hope you have fun with your new raptor 50 im just waiting on my 30 to arrive in the post , best wishes mike.

[ben hall]

lol sounds like there the same kinda people up here then . that cant see the dangers. i always tell them how fast the blades are going when u say 200 mph plus they start to get the picture yeah i got a good deal on the 50 v2 second hand so i bought it .

 

it certainly looks like a clean old heli to me 260 quid posted cant be bad at all 

[michael birks]

Nice Ben not a bad price mate, well worth the money,i  ordered raptor 30,always had Kyosho models namely cpncept dx,nexus did buy a caliber 3 before xmas but then checked spares in uk and they were non existent which suprised me kyosho were always good but the raptors are at the leading edge now so i followed the crowd and glad i did everyone swears by them and spares are dirt cheap and everywhere,the 30 parts also fit the 50 hopefully if i come into money i do fancy a 50 titan nice scale fuselage on it,nice one Ben the engine looks in good health to it really doesnt look like the previous owner flew it much if at all it very clean indeed!!,regards mike

[ben hall]

do you think the raptor will be much harder then the blade cx2 heli i have been flying i can fly that well now

[Martin Harris - Moderator]

I've got to ask if you chaps think it's sensible to be flying helis where the general public are able to unleash their pets and children into the vicinity of lethal rotor blades..

 

I may have misread your posts but that's certainly the impression from them!.

Edited By Martin Harris on 17/01/2010 22:55:51

[ben hall]

our flying field is bmfa site that has public access to walk dogs and ride horses . to be fair there is no where u can go these days unless u own the land that u wont have members of the public around

[Tim Mackey]

Oh thats not true Ben - very few clubs "own the land" but merely rent from the landowner on agreed basis. In almost every case, proper notices are exhibited to warn members of the public about the dangers of model aircraft, and that access is only permitted to authorised club members.

I have to agree with Martin on this, seems a little dangerous to me

Its one of the reasons i stopped going so called "park flying" with my little 12 oz foamies, - as small and seemingly innocent as they are, the doistraction of people and their doges and children wandering across the site just became sucha pre-occupation ofr me, that it spoiled the enjoyment - I would think with a large IC heli, its even more disconcerting!

I now choose to travel 20 minutes drive to my official club site to fly everything ( except slopers ) rather than fly in my local park which is amere 20 minute walk instead.

Is your BMFA site a club site, for which you pay a memebership fee etc, or simply a public free access area?

Edited By Timbo - Administrator on 17/01/2010 23:17:05

[Martin Harris - Moderator]

On a shared access site, it would seem sensible to only fly when other members are around to spot hazards and advise people when you're flying.  Hopefully this is the case at your site?

 

I do have to admit that when I returned to modelling ten or eleven years ago, initially, I used a recognised public flying site to teach myself to hover a Concept 30 but I only went there midweek and during school term-time and landed as soon as I was aware of anyone nearby - but with the benefit of experience I wouldn't do it now.

 

Please be very aware of the potential for major injury (or worse - and I'm not joking) from a 50 sized heli and in view of the fact that it's second hand and your first larger sized heli, get it checked over by a recognised expert before using it.

 

Anyway, I hope you get plenty of good and safe flying from it!

 

 

[ben hall]

we do not have sole use of the area for flying . thus people have access . its a proper bmfa site . there is no way we can stop people . http://www.cadmac.eu/ check out the flying site on there google map u will see it open public area . but is our designated bmfa flying site . which we held the great north fly in last year . the part about owning the land was ment in the way of unless you own ur own field . we dont either rent or own the land . we are allowed to fly there with permision from the council. a bmfa rep has been there before own fly in and said it one of the best sites he has ever seen . but it is open field and public right of way . so u will still get the odd idiot who rides across the strip on a mtb or walks there dogs with no leads while ur flying .

[ben hall]

from a 50 sized heli and in view of the fact that it's second hand and your first larger sized heli, get it checked over by a recognised expert before using it.

 

its ok i can check it out i do have experience to be fair. its gunna be the largest of heli i will own but i do own quite a few and have set them all up my self . my collection of helis are as follows trex 250 x 2 trex sev2 x 3 trex 450 pro trex 500  was joking about the cx2 above     ( in keeping with noob questions on forums). i am a proficient flyer and can fly well upright and inverted . belive me i know the damage that can be done by a heli . even a 450 will do serious damage. so i will be checking the raptor very carfully before it take to the sky .  

[Peter 'Ivanna Crashalot' Savage]

I don't know about you but everyone seems to forget its 'just a toy' when i flick the idle up switch and it vwuuuum!!! everyone walks away!

 

I have an MSR and i love it! apart from the fact it only seems to want to turn one way :s i cant believe someone would get a heli without atleast learning some of the basics of how they fly! and to be honest, if you cant actually fly an MSR you dont stand any chance what so ever on a 450! my dad can just about fly the MSR, hes been practicing with his MCX

 

The MSR actually has a slanted shaft, either that or i have crashed unknowingly!

 

If he comes in again Michael, hand him the latest picooz!

[michael birks]

our flying site is a dis-used airfield BMFA approved etc and is rented,but the public still have access dog walking etc,but its not always easy to keep your mind on your heli as well as who is creeping up behind you,obviously i do land if people stray,with regards the MSR yes it does have a slanted shaft i loved that heli but had to sell to buy more gear for my nitro heli, cannot fault the Blade MSR i loved it for flying indoors and out,E-Flite have released a bigger version with collective pitch looks the same etc i think its 250 sized due to be in the uk in march one to keep a look out for for definate,the pico z's are excellent fun bought my two boys one each for xmas just add a tad of bluetack under the nose,loads of fun,cant wait until they get bored of them 2 picos=1 chinook!!!

Edited By michael birks on 18/01/2010 10:04:28

[michael birks]

and here it is the E-Flite Blade SR

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=EFLH1500

 

 

[Peter 'Ivanna Crashalot' Savage]

I think one mistake they made with the msr is its too stable still they tried to make it too stable so it is half way between the full size single rotors and the coaxs

[michael birks]

yes i think your right with regards the Blade Msr it is very similar to a co-axial although its a micro single rotor,they seem to have thought of everything even the blade have some slight dihedral in them at the tips slanted mainshaft etc its very stable almost easy to fly even outdoors i threw it around it rocks itself back into recovery if you lose orientation due to its small size, i bought a red canopy for it and that made a big difference,also in galaxy models in ipswich their are sclae fuselage kits for it namely the augusta a109 and heck i just sold mine on ebay,i did email the bloke who purchased it and offered him a full refund if he wasnt happy with his purchase but he declined oh well will have to got for the Blade SR thats now out its a bigger msr with collective pitch........................

[Martin Harris - Moderator]

Posted by michael birks on 18/01/2010 10:03:21:

our flying site is a dis-used airfield BMFA approved etc and is rented,but the public still have access dog walking etc,but its not always easy to keep your mind on your heli as well as who is creeping up behind you,obviously i do land if people stray,

 Mike,

 

Seems like both you and Ben fly at similar sites (or the same one?) and that you both have a very responsible attitude to the dangers.  I wasn't able to tell that you weren't just operating from a handy piece of land accessible to the public from the earlier posts which is what prompted the enquiry. Glad that the answers to my question have been so positive!