PETER BRUCE - Eastchurch Gap Posted October 20, 2015 Author Share Posted October 20, 2015 No reply from George but the video crash at the start of this thread is worth watching - don't blink. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Braddock, VC Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 I've not read all the posts in this thread but it seems to me that collisions like this would be much less common if people flew similar circuits and the clubs involved strictly enforced the regime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuban8 Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 100% with you on that Braddock. Quite apart from a sensible rule, it's just common sense and good airmanship but many fliers just don't get it. If I have the patch to myself (while the others are drinking tea) I like to fly aerobatics to a turn-around schedule, as soon as somebody else joins me I'll drop back to circuit flying or I'll just land and wait until a lull. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 While the circuits are a good idea the real problem is pilots not looking where they are going or not adjusting their flying to suit the fact that others are up in the air with them. I am sure that i spend perhaps 50% of my time in the air looking at/for other models so i know where they are. I also talk to the others i am flying with so they have an idea what i plan to do next, a sweeping pass with a warbird for example or a monster loop. This means they know where i am and where to avoid going. If there is communication and attention then there really should be no problems and we have written a section into our new training syllabus that details all of this and is part of our training to solo (A cert) standard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Braddock, VC Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 Jon, I suspect the fact that you have upgraded your club rules means there was a problem. If you're flying from the left and I'm flying from the right on a collision course, no communication under the sun will avoid the collision as you will have about a second or so to take in what's happening and take avoiding action. Try shouting break right within a second. If on the other hand I'm flying a cessna from left to right doing 50 mph and you're flying a stuka from left to right doing 30 mph on a collision course, I will see your a/c at least a few seconds before the inevitable and so will you see mine. Communication should enter into it but on ships at sea the faster takes evasive action removing any self induced avoidance collision. I defy you to look where you or any other pilot is going and still fulfil the ANOs. What I am suggesting is called discipline and, sadly, it seems to be lacking as more and more people enter the hobby with little respect for other folks property etc etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Braddock, VC Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 BTW, Page 22 of the smae 2010 handbook discusses this issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon H Posted October 20, 2015 Share Posted October 20, 2015 We had no issue, and it is not a rule. It was something implemented into basic training to make everyone better and safer pilots as communication and awareness of other aircraft is never taught. And you are correct, in your situation there would be no communication that could save the day. But if just one of the pilots had said that they were doing a pass from a given direction then the second pilot would be able to avoid the area. That said, even if neither pilot said anything they should both be sufficiently aware of the other aircrafts position to avoid putting their aircraft in a position where a collision was possible. I regularly fly with a couple of friends with our warbirds and we are always all over the sky with no circuit employed except for takeoff/landing. All we do is watch out for eachother and communicate about who is where and doing what. Often we end up in some WWII tail chasing which is a great laugh but for the most part it is a free for all. Anyway I am not for one moment suggesting that people should not switch into circuits when many models are airbourne or change what they are doing when a new pilot or a slow flying model is up, I am just saying that with the correct awareness of the models around you and proper comms with the other pilots, the risk of collision is massively reduced without having to resort to circuits only. Edited By Jon Harper on 20/10/2015 19:36:45 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PETER BRUCE - Eastchurch Gap Posted November 3, 2015 Author Share Posted November 3, 2015 In reply to a lot of comments above - our club is quite strict on rule enforcement and over the years when incidents have happened new rules have been instigated to help avert such future problems. General courtesy also prevails which works well indeed for us HOWEVER In this flying clip instance there were only two pilots in the flight box - everything which should have taken place never did... It matters what should have happened between the two pilots in the flight box because as always with accidents its usually a compilation of things which compound into an eventual accident which is what happened here. The main lesson to remember is if YOU (as an individual at your flying site) see something which could be a safety issue / problem it's up to YOU to jump in quick and say something to the person concerned. (Don't go to someone else and tell them YOU sort it them out then and there). Sometimes "old hands" need reminding - (me included in the past), by newer club members - this can get some older longer serving club members backs up - but if its an issue of safety no one can argue about it. Every club - no matter where they are - will have had issues from cut fingers to mid air collisions but as long as we stay as safe as we can (each one of us acting as safety officials) and we learn from our mistakes our flying sites should (hopefully) remain safe. The word "IF" is always used after any accident / event however things are often seen by others but not by the person concerned so by saying something think of how many potential problems can be averted! (Can't see the wood for the trees). Great to have such a forum conversation - anything for safety is important. Regards to all Peter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will -0 Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 Posted by Braddock, VC on 20/10/2015 12:29:01: I've not read all the posts in this thread but it seems to me that collisions like this would be much less common if people flew similar circuits and the clubs involved strictly enforced the regime. But then we might as well give up RC and take up control line flying if all you want to do is fly in circles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will -0 Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 PS how do you fly Cuban8? Can't really fly cuban 8s in circuit pattern Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john stones 1 - Moderator Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 Yep safest way to avoid midairs is fly one at a time or not at all. Considering how much flight time we log it happens very little. I would also think there are plenty flyers around crashing models without anyone else playing a part on a regular basis, so it's way down the safety ladder for me. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PETER BRUCE - Eastchurch Gap Posted November 29, 2015 Author Share Posted November 29, 2015 Went slope soaring today with our foamies but we WERE trying to knock each other out of the sky - combat! Amazing how site rules can change... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PETER BRUCE - Eastchurch Gap Posted August 27, 2016 Author Share Posted August 27, 2016 Heard via the grapevine this model is still about. You still got this GEORGE or have you passed it on... Club Scale day tomorrow... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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