gary132 Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 It has come to my attention through owning this model that these models are not fit for purpose. I recently bought a hangar 9 4D tribute 36. after only ten flights the model snapped in half during a flight at a model show at old warden. The model at the time of break up was doing a box manouvre in flight. The fusalage snapped just rear of the main wing. After this happening i researched the internet only to find more stories of other modellers suffering the same problems. It appears the fusalage snaps at the front of the wing as well as the rear. The fusalage is realy weak at these points. Anyone buying this model must be aware this will happen. The only cure i can see to the problem is to bond on the wing and canopy components which strengthens the fusealage. The only problem with this is you then cannot remove the wing for transport. Leaveing you with problems transporting a built up model. I have put this post up to help prevent people from buying this model and wasteing there hard earned money. And also to decrease the risk of someone getting hit by a falling broken up model. I was lucky at the show i was flying at the model was not near the crowd line. And this post is also directed at people who already own one as to how to cure the problem. If you own one and it's not broken yet Get glueing with the epoxy. If your thinking of buying one be warned. Here are the images of my snapped model. Edited By gary132 on 17/05/2012 07:03:22 Edited By gary132 on 17/05/2012 07:05:12 Edited By gary132 on 17/05/2012 07:05:31 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Briman Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Have you contacted Horizon Hobby about this failure Gary? cheers, Brian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gary132 Posted May 17, 2012 Author Share Posted May 17, 2012 Hi brian yes i did, they sent me a new fusalage which got sqaushed in transit and is smashed worse than the broken one. have also mailed hangar 9 and they say to send the model back for asessment. a bit difficult with it's tail feather all stuck on etc. i got fed up and actually stuck the crashed one back together. people need to know that this model is prone to breaking up before they commit to paying there money for it. i am also submitting a form to bmfa for fault report on artf model with photos. i was flying this model at old warden show on may 13th when it broke up in flight. had it gone into the people watching i would have been in a seriouse position. luckily it fell at the rear of the flying feild out of harms way.....i certainly wouldnt want an os52 fs up the side of the head. i have over 20 years building experiance and the model was built to the book. ive never seen such a poor design, sadly like everyone else when you buy it you have faith the product is 100% sadly i could not see the week built fuse under the covering. ive searched the web since the crash and found numerouse posts complaining of it failing at the front of the wing as well as the rear. i am a small fish in a very large pond. hangar 9 won't do anything, i cannot see them reviseing the model. they are still on sale even though others have complained and recieved new fusalages.....i would simply like to let people know buy at own risk. the only way to make the model safe is to epoxy the wings on and the canopy this makes the fuse solid. i will know once i get out to fly again how strong it is as i plan to wring it out....and hope my glueing the wings on has cured my model. Gary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gary132 Posted May 17, 2012 Author Share Posted May 17, 2012 A side note brian Horizon are not responible as they are only a supplier, the designer and hangar 9 are the ones putting out a product that is not fit. horizon done me proud sending me a new fuse...sadly the courier messed that up for them by smashing the new fuse in transit. so horizon are doing there bit and i am happy with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allan Bennett Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Sorry to read about your mishap. That really is a classic case of failure at an abrupt change of cross-section. Seems to me the model could be much stronger if the fuselage continued through without a cutout for the wings, and the wings were then plug-in from either side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gary132 Posted May 17, 2012 Author Share Posted May 17, 2012 Allan i agree the design is terrible the weakness is built in. the idea of a full fusalage with wings that slide in on a tube would be far better. the model could defo be revised and improved. the shame of it is that it is a fantastic flyer. i spent last night bonding it all back together the test will be when i refly it. the broken fuse which horizon sent ( smashed by fedex courier ) sits in it's box for horizon to collect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gary132 Posted May 17, 2012 Author Share Posted May 17, 2012 Allan when you look at the picture you can see there is no meat at all holding the fuse together a small rail top and bottom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Briman Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Ok Gary. I had thought that Hanger 9 were part of the Horizon Hobby stable who have always given me very good service. Can you take up the issue of poor design with Hanger 9 direct or perhaps HH can do this on your behalf as their reputation will suffer if they are distributing poorly designed planes. cheers, Brian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olly P Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Just to point out a few things regards who is responsible for what, in the legal sense. Who ever you purchased the model from are legally responsible for any loss or damage due to defect which you suffer. You gave them your money and your contract for supply of something fit for purpose is with them. THEY can then take it back to Horizon Hobby (or any intermediate source) and raise the matter with them, as that is where the contract and associated liability lies. HH then take it back to Hanger 9 as the manufacturer and should get the fault rectified. All that you as the consumer should see of this process is the person(s) you purchased the model from providing you with a refund or replacement as per the sales of goods act. Any other actions that take place should follow the course outlined above - the flow of contract. HH are quite entitled to not deal direct if you have purchased from a 3rd party. Generally they will be more helpful, and indeed if they are providing a warranty on the parts above and beyond the legal requirement they will normally do replacement etc for you, but again this should be handled through your local dealer. Sorry about the 'rant' but I work in a Quality environment and knowing the legal chain is vital, and it is amazing how many people don't realise who has liability and for what, including people in 'the trade' Olly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gary132 Posted May 17, 2012 Author Share Posted May 17, 2012 thanks olly, all answers and opinions are accepted. i feel that complaining is beeting a dead horse. the time taken to rectify things is too long. i simply want to warn anyone that would be thinking of buying one of these models beware i have been the victim of poor qaulity and design. if my post stops someone else wasting there good hard earned money then my post has done it's job. and i mave prevented one of these models from hitting someone. i have rebuilt my model last night so taking it back under warranty is out the window. if it breaks again it will go on the bonfire....this experiance has not been pleasent. gary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gary132 Posted May 17, 2012 Author Share Posted May 17, 2012 i did mail my LMS and recieved no reply i included pictures of the model. and i have mailed HH yesterday and today and moaned about fedex wrecking the new fuse and told them i don't hold HH responsible. the problem lays with hangar 9. like i say i have mended the model. lets just hope it holds up. Gary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gary132 Posted May 17, 2012 Author Share Posted May 17, 2012 this was what i read . http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1413364 this post i read too. Rotor Trash Senior Heliman Higginsville, MO My Posts: All Forum Topic They fly great and look cool but the fuselage is weak where the LE of the wing meets it. It doesn't take a very hard landing to break it in half. If you beef up the fuselage and glue the wing in permanent, you won't have any problems.Brent Load'r High and Let'r Fly !!! 01-09-2011 Over year old. PM EMAIL HOMEPAGE GALLERY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gary132 Posted May 17, 2012 Author Share Posted May 17, 2012 and another it speaks for itself realy. i should have researched this model before buying it. my own fault. 1 forum posts Well this is my first post here and I'm from the other side of the pond. I live in small town, Illinois. Pardon any language issues. The ARF situation is no better here in the states. After I bought my E-flite Diamante I then discovered the weak undercarriage. It folded on a pretty soft landing, no bounce and grass field. I had previously read about this but decided to fly until it broke, which it did. I made my own laminated ply mounting block, reinforced it with tri-stock and glued the whole thing in with epoxy and microballoons. No problems since. I also had a Hangar 9 Tribute 36 with a known weak fuselage problem. They were cracking at the trailing edge of the wing. Yep, mine cracked in flight. Fortunately ?? I was doing a flat spin and the plane just plopped into a wheat field. I contacted Horizon Hobby and they sent me a new fuse, no questions asked. This is all still very frustrating. Things have come a long way since I first flew way back in 1988, but they could still be better. Just about every ARF I've built, I have either modified something or changed the hardware. More quality control would go a long way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olly P Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Hi Gary, The reason for your post is completly understood. I have and would do the same thing. I just wanted to point out for anyone who didn't understand that if the LMS just sends you to the distributer then they are wrong and they should argue the corner. As I said to an insurance company recently - I don't care who does this on your behalf, you are my supplier and therefore it is your responsibility. I have to say it is odd that people in this hobby seem to accept things from ARTF's they would object to in say DIY/flat pack furniture! Hope it holds out well after the repairs - it can't be any worse than when sent out to you! Happy Landings Olly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gary132 Posted May 17, 2012 Author Share Posted May 17, 2012 http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w28/garyflyer/DSCF8120.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gary132 Posted May 24, 2012 Author Share Posted May 24, 2012 I am pleased to report in that the tribute has been test flown since rebuild. as i mentioned i re-joined the fuse with added woodwork and glued the wing and canopy area to the fuse to increase the strength of this model. I test flew it today and completely wrang it out doing snap manouvres and box's one after the other to see if the model would fail again. Hay presto with the wings glued on the model is withstanding all the aero's i am throwing at it. So my conclusion is if you buy one of these models. Bond your wing and canopy area on and you will have no issues with it. Apart from getting it in & out of the car once it's glued together it is a great flying model. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gary132 Posted May 24, 2012 Author Share Posted May 24, 2012 Hi Olly i am not one of life complainers, But i do believe in what you pay for you should get. the way i saw it with this model is it was not fit for purpose as said on box. my LMS did nothing, Hangar 9 did nothing, BUT Horizon Hobbys did help by sending the new fusealage. bless them they brunt the noise of models going ong and they do a grand job. And i think to this english people are branded by other countrys as complainers that do nothing. Well this is why poor stuff keeps getting dumped on us again & again. we tend to moan to everyone who will listen but not the people who need to be told and we seem to accept an arf isn't upto standard and either go buy another and add strength to it from experiance of the 1st one or we bin it and just go buy something else. like you if i recieved a DIY flat pack and part of it was broken or it wasn't upto spec i would be on the phone straight away.....it eems a different perspective with this hobby ....how odd we are... Gary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Grigg Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 Im glad Ive found this thread as Ive just put one of these together and will make suitable modifications as suggested Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben goodfellow 1 Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 funny . i remember looking at a fellow flyers h9 carden yak and thinking crickey theres not much at the fuz/wing te then a while later on a gentle landing the fuz snapped in half right on the wing te , i have since read of afew doing this , i was going to get a h9 carden extra but binned that idea Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Grigg Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 yes its surprising and disapointing to find out that H9 models have faults that are terminal when they cost so much more than other makes of kit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masher Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 My first experience with H9 has been an interesting one. I was given an RV-8 which had previously been fairly lightly damaged by the first 2 owners. Both suffered stall on landing and RH wing breaks causing damage to fuse side too. I enjoy rebuilding models so people in the club pass them on to me. I did a fairly quick repair job so that I could fit it out and try it before doing a "proper" job later - to see if I liked the model before wasting too much time. Took it out, flew nicely and had enough flights to get the feel. Then on about the 6th landing, wing tipped and it toppled over. When I picked it up I was bit shocked by how much damage had been done! Anyway as I enjoyed flying it, I decided to do the "proper" job which I have now completed. Stripping back the wing to replace a couple of ribs, I found it difficult to know where to stop - the wood is a bit like that thin rubbish stuff they used to make fruit baskets out of when I was a kid. Brittle, random grained and very poor quality. Lots of the glue was doing nothing except looking good. On to the fuse and same story really. Nice looking overcomplicated structure with 100's of neat joints but no strength! I ended up attempting to re-glue most of the model. Not sure if this is just this 3rd hand model, or more common with H9 - I would certainly want to inspect before buying a new one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Grigg Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 Interesting comment on the quality Masher.always thought H9 were better than other manufacturers hence the higher cost. Edited By Stephen Grigg on 28/12/2013 11:01:34 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masher Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 Stephen - I must not fall into the trap of righting them off on this sample of 1 used model. But it seems a bit like that old saying - style over substance (or whatever it is)! It looks very pretty and complicated and is very light but I wonder if there is a frustrated CAD designer just trying to use every tool in the box rather than worry about the model lasting?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Grigg Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 My Hangar 9 Pulse XT 40 was superb and i loved it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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