84 inch Depron AT6 Texan.

[Philip Rawlinson]

Loving the lights

[Pilot_Chuckle]

Looking good chaps, when's the maiden ?

[Ian101]

Fantastic progress.

I'd love to see all of these big depron planes in the air at the same time.

Ian

[Philip Rawlinson]

Well Mr Chuckle how about the Texan , Roy's Spitfire and your Hurricane in formation ?

[cymaz]

Damn, you're good...

[Colin Leighfield]

Philip, it looks wonderful. There's no doubt that when you get your head around how to use Depron, building becomes much easier and faster than with wood. I'm increasingly frustrated by the lack of time I have to finish off projects and start the new ones I want to, let alone get on with flying them!

Seeing this makes me think that there is space for a similar scale Miles Master, either an early Kestrel or later Mercury version. It's a long time since I've seen one done, but it's another great subject and full of period character.

[Electriflier]

Ian, thanks again mate. and Colin, Miles Master? Hmmmmmmm...........
Cymaz, - Cheers! .....my missus read your comment and rolled her eyes....... As the saying goes ' behind every successful man, there's a woman rolling her eyes'

Friday 24th Oct
Managed a bit of time on the build today. Time really to ensure all extension leads were installed and tidied away and photographed should Phil need access to them at any stage in the future.
One very noticeable part of the Texan is the exhaust which exits on the starboard side of the aircraft, just rear of the front cowl. Phil has mentioned to me in the past just how 'quirky' the aircraft looks with the pipe sticking out of the side. Too iconic a feature to miss out and so my eyes have been peeled for something that I might use to form the part. I, like many (I hope), find myself looking at various items in the Supermarket thinking, ' that deoderant can plastic top would make a perfect scale...........' well you know what I mean!
I used precisely that, a deoderant plastic top to form the exhause stack for the Texan. Something I haven't mentioned in the past is the siting of the ESC within the model. Well, a little forethought in the planning stage showed that I could possibly install the ESC in or around the location of the exaust stack and if careful enough, ensure that the ESC received natural cooling by allowing air to enter from the front of the aircraft and exhaust through.......... the exhaust!
Well the planning worked! I was able to do just that. The ESC is located just behind the area where I will build the exhaust stack and once suitable entry holes are cut into the front of the model, will be in constant cooling airflow.
I cut out the end of the aerosol plastic cap which basically left me with a 'tube'. I spray-painted the inside of the plastic cap with sliver paint and allowed to dry. I then brush-painted some matt black on the outside of the plastic cap and again, left to dry. Once dry, I randomly scraped a little of the matt black away to reveal the underlying silver paint.
The plastic tube was then epoxied into a 3mm panel of depron wich was then glued in place just rear of the cowl.

With the exhaust sorted and the wiring within the wing centre-section finished, I had just a small amount of time left this afternoon to start skinning the inner wing centre section of the fuselage. Relatively straight-forward to apply the 3mm depron to the flat section of the inner wing but it took a little longer to tease the depron around the protruding wheel housings. I managed to manipulate, knead, persuade the Depron around the complex curve of the wheel housingin one piece! Not sure I'll manage to achieve the same on the other side....
So, once again, progress to date.......
I think Phil is calling in tomorrow to check on progress and maybe, bring the pilot and co-pilot?
'Til then

Regards

Roy

[Philip Rawlinson]

I love the comment it was relatively straightforward to apply the 3mm depron sheet !!!!!!

Straightforward for some maybe lol.

Yes I will be calling in tomorrow but first I have to apply a coat of Dulux Vinyl Matt misty buff emulsion to the present Mrs Rawlinsons master bedroom.

Yes the flying Berretto brothers will be making an appearance ready for their starring role in test flying your latest creation.

[Colin Leighfield]

Philip, are you painting straight onto the Depron, or covering with glass-cloth?

[Philip Rawlinson]

Hi Colin

Thanks for your interest.

I feel somewhat of a fraud on this thread as it was originally going to be a shared build but I realised at an early stage I was somewhat out of my depth so the aero modelling version of Mother Theresa that is Electriflier took pity on me and motored on.

I am sure Roy will give you the full answer but I think I am right in saying he has never found the need for glass cloth as like me he is happy with a stand off scale appearance .

We have a flier at our club who went down the glass cloth route and got a mirror finish but the weight penalty made the model unflyable. The attraction of depron is you can build a large model at a fraction of the weight and price of balsa with a much lower wing loading which gives a nearer scale flying speed.

Hope that helps and I am sure Roy will add more detail to the answer.

Cheers Phil.

[Colin Leighfield]

Philip, your answer pretty much reflects what I found with the Depron Barnstormer when I decided to go down the Ezekote/glass cloth and paint route, although after having to load a lot of ballast up front to compensate a significantly higher than expected rearwards cg, it flew successfully. The point was that after being inspired by Chris (Depron)'s Tyro, which was left uncovered and unpainted, I then went the other way.

I thought that with glass cloth weighing only 17 GMs (1/2oz)? per square metre, there couldn't be a problem. However, the Ezekote and the paint add a lot more than that and because they are a significantly higher proportion of the final weight when applied to Depron than to balsa, the effect on cg is much greater and the need then to correct with ballast can it seems pretty much wipe out the weight advantage.

However, it is much cheaper than balsa and when covered this way, I would say stronger. That is why I'm introducing it selectively into the Chipmunk build to see if I can get the clear advantages this time without a down-side. My main reason for wanting to cover the Depron was being concerned that it is easily damaged, do you think that isn't a big problem and what paint will you use directly on the Depron? I hope you don't mind me asking you, because I'm feeling my way here at the moment.

[Monz]

I must disagree with Philip. The added weight is well worth it for the strength and durability it adds to the depron. If a model became unflyable as Philip says, then that mirror finish clearly added way too much weight on top of the cloth. What was the size of the model? Not that little DC-3 was it?

On my Bucc it added 15% extra weight, which was about a pound. Using 25g/m² cloth and Poly-C (ezecote is rubbish) and it's survived some hairy high speed encounters with hillside vegetation unscathed. I was very liberal with paint and primer as I wasn't worried about weight, the model is too light actually.

If you use the materials cleverly, 17g/m² cloth on the rear of the fus and the tail feathers and then 25g/m² on the wings and forward fus you can mitigate ballast needed. Poly-C fills the weave quicker and lighter than ezekote does. Use lightweight filler to fill any remaining weave (the stuff is so light that it's negligible), spray a light coat of primer and you're ready for some paint. Using the BnQ wall paints test pots, thinned 50/50 with water, two coats brushed on gives a very light, cheap and easy paint finish.

But you also need to weigh up what you fly, where you want to fly it as well as your flying skill compared to the cost of a model and durability needed.

[Colin Leighfield]

Thanks Monz, I suppose it's the usual thing, compromise and commonsense. I'm interested in your observation about PolyC being better than Ezekote though, I thought they were the same thing with different names on the bottle. I will get some and try it.

The Barnstormer was a scale up from the Baby Barnstormer version with very large free flight style Tailplane, relatively long moment arm and short nose., all the ingredients for rearward cg shift as surface weight was added. It is sufficiently promising though that at some stage I will replace the tailplane with a smaller one of about 20% wing area, lengthen the nose a bit more and fit a 250 KW motor instead of the 150. It should be interesting!

When I met Budgie Daz with his Valiant and Vulcan, he'd used PolyC or Ezekote without glass and that seemed to have toughened the Depron up quite a lot. Tony Bennett is using tissue on his TSR2.

This Texan/Harvard does look stunning though, I'd love to see it and Roy's Spitfire and Hercules in real life.

[Philip Rawlinson]

Hi Monz,

Thanks for your input, I take on board your comments regarding glass cloth giving a resistance to bumps and scrapes. We are quite fortunate that we fly from a very nicely maintained cricket pitch so that part isn't a problem.

I do know that Roy uses a coat of either Poly C or ezecote which protects against hanger rash.

Depron unfortunately is easily marked but is one of few downsides to a remarkable building material.

Cheers Phil.

[Electriflier]

Hi All,
Another brief update for you...
Phil called in to see the progress on Saturday and asked to see the thing assembled with lights on. Who could resists?...

Notice also that the newly painted pilot and co-pilot showed up for the occasion - thanks Phil!

Now to start on the skinning of the fuselage. First piece I started on was the battery hatch. This area on the actual aircraft (just in front of the cockpit) is where,if fitted, the cannon was installed.

The cannon laid in a recessed channel which ran forward toward the cowl as can be seen quite clearly in the next photo.
The picture above also highlights the way that the fuselage panels at the front end of the aircraft are not butted-up to each other. They sort of overlap and this is how I intend the model to look.

I'd asked Phil if he wanted to 'arm his Texan and he said 'Of course' and so, I first created the channel for the gun in the top of the battery hatch. Basically, I cut a small half circle from the back of the battery hatch where the channel starts and then eased a curved slither of 3mm depron into the gap which once glued and the edges trimmed, looks half decent.
My attempt at the recessed channel. Phil by the way is making a replica cannon to add to the model.

Next, I added the panel beneath the battery hatch.

Then, a slightly larger panel beneath the cockpit.
OK, so we all got an extra hour in bed this morning but I paid the price this afternoon as the light faded quickly and I wasn't able to do much more other than to quickly carve the side engine inlet from blue foam.

Jobs for this week are to strengthen and stiffen the tail section of the fuselage prior to skinning, build the tailwheel assembly and install the rudder and horizontal tail and who knows? - I might even get the fuselage skinned to completion..............Oh maybe not, the Grandchildren are off school this week

Regards
Roy

[Tony Bennett]

looks smashing sir.

fantastic work sir.

[Monz]

Coming on nicely Roy, see you got the other wheel well sorted in one go too

[Electriflier]

Good evening,

Thanks for the comments Tony and yes Monz, somehow, more by good luck than good judgement, I managed to cover the external surface of the wheel well in one go with the 3mm - relieved!
It's been a week of careful measuring, test-fitting, measuring etc as I've started the last leg of the fuselage skinning. First area to be tackled was the underside of the centre-section of the fuselage/wing. I removed the retracts to clear the underside so that covering should be made easier. I had come across some pretty stiff and hard 3mm which I had put aside for this part of the build. Stiff and hard and also brittle but I feel the underside will benefit from the additional strength when transporting the model around in the back of the car etc.

The underside of the centre section skinned and the retracts placed in position. They need work to get them to sit properly now that the skin's on.

Very little curvature on the underside so pretty straight-forward to cover.
I removed the circular sections from the skin above each wheel well and then fitted the 'roof' of the inside of the whell well and lined the inside of the well walls with 3mm grey (soft) depron.
I knew that the retracts wouldn't seat correctly once I had applied the skin because they fit perfectly before I added the extra 3mm. So, I removed the spats or wheel covers from the retract units and added an additional 3mm piece of lightply under the saddle clamps that holds the covers onto the metal retract leg. This basically lifted the wheel covers away from the underside skin by the required amount and allowed the retracts to once again fit nicely.

On with the rest of the fuselage...... I decided to skin the turtle deck area first using one piece of 3mm. I had previously, rolled a curve into a sheet of 3mm depron so that I had an even amount of curve on each panel that I would cut from this sheet. It made things easier knowing that I didn't have to worry about keeping the curvature of each piece even. If anyone wants to know how I work the curve into a sheet of Depron, I simply support a metal mop stave between 2 garden chairs (anything of a similar height) and firmly press the Depron onto the stave moving my hands along the width of the Depron sheet whilst applying pressure. Then edge the sheet forward a touch and doing the same again. The secret is not to be scared of it and to apply firm, even pressure whilst forming it around the stave.

Progress on the fuselage went as follows

Part 2 to follow shortly...............

Edited By Electriflier on 31/10/2014 20:29:12

[Electriflier]

......Continued
In an attempt to give me a break from the skinning, I thought I'd attempt to make a cannon for the model. As I've mentioned previously, I find myself keeping my eyes peeled for bits that I could use here and there on the model. One such piece was a round lollipop stick that my Grandson discarded. A piece of dowel basically but although hard, very light and more to the point, the perfect diameter at about 6mm. I drilled into the very end to give the hollow barrel appearance and then stuck it into the electric drill to spin up whilst I sanded down the last 15mm section. Satisfied that I'd got the basic shape right, used the press drill to drill loads of 2.5mm holes along its length. It started looking quite good and once I had rubbed black acrylic paint into the 2.5mm holes, wiped aluminium acrylic paint along the whole length of the cannon. This is how it finished up...
Rather chuffed with my efforts, showed Phil who said all the right words, 'wow', 'brilliant' and 'can I borrow it?'
Off he went.....

My attempt......
In typical Phil ' MacGuyver' fashion, he returned with this!

A miniature metal cannon that, well, frankly, made mine look like a lollipop stick with holes drilled into it!.
Anyhow, I digress. The skinning of the fuselage was completed today and now the whole aircraft is ready for rubbing down, filling, rubbing down, filling etc ready hopefully for some paint next week.
So, progress to date looks like this

Oh, forgot to mention, I have cut some acetate sheet to cover the wing lights. They're glued in place, again with Uhu Por.
Rudder and elevator now glued in place

That's all for now
Regards
Roy

Edited By Electriflier on 31/10/2014 20:29:47

Edited By Electriflier on 31/10/2014 20:39:40

[Tony Bennett]

fantastic.

you are the master.

[Ian101]

That's looking rather good gentlemen.

Looking forward to the next exciting episode.

Ian

[Philip Rawlinson]

Well Mr depron guru, again my im has been pressed and my flabber is well and truly ghasted.

The quality and pace of your work is unbelievable.

I am sorry that things have conspired to prevent me calling in to see you this week but hopefully I can call Monday to admire your work.

Cheers Phil.

[Electriflier]

Brief update......
Prepared the decal sheet ready for vinyl printing.
Been a bit busy today but managed to get a little filling and rubbing down done.
Hopefully, next week sees the first coat of paint being applied.

The insignia that Phil liked - The WARDOG!

[Colin Leighfield]

Another really impressive piece of work that you just know is going to fly well. I reckon that your cannon is a 0.5" Browning machine gun though, don't think the Texan ever carried cannon. ( if I'm wrong, please correct me).

However, if it 's cannon you want, then it wouldn't take a lot of effort to re-work that design into a Wackett Boomerang, the Australian low-level single-seater derived from the Wirraway variant of the AT-6. That carried 4x20mm Hispanos, 2 poking out of each wing. One of the most pugnacious looking planes ever and you don't see it very often. You are probably familiar with it, but if not, look it up and you'll see what I mean.

[cymaz]

Here it is !