Ian Mat Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 I'm hoping to gain some advice from you knowledgable lot! I recently added a Blackhorse Spitfire to my squadron, its yet to be assembled. I think the level of detail is quite impressive, however its let down by the glossy film finish. I think if I could make it less glossy, it would look far more realistic, much like the Topflite models I have covered in Oracover. Is there any was of applying a satin varnish that would fit the bill, bearing in mind that this will be powered by a glo engine. Any suggestions greatly received! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Feather Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 aha, I think I can help. I have just done exactly this on a Seagull Zero, and spent some time researching likely candidate lacquers before committing. I have tested a few options, both for fuel-proof-ness and for the ability to stick to the film, and each case tested the product by making a small balsa box and covering it with a sample of film, then spraying it with the chosen product, let it dry thoroughly, then put a few drops of neat (5%) fuel on and leave for a few days. DO NOT use Halfords lacquer, it is not in the slightest bit fuel proof, and does not stick to the film, it just peels off! I've tried Autotek gloss petrol resistant lacquer, which is quite fuel proof (it will mark, but doesn't seem to dissolve) - but since it's gloss, it doesn't help with the "matting down" required on warbirds. The best I've found is Rustoleum Polyurethane Clear Matt Finish varnish. This gives a lovely semi-matt finish, my Zero looks fantastic now. It comes in 400ml tins, I used about 3 tins to do the Zero (68" wingspan). You can get it in B&Q at about £9 a tin. That's a silly price, I got my stocks from sprayster.com at £4.15 a tin instead! And sprayster have lots and lots of other very useful things like grey primer at good prices. The Rustoleum stuff will mark after a couple of days soaking in fuel, but it doesn't appear to penetrate on my test piece. I have yet to maiden the Zero, but it looks hopeful, especially if you clean it down soon after flying. A word of caution: all of the likely products take time to dry properly - the Rustoleum really needs overnight to lose its tackiness - and their fuel resistant properties take time to kick in. I would leave it at least 2 weeks before exposing the results to fuel. edit: here's the link to the product on Sprayster.com: https://www.sprayster.com/product/rust-oleum-ultra-tough-polyurethane-clear-varnish-aerosol-spray-paint-matt/ Hope this helps Simon Edited By Simon Feather on 17/01/2018 12:23:48 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff S Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 That's interesting, Simon. All the normal coverings other than Solartex are too glossy for scale models and a matt finish would improve the appearance of many models. How did you prepare the Zero? I just wondered if any rubbing down with (say) fine wire wool or applying a product like Prymol before spraying the Rustoleum was either tried or needed? My winter build is a DB Cirrus Moth and although Solartex is the usual covering of choice for a model like that I can't help thinking it's a bit too coarse in texture. The photographs I took of the full size Tiger Moth (G-ACDC) which is the one modelled in my heading photo show a much glossier finish than Solartex but not as much as a shiny film so a good matt varnish could be the answer. Geoff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Feather Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 Hi Geoff, I did a few experiments first before committing to spraying the entire model - one traditional way of "matting" a shiny model is to rub it down with a kitchen sponge, you know, the ones with a green scouring pad on one side. I tried that, and I tried fine steel wool (000 gauge), and fine wet-and-dry paper (600 grit). All of those left visible edges where the film covered a gap and then came up against balsa e.g. the spaces between the wing ribs. Not at all happy with that, hence why I did a bit of (slightly) scientific research into varnishes and lacquers. The Rustoleum polyurethane varnish seems to be a very good product in terms of adhesion to film. I did start with a light rubbing down with fine wet-and-dry to key the surface - but the experiments showed this wasn't really needed, it seems to stick just as well without. Of course, only time will tell, I've not yet flown the Zero (waiting for warmer, less damp conditions), so although it passed the wet fuel test, it's not yet been subjected to exhaust gases. I do suggest that any of you wanting to try this do your own confidence test before covering a cherished model with it as it'll be impossible to remove! Cellulose thinners will strip it before it's set properly, not sure about when it's had a couple of weeks to dry... (.... waiting for the purists to point out that actually, the Zero came out of the factory with a glossy finish, apparently. Yes, I know, but I don't care, a shiny warbird just looks wrong!) I also suspect that any subsequent film repairs due to hangar rash etc might require a novel approach to applying a patch. So just something else to be aware of. Though I have tightened up a few wrinkles with the iron post-varnishing, and that seemed to work OK without damaging the finish. It's definitely looking promising Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Feather Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 oh, ps - I'm not sure how it'll react with decal film, I've not done that particular test. I cut my own markings for the Zero using a vinyl film cutter which I then applied after the matting process. The usual way of dealing with possible sensitive surfaces though when spraying is to do a very light misting first and let it dry, to form a seal, and then keep the coats very light. I needed about 3 coats in the end to get a finish I was happy with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff S Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 Fuel proofing won't be a problem for me, Simon, unless electrons attack it as it will be electrically powered. Thanks for the useful information and the link to sprayster.com. Geoff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Mat Posted January 17, 2018 Author Share Posted January 17, 2018 Thanks very much for that Simon, That sounds like a good solution, my only problem is that the blackhorse spitfire has printed film and the decals already applied. I wonder how I could test the model without damaging it! I might just order a few cans of that anyway, because it will come in useful for other jobs! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Mat Posted January 17, 2018 Author Share Posted January 17, 2018 I am tempted to make the spitfire electric, however I already have a suitable saito 100 that has just had new bearings! I'm also guessing that a model that size would need 5 or 6 cell power, which I don't have the infrastructure for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Feather Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 Ian, you could probably try a small, inconspicuous area, say underneath somewhere to test, and carefully mask off the rest of the model; but if you keep the coats very light indeed, I'd've thought you ought to be OK. Be warned though, it's very smelly stuff! Probably not a kitchen table job... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 The area I have previously tested on which is usually out of site, is the wing area facing the inside of the fuz. As Simon mentioned make sure you mask off well to prevent any overspray. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trevor Crook Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 Geoff, if it doesn't need to be fuelproof, Plastikote matt varnish works well. It's available from many d.i.y. outlets. When I used it I de-greased the film, then brushed on Prymol before spraying on the varnish. So far, adhesion has been fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Fry Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 I am a bit dubious about trying to change a shiny film to a satin finish. Shiny film is not great to stick anything to. And having got something to stick, repairs can be a problem. My appproach, (and caveat emptor here), is to get some much diluted paint, in different shades, a wash, and with a rag, wipe it over surfaces, in the direction of airflow. It isn't fuel proof, it needs reapplying where it wears off. But it's quick. And it looks OK. Fron a metre or two away. Edited By Don Fry on 17/01/2018 19:45:39 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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