Nigel Heather Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 Just occured to me that with the forthcoming extension of the aerodrome exclusion zone from 1km to 3km will some of our ling established flying clubs be at risk. Just measured for the club that I fly at and it is 6km away so safe - but are any going to be not so lucky. Cheers, Nigel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuban8 Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 AFAIK, depends on what type of aerodrome you are close to - ranging from a farm strip to an international airport. Not clear myself, but isn't it something to do with whether the 'airport' is registered or licenced? Probably buried away in the reams of papers that we've had thrust at us over the months. I'm certain someone will be able to point straight to it. My club is just outside the current 1km distance from a small aerodrome that provides maintenance to GA. Never had an issue with them in over 40 years. So why should that change now? Edited By Cuban8 on 20/01/2019 10:33:15 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Privett Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 There was a list of airports that the restriction applied to somewhere in the information put out by the CAA. Let me see if I can find it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Privett Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 The list is here. After a little re-formatting... Aberdeen/Dyce - EGPD Alderney - EGJA Andrewsfield - EGSL Barra - EGPR Barrow/Walney Island - EGNL Bedford - EGBF Belfast/Aldergrove - EGAA Belfast/City - EGAC Benbecula - EGPL Biggin Hill - EGKB Birmingham - EGBB Blackbushe - EGLK Blackpool - EGNH Bournemouth - EGHH Bristol - EGGD Caernarfon - EGCK Cambridge - EGSC Campbeltown - EGEC Cardiff - EGFF Carlisle - EGNC Chalgrove - EGLJ Chichester/Goodwood - EGHR Coll - EGEL Colonsay - EGEY Compton Abbas - EGHA Coventry - EGBE Cranfield - EGTC Cumbernauld - EGPG Denham - EGLD Derby - EGBD Doncaster Sheffield - EGCN Dundee - EGPN Dunkeswell - EGTU Durham Tees Valley - EGNV Duxford - EGSU Earls Colne - EGSR East Midlands - EGNX Eday - EGED Edinburgh - EGPH Elstree - EGTR Enniskillen/St Angelo - EGAB Exeter - EGTE Fair Isle - EGEF Fairoaks - EGTF Farnborough - EGLF Fenland - EGCL Glasgow - EGPF Gloucestershire - EGBJ Guernsey - EGJB Haverfordwest - EGFE Hawarden - EGNR Humberside - EGNJ Inverness - EGPE Islay - EGPI Isle of Man - EGNS Jersey - EGJJ Kemble - EGBP Kirkwall - EGPA Lands End - EGHC Lashenden/Headcorn - EGKH Leeds Bradford - EGNM Leeds East - EGCM Lee-on-Solent - EGHF Leicester - EGBG Lerwick/Tingwall - EGET Liverpool - EGGP London/City - EGLC London Gatwick - EGKK London Heathrow - EGLL London Luton - EGGW London Stansted - EGSS Londonderry/Eglinton - EGAE Lydd - EGMD Manchester - EGCC Manchester/Barton - EGCB Netherthorpe - EGNF Newcastle - EGNT Newquay - EGHQ Newtownards - EGAD Northampton/Sywell - EGBK Northolt - EGWU North Ronaldsay - EGEN Norwich - EGSH Nottingham - EGBN Oban - EGEO Old Buckenham - EGSV Old Sarum - EGLS Old Warden - EGTH Oxford - EGTK Papa Westray - EGEP Pembrey - EGFP Perth/Scone - EGPT Peterborough/Conington - EGSF Prestwick - EGPK Redhill - EGKR Retford/Gamston - EGNE Rochester - EGTO Sanday - EGES Sandtoft - EGCF Scatsta - EGPM Scilly Isles/St Mary’s - EGHE Sherburn-in-Elmet - EGCJ Shobdon - EGBS Shoreham - EGKA Sleap - EGCV Southampton - EGHI Southend - EGMC Stapleford - EGSG Stornoway - EGPO Stronsay - EGER Sumburgh - EGPB Swansea - EGFH Tatenhill - EGBM Thruxton - EGHO Tiree - EGPU Warton - EGNO Wellesbourne Mountford - EGBW Welshpool - EGCW Westray - EGEW West Wales/Aberporth - EGFA White Waltham - EGLM Wick - EGPC Wickenby - EGNW Wolverhampton/Halfpenny Green - EGBO Wycombe Air Park/Booker - EGTB Yeovil/Westland - EGHG Edited By John Privett on 20/01/2019 10:42:14 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piers Bowlan Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 Quite a few MFCs operate from private air strips, so with the owners permission I cannot see these new regulations making any difference to that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuban8 Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 Thanks for the listing, very important info that needs to made obvious to all. Old Warden! How will that work out for the club that uses the airfield and the modelling events - obviously, a workaround exists? Have just found one club using the BMFA club finder, that is perilously close to having a problem. Edited By Cuban8 on 20/01/2019 11:47:05 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Lee Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 That list is for civilian airfields only. Military airfields with Air Traffic Zones will also have the restrictions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Privett Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 Posted by Steve J on 20/01/2019 10:33:08: I am not sure where you are getting 3km from. It's the ATZ and rectangular extensions 5km from the ends of the runway(s). Steve Yes - currently the restriction (for < 7 kg) is 1 km from the airfield unless ATC permission is given. The amendment is to extend that to the ATZ - defined as 2 nautical miles, or 4.6 km. Plus the extra 5 km x 1 km extension at the end of each runway. See pages 11 and 12 here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nigel Heather Posted January 20, 2019 Author Share Posted January 20, 2019 Posted by Steve J on 20/01/2019 10:33:08: I am not sure where you are getting 3km from. It's the ATZ and rectangular extensions 5km from the ends of the runway(s). Steve I may be misunderstanding. But I thought that was the current regulation is that you can’t fly a ‘drone’ within 1km of an aerodrome boundary and that after the recent fun and games at Gatwick and Heathrow this is going to be extended to 3km. This is relating to the aerodrome boundary not just the runway. My thinking is that well organised clubs that have been operating without problem for years my suddenly find that they can no longer operate legally in their current location. My concern is that the legislation is really aimed at individuals up to no good or flying irresponsibly near major airports but the blanket regulations will cover many more aerodromes and therefore, could impact well run, long established and organised model clubs.. Cheers, Nigel Edited By Nigel Heather on 20/01/2019 11:59:25 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Stainforth Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 I, for one, am for the new regulations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Privett Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 Posted by Nigel Heather on 20/01/2019 11:49:54: I may be misunderstanding. But I thought that was the current regulation is that you can’t fly a ‘drone’ within 1km of an aerodrome boundary and that after the recent fun and games at Gatwick and Heathrow this is going to be extended to 3km. This is relating to the aerodrome boundary not just the runway. My thinking is that well organised clubs that have been operating without problem for years my suddenly find that they can no longer operate legally in their current location. My concern is that the legislation is really aimed at individuals up to no good or flying irresponsibly near major airports but the blanket regulations will cover many more aerodromes and therefore, could impact well run, long established and organised model clubs.. The current 1 km limit allows 'drones' to be flown with permission from ATC. And for the new proposed wider limit the text on page 12 at section 2.6, just underneath the diagram that Steve reposted above, says; "Drone fliers will continue to be able to apply for permission from air traffic control to fly within this zone" So that appears to enable clubs to apply to fly in the new 4.6 km zone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 This report seems to confirm that it's not just kids who are being a menace. "A man has been charged with flying a drone near Heathrow Airport on 24 December. George Rusu is accused of using a drone on a field near the runway just days after a scare at Gatwick grounded more than 1,000 flights. He has been charged with flying a "small unmanned aircraft without permission of air traffic control". Mr Rusu, 38, from Hillingdon, will appear at Uxbridge Magistrates' Court on Tuesday. The alleged incident happened just three days after Gatwick Airport fully reopened on December 21, following three days of chaos affecting about 140,000 passengers." As for the OP's question, isn't this for flying without ATC approval? My club is roughly 4km to the side of the local international airport but we have standing ATC approval to fly with a 400' limit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Privett Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 Posted by Bob Cotsford on 20/01/2019 13:17:18: This report seems to confirm that it's not just kids who are being a menace. Let's not jump to conclusions - remember that poor couple near Gatwick who were hung, drawn and quartered by the Daily Mail and others, and hopefully have a big legal claim under way against the press... But, should this person be found guilty, then I hope the biggest possible fine and maximum publicity will result, "pour décourager les autres." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 Posted by Steve J on 20/01/2019 13:27:35: Posted by Bob Cotsford on 20/01/2019 13:17:18: My club is roughly 4km to the side of the local international airport but we have standing ATC approval to fly with a 400' limit. It would be difficult for them to refuse as, at the moment, you don't actually need their approval. Have they put you in their aerodrome AIP entry? Steve Oh yes, though we do got the occasional light plane or more likely heli overfly at 500'ish estimated. Even that looks bloomin low! Needless to say everyone heads for the deck when that happens just to be safe! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Stainforth Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 Posted by Steve J on 20/01/2019 12:07:22: Posted by John Stainforth on 20/01/2019 12:04:22: I, for one, am for the new regulations. I, for one, think that they are completely pointless and are simply the government pandering to BALPA. Steve Oh! Shock! Horror! That we pilots of little model planes should pander to the wishes of professional pilots of full-size planes who have daily responsible for thousands of peoples lives! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piers Bowlan Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 Balpa just want to have something to be seen to be done now, rather than the legislative machinations of the D of T that has been going on in the background for some time. It has always been the case that you need permission from the local ATC unit to fly in an Aerodrome Traffic Zone, it is just that now the changes to the ANO make that abundantly clear with the threat of severe penalties for contravention. I doubt it will make any practical difference to model flying at Old Warden or Cosford etc. The legislation is to raise public awareness of what is obvious to all model flyers; don't fly near full sized aircraft! I used to fly gliders from Mill Hill, which is just a mile from Shoreham airport. The hill is just under 300ft elevation whilst the airport is just 7ft AMSL. Consequently, aircraft on approach to land are very adjacent to the top of the hill when they made their approach to RW20. There was an unwritten rule amongst glider flyers not to fly above the top of the ridge for obvious reasons! I always thought it was all a bit 'casual' and sure enough, one day, a visiting French pilot collided with a foamy Zagi (not mine ) after skimming across the crest of the hill . The Shoreham airport operator in the official incident report said that they 'weren't aware that model gliders flew from the hill' despite the fact that they have done so for the last 40 years on a daily basis when conditions allow! The moral of the story is to get your permission in writing and carry it with you, just incase the 'boys in blue' turn up. Edited By Piers Bowlan on 21/01/2019 08:11:11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piers Bowlan Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 I think the council bye-laws don't permit glider flying from Mill Hill now anyway but I may be wrong about that too Steve! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GONZO Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 A question. If my RC plane/drone(FPV drones and planes below 250gms are available) is below 250gms does all this apply? If it does apply to planes/drones below 250gms how far down/low in weight does it go? Could you be breaking the law by flying a paper plan too close to an airport? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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