Peter Christy Posted January 14, 2023 Share Posted January 14, 2023 18 minutes ago, Martin Harris - Moderator said: I haven’t driven a Japanese car for some years so I don’t know the current layout but they certainly retained what to me, is the logical positioning of indicators on the right in cars for the UK market for many years after European standardisation, based no doubt on LHD. It’s always irked me that our own manufacturers went to the LHD layout so quickly. I’ve got other things to do with my left hand away from the steering wheel and it was so easy to flick an indicator switch with a right finger. I wonder if this is at the root of the scarcity of indicator use so often observed? Absolutely! Actually, there is another reason the Saab 96 had the indicators on the right - it has a column shift gear change! You couldn't possibly have the indicators on the same side! The LHD versions had everything swapped around, gear shift and indicators. I'd forgotten about Japanese cars, but as they also drive on the left, it makes sense that they would adopt the sensible layout. Probably some EU regulation (plus economies of scale) forced left-handed indicators on us! Just going back to the column shift gears, these actually make a lot of sense in FWD cars, as the gearbox is usually near the end of the steering column! That means virtually no linkage! It makes even more sense with a transverse engine layout, where the gear shafts run in the right axis for the rotary output of the column shift! Column shifts got a bad reputation due to the complexity of the linkage on a RWD car, leading to a lot of potential for slop and maladjustment. But they do have a lot of advantages. On mine, even 3rd and 4th (furthest away from the steering wheel) are within a finger length of the wheel. It is possible to go right through the gears from reverse to top (and back!) without taking your hand off the steering! There is also no transmission tunnel, so plenty of room to stretch your leg on a long drive. Trivia: I seem to recall that a column shift was an extra cost option on early Aston-Martins! -- Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Lewis 3 Posted January 14, 2023 Share Posted January 14, 2023 And lets not forget British and Italian bikes had their gearchange on the right and then the japanese switched it around on to the left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kc Posted January 14, 2023 Share Posted January 14, 2023 (edited) On 12/01/2023 at 16:32, paul devereux said: but it was't widely adopted until the Morris 8 copied them in the 1930s. As the Morris 8 was a best-seller, and licensed or copied around the world other manufacturers started falling into line for the convenience of drivers. Do you really mean Morris 8 and not Austin 7? The !933 Morris Minor ( not the Issigonnis one but an Austin 7 lookalike ) had the brake pedal on right with central throttle pedal but a year or so later by 1935 the Morris 8 had the modern pedal layout. I think the Austin 7 had that a decade before. The Austin 7 was licensed around the world - Japan and the USA ( Bantam ) - but not the Morris as far as I know. The 1934/5 Morris 8 looked very similar outside to the Ford 8 Y type but was more advanced technically than the Ford. Morris 8 was the first £100 car and had hydraulic brakes and electric wiper. I recall ( might be wrong! ) that my Morris 8 had the indicators on the left of the steering column but a switch not a stalk. Edited January 14, 2023 by kc 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Christy Posted January 14, 2023 Share Posted January 14, 2023 Back in the 60's, a mate of mine had a Morris 8 type "E", similar to this one: His favourite chat-up line in the pub was "Do you want a lift home in my E-type?" Strangely, it never worked twice...! -- Pete 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kc Posted January 14, 2023 Share Posted January 14, 2023 To set the record straight - it seems, according to Wikipedia, thatJeremy Clarkson and James May concluded that the Austin 7 was the first mass market car to have modern control layout ( not the Morris 8 ) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul devereux Posted January 14, 2023 Share Posted January 14, 2023 2 hours ago, kc said: Do you really mean Morris 8 and not Austin 7? The !933 Morris Minor ( not the Issigonnis one but an Austin 7 lookalike ) had the brake pedal on right with central throttle pedal but a year or so later by 1935 the Morris 8 had the modern pedal layout. I think the Austin 7 had that a decade before. The Austin 7 was licensed around the world - Japan and the USA ( Bantam ) - but not the Morris as far as I know. The 1934/5 Morris 8 looked very similar outside to the Ford 8 Y type but was more advanced technically than the Ford. Morris 8 was the first £100 car and had hydraulic brakes and electric wiper. I recall ( might be wrong! ) that my Morris 8 had the indicators on the left of the steering column but a switch not a stalk. You are quite right. Thanks for setting the record straight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul devereux Posted January 14, 2023 Share Posted January 14, 2023 3 minutes ago, paul devereux said: You are quite right. Thanks for setting the record straight. Gosh, I have been so factually incorrect in both the popularity of Mode 2 and the history of car controls.! Everyday is a learning day for me, lol! Here's an interesting video. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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