Glues

[Dave Towell]

Don't know of this is in the right thread but.

 

Gorilla Glue is now avalibe at FOCUS diy stores. Just came in yesterday to my local store and apparently is a new line they are all going to stock it.  Just thought I'd let people know.

[winchweight]

You can get it in "Charlies Stores" too.

[iawnski]

thought focus going bust?

[Dave Towell]

Dont think focus going bust, but if it is, best I buy a decent stock pile of the stuff then!!!!!!!

[Erfolg]

Is Gorrilla glue, just another Polyurethane adhesive? Just like Henkels "Elch Pro"

[Peter 'Ivanna Crashalot' Savage]

What woudl be good is if you had an aliphatic glue for gluing like the curved leading edge sheeting on, then you spray activator and it sets like super glue, whereas super glue automatically drys whether activator is used or not

[Dave Towell]

 Just use some of there glues. they had 2 difrent types so got a small bottel of each just to try them out after hearing so much about them thought I'd give it a go. so decided test them on test pices of scrap balsa, depron,  plastic and metal (dural scraps).

 

OH MY GOD!!!!!! SETS LIKE ITS BEEN TIG WELDED

 

 Ones a clear liquid looks a bit like super glue the other one is a brown gloopy thing and looks a bit like a strange contact adhisive. Technical  descriptions aren't they! They set so solid  its amazing. Some seped out onto my NEW work bench and could hardly get the thing off. there is no way that the glue joint will fail, the wood will fail first.  

 

 will use them again excellent stuff

just wish the curing times a bit quicker.

[260 Flyer]

Unless your name is Tony Nijhuis only buy the small bottles, it lasts for ages and larger quantities tend to set in the bottle. After use squeeze out all the air from the bottle and cap tightly.

The clear one is the fast setting variety and the brown is a bit slower. In the open the fast one foams up to four times its original volume and the brown about double, so don't use too much or you'll end with a wing as a building board.

My favourite use is for reinforcing flimsy ARTF structures, just run a THIN bead along any suspect joint and it will foam up and form a very strong fillet.

[Tim Mackey]

Erfolg...yes.

[Erfolg]

Just goes to show how important the brand name is.

 

Calling your glue Elk or Woodmate, does not sound half as impressive as King Kong glue, or maybe Bulldog grip.

 

I have used at least two brands of Polyurethane adhesive or glue. The current is the Henkel  Elk, used Woodmate and I believe Tercel. They were all D4 grades, water resistant.

 

I personally use them infrequently on models. Generally as now on general timber work, as it is water resistant fills gaps. The downside if your joints are not good it osses out, as it foams. Good fit ,no foaming. If used over a large thin area, that is a little like a diaphram, it needs weighting, to prevent the surface lifting. My main reservation is weight.

 

Just generally preffer PVA and Superglue for models. I have noted it is the wood that usually fails not the joint, in my experience.  

 

Elk costs£8 for 750g, Geocel £9 for 500ml. Any good timber merchant stocks them or there equivalent.

 

 

[ken anderson.]

hello ---anybody out ther use the hot glue gun's--i bought one c/w some stick's of glue tried it on some ply- impressed with the strength of the joint---but been from the old skool--thought better stick to the everyday stuff(white glue/superglue and epox)anybody out there use one on a regular basis/anygood/strong etc...........................

 

                                   thankyou ken anderson...........................

[Erfolg]

Ken

 

I have now used a Hot Glue Gun, having built the Ballerina. It was suggested that the CF to Depron joint could/should be done this way.

 

The resulting joint was not quite what ideally as I would like, which is a beutifully curved trasition to the Depron. Instead a blob, OK, functional. The author warns against over enthusiastic use, to prevent excessive weight accumulation.

 

Seems some stick the servos onto ply sheet by this method.

 

[ken anderson.]

hello erfolg--thanks for that--i'll hang fire for some more feedback.

 

                     ken anderson...................................

[Dave Towell]

Hot glue is all I use on depron it works realy well dosn't add to much wieght as long as its not over used. I put servos in with the stuff, just tape round them first so you can remove it later. just becareful not to use to much near any joint you want to sand as it do not sand very well.

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]

[Dave Towell]

Never noticed hot glue going soft in the summer. will have to keep a eye on that in the summer. Mind you when was the last time we had a summer?????????

[Dane Crosby]

Hi all,

As I posted in another thread, I am trying EPO for the first time (always been wood before). I will soon need to glue my Bixler 1.1 fuselage halves together.

In addition to a hot melt gun (Bosch), I have UHU POR, Various strengths and thicknesses of Cyano, Canopy glue, 5 Min Z-Epoxy, and modellers PVA. I have recently been given a bottle of Gator Glue. Is this any good? It looks a little like Gorilla glue.

Anyway, What is the best way to stick the halves together to give a neat join with good strength. I have searched the forum but failed to find a solid answer to this.

[Dane Crosby]

Ah, I have managed to answer my own question after a bit of research.

Gorilla Glue:

Diphenylmethane diisocyanate, isomers and homologues 45% to 60%

Gator Glue

Diphenylmethane diisocyanate, isomers and homologues 10%-30%

So, Gator is a similar chemical construction, just a bit less gloopy stuff. Prbably takes longer to set but less foamy. I'll report back on a test piece.

[StarLoc FiveStar Adhesives]

Posted by Dane Crosby on 26/11/2013 11:28:11:

Ah, I have managed to answer my own question after a bit of research.

Gorilla Glue:

Diphenylmethane diisocyanate, isomers and homologues 45% to 60%

Gator Glue

Diphenylmethane diisocyanate, isomers and homologues 10%-30%

So, Gator is a similar chemical construction, just a bit less gloopy stuff. Prbably takes longer to set but less foamy. I'll report back on a test piece.

Its not that easy with polyurethanes, MDI is the isocyanate, the very reactive (and very very toxic  part , but to form a glue it is reacted with other components to form the reactive polyurethane, the polyurethanes can be made from a vast amount of chemicals, even natural things like sugars, the components are mixed , under nitrogen to prevent side reactions, always more MDI is used to leave a reactive end group on the polyurethane, the reactive group is required to crosslink in contact with water generating carbon dioxide gas in the process ( foaming the glue )

The polyurethane (strong) part of the glue is not actually listed , the other is just left ove from the reaction, different levels have different properties in the adhesive, but the main difference would be the other reactant in the polyurethane,the reactants are formed from chemicals such as polyethylene glycol , butylene glycol etc all have different properties of hardness and cure speed, rigidity , bond strength etc

They may all sound similar glues but could be totally different, with no real differences on the data sheets

Edited By StarLoc FiveStar Adhesives on 26/11/2013 12:09:43

[Dane Crosby]

Many thanks for the reply. It does all seem to be complicated so I am no further forwards in "guessing" what fixative to use to glue the two EPO Bixler fuselage halves together. The edges to be joined are very long and convoluted. There are also ply parts that enter opposing slots to be glued. All this comes together at the same instant. I don't want the glue which was applied at the start of the process to have gone off before I get to the end. What should I use ??

Maybe I should have stayed with wood which I have coped with for decades!

[David Tweddle]

Hi Dave I used Gorilla Glue on the Foam Fing wing to bond the Pine LE. to the foam Fing wing.

Sticks like the proverbial but it does foam up and a beast to sand.

End result cut the excess back and covered with red Gorilla tape (another first).

David

[Plummet]

If you like Gorilla Glue, then you might like **LINK**

It comes either in a bottle or a sealant-gun cartridge, in 5 or 30 minute types. It sets (fairly) clear, Needs good clamping because it foams. It is a lot cheaper than Gorilla.

Plummet

[Erfolg]

I have used the 45 minute stuff, as well as Woodmate and Elk, all every bit as good as Gorilla in performance.

The one thing that Gorilla does have in its favour is that small bottles can be purchased, which are much easier for modellers to handle. Although at twice the cost.

I think you can tell that Gorilla is aimed at the DIY trade, in that you are told to squeeze out as much air as possible after use. The trade stuff, assumes that you will have used it all before it starts to go of.

I must admit that I have in the past been dismissive of Polyurethane adhesives, in that PVA does most jobs far better at lighter weight build up. However I have recently used it with polystyrene foam to woad and also ply doublers to balsa (instead of impact adhesive). I tend not to use water based impact adhesive, so for foam, Polyurethanes are better. With respect balsa/ply laminations, impact is marginally better, in that it is easier to use, no weighting required.

[Wiltshire Flyer]

I saw gurilla glue in homebase and screwfix today, can u really use them to assemble a model?

[Bob Cotsford]

Posted by Wiltshire Flyer on 27/11/2013 00:12:04:
I saw gurilla glue in homebase and screwfix today, can u really use them to assemble a model?

It's hard to beat for some jobs such as fitting retract mountings in a foam wing or anywhere that gap-filling is useful. I've even used as a filler when building carved wood cowls. Once foamed I find it easy to sand and quite light.