Peter Garsden Posted February 6, 2022 Author Share Posted February 6, 2022 Have not been modelling for a while because I have moved workshops - what a marathon - years of stuff to throw away and box up. Is there a thread for showing your workshop, which I know would interest me. I have had a double garage built which is 2 thirds workshop and 1 third office. Might be of interest? When I moved, I was part way through redoing the balancing of the hybrid slope soarer and power model. Stupidly I thought I could just fill one spinner with lead for soaring until I realised that for power I could not do the same as the spinner would ping off under load - what a twonk! So I set about working out how much lead I would have to squeeze inside the cowl and it was huge - more than I can fit in without fowling the motor, so.. here are the pictures of the removed cowl and the amount of lead needed I am going to make a lost foam cowl out of fibreglass. I can then much more easily remove the cowl with screws and glue in strips of lead. I figure it won't be too difficult. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leccyflyer Posted February 6, 2022 Share Posted February 6, 2022 I'd love to see your workshop Peter- I found that the long-running workshops threads on RCG gave me loads of ideas for my own workshop conversion recently and one can always learn and implement good ideas which others have found to work well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EarlyBird Posted February 6, 2022 Share Posted February 6, 2022 22 minutes ago, Peter Garsden said: Is there a thread for showing your workshop, which I know would interest me. Here you go Peter. Steve 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Davies 3 Posted February 6, 2022 Share Posted February 6, 2022 1 hour ago, Peter Garsden said: Have not been modelling for a while because I have moved workshops - what a marathon - years of stuff to throw away and box up. Is there a thread for showing your workshop, which I know would interest me. I have had a double garage built which is 2 thirds workshop and 1 third office. Might be of interest? When I moved, I was part way through redoing the balancing of the hybrid slope soarer and power model. Stupidly I thought I could just fill one spinner with lead for soaring until I realised that for power I could not do the same as the spinner would ping off under load - what a twonk! So I set about working out how much lead I would have to squeeze inside the cowl and it was huge - more than I can fit in without fowling the motor, so.. here are the pictures of the removed cowl and the amount of lead needed I am going to make a lost foam cowl out of fibreglass. I can then much more easily remove the cowl with screws and glue in strips of lead. I figure it won't be too difficult. Hi Peter, It is indeed a tail heavy beast! As we discussed, I had similar issues getting the thing to balance; there's just no room to add ballast without causing some other issue (cooling!), I managed to get some lead inside the motor box using a team of trained mice... The cowl is a good idea. that will at least free up some clearance for both lead and cooling air. Graham Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Garsden Posted February 17, 2022 Author Share Posted February 17, 2022 Thanks for the workshop thread Early Bird. Will post when I have done some photos. Nearly finished now. Back to the cowl. I made a start on a blue foam inner mould today using a combination of my foam cutting pen, Model Belt Sander, Japanese Pull Saw, Permagrit Rough File, and Sanding Disc with holes which is brilliant. Here are the pictures I drew round the existing cowl then sliced bits off with the Japanese Saw I had to cut out an internal hole for the engine mount so marked up the foam I used my home made foam cutting pen which is 2 pieces of wire bound with tape between a piece of balsa capped with 2 inserts from a 13A Plug and some nichrome wire inserted in the tip. Wires connected to the ends then attached to the transformer - Fashioned with the Permagrit file Next job is wrap it in Parcel Tape, and wax it, and mount on something suitable to wrap around the fibreglass bandage and resin. Watch this space. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Garsden Posted February 19, 2022 Author Share Posted February 19, 2022 Well, the blue foam shape is now wrapped with brown parcel tape, which I then ironed down flat with my Solarfilm Iron. The plan is then to add a layer of wax, but when I got out the tin it had dried out, so I have put it on the radiator to thaw out. No doubt there is a fluid you can add to moisten it up? Turpentine apparently but not so straight forward - https://gillysaustralia.com.au/blogs/gillys-blog/how-to-soften-up-hardened-furniture-wax You can see here the finished mould sitting on a support. When applying the fibreglass you have to have 360 degree access with the brush, so I made this balsa stand which will be clamped to the bench. The cloth will be in strips on the sides with a disc on the top and overlap. It will drape over the bottom edges then be trimmed when dry with a Dremmel. Obviously I used 3mm balsa scrap which I wedged into the receptive hole for size 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Garsden Posted February 23, 2022 Author Share Posted February 23, 2022 First layer of 160 gram fibreglass cloth on with additional strength from some carbon tows and ribbon 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Garsden Posted March 2, 2022 Author Share Posted March 2, 2022 Well 3 layers of 160 gram fibreglass cloth later it was time for a final coat of resin and micro balloons mix. I find that it is important to coat the mould first in resin before applying the cloth, and dabbing resin on top with emphasis on the dab. If you try to brush it will disturb and drag the cloth out of shape. The coat needs to be thick enough not to run when applied but not too thick to prevent spreading over the cloth. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyB Posted March 2, 2022 Share Posted March 2, 2022 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Peter Garsden said: Well 3 layers of 160 gram fibreglass cloth later it was time for a final coat of resin and micro balloons mix. I find that it is important to coat the mould first in resin before applying the cloth, and dabbing resin on top with emphasis on the dab. If you try to brush it will disturb and drag the cloth out of shape. The coat needs to be thick enough not to run when applied but not too thick to prevent spreading over the cloth. The Paul Janssens method (he was famous for this technique for PSS models in the 90s) utilised the old formulation 3M77 spray to attach the cloth initially. It had the perfect amount of “tack” for the job without affecting how the cloth wetted out with epoxy. Unfortunately environmental regs meant the propellant was changed sometime in the early 2000s, and the new version was too prone to gloving up to be appropriate. https://pjmodelclassics.weebly.com/about.html Edited March 2, 2022 by MattyB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattyB Posted March 3, 2022 Share Posted March 3, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, MattyB said: ...Unfortunately environmental regs meant the propellant was changed sometime in the early 2000s, and the new version was too prone to gloving up to be appropriate. ... or even globbing up! ?♂️? Edited March 3, 2022 by MattyB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Garsden Posted March 3, 2022 Author Share Posted March 3, 2022 5 hours ago, MattyB said: ... or even globbing up! ?♂️? Absolutely Matty, it all started for me with a Paul Janssen plan of an Alpha Jet, and I did indeed use the spray, but only for the first layer methinks. The problem is wetting out the cloth enough so that it sticks, and avoiding the cloth underneath the fuselage from dropping off. As the bottom of the cowl is open this isn't fortunately a problem for me hence why I didn't use that method. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Garsden Posted March 5, 2022 Author Share Posted March 5, 2022 (edited) I have sanded off the excess microballoons and smoothed down the outside of the canopy, then the dreaded job of the Acetone to scoop out the blue foam and pull off the parcel tape. Much easier with this small mould than a whole fuselage from the inside, I can tell you. Came out easily leaving a smooth inner surface I then had to cut a circle out for the motor and spinner. I matched up the old cowl, and drew a line round the hole as a guide, then used these router tools in the dremmel/Proxxon I finished off with the round Permagrit file which worked a treat. I usually used 2 layers of 160 gram then a final layer of 80 gram, however as this part is likely to take some hammer I went for 3 layers of 160 gram. After all I only have to add lead round the inside of this, so? Edited March 5, 2022 by Peter Garsden 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Curtis 1 Posted July 3, 2022 Share Posted July 3, 2022 Peter Great topic, could you advise contact details for your pilot supplier please. Regards Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LHR Dave Posted August 22, 2022 Share Posted August 22, 2022 Hi Peter How about a conclusion to this thread, some final photos and a flight report ? Interested to see how you got on. dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Garsden Posted September 18, 2022 Author Share Posted September 18, 2022 On 03/07/2022 at 13:59, Phil Curtis 1 said: Peter Great topic, could you advise contact details for your pilot supplier please. Regards Phil Sorry missed this post. My pilot supplier is Andy Meade whom you can message on this forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Garsden Posted October 21, 2022 Author Share Posted October 21, 2022 Well a bit of news - I took the completed Spitfire to the PSSA meeting at the Orme with a view to flying it on the Friday. Conditions were ideal with a 20mph wind on the tank tracks slope if slightly Westerly. I duly assembled everything. I had a switch to turn the motor off with the Failsafe set to 0%. All good so far. I switched on and went to put the model down, by mistake switched the switch off and the motor revved up to full speed - no prop on as it was set up for sloping. I couldn't stop it and had to disconnect the battery. By this time it had pulled the cowling and the motor box off the firewall. I was so annoyed. I really don't know why this happened. Al suggested it was because on Futaba Transmitters the motor reverses itself so 0% was 100%. I had weighed the model at 3.4 lbs so it would have flown fast, but none the less I was annoyed, so back in the bag it went. So I decided to make it a PSS model only, took the motor out, replaced the fibreglass cowling I had made with the original balsa cowl, balanced and weighed at 1lb less ie 2.4lbs - more like it. I took the LIPO out and put an NImh battery in its place. I had to cut away some ply to make a battery box slide in. And I bought a magnetic switch so I don't have to remove the hatch to switch it on. Finally an underneath shot showing the airbrush shading I did. I am planning to fly this, wind permitting, at the LMMGA Club PSS competition a week on Sunday - https://www.lmmga.co.uk/2011-08-18-13-54-36/277-power-scale-club-competition Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Davies 3 Posted October 21, 2022 Share Posted October 21, 2022 Still looks great Peter! Good luck next week Graham 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Garsden Posted October 24, 2022 Author Share Posted October 24, 2022 The Spitfire flew well on Saturday at Edge Top, Leek, Staffs as you can see. The wind was about 25mph and the lift good. It does need a good blow and does fly fast. All in all a success 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Garsden Posted January 3, 2023 Author Share Posted January 3, 2023 (edited) Thought I would report on an unfortunate smash at the last PSS event, which looks awful but was actually repaired and back to flying condition within a couple of hours on the bench. The event was an impromptu meeting of the PSSA at the Great Orme on 29th December 2022. The winds were 55mph on the edge and with compression, but only 35mph where we stood, or rather kneeled as the gusts kept blowing you off your feet! I was looping the Spitfire across the slope, but the winds were so strong that I was being blown back towards the slope. Gradually the loops got closer. I pulled up elevator to bring the plane round then to my horror saw the Spitfire hit the ground in front of me. The compression had sucked the plane into the ground. If you look carefully, you will notice that it nearly made, hence getting away with little damage. It looks dramatic because the elevators and rudder were ripped out on impact and the weighted cowl sheered off. Stevie Kemp was videoing Phil Cooke's A4 Skyhawk, which you can just see in the distance when the Spitfire suddenly crashed right in front of him. A true "You've been framed" moment. Steve's daughter cleverly edited it into slow down mode, hence the strange audio. Edited January 3, 2023 by Peter Garsden 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Cooke Posted January 3, 2023 Share Posted January 3, 2023 Glad the Spit is all repaired and ready to go again Pete! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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