Graham Davies 3 Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 Copied over from Martin's ME109 thread... A few pics and a bit of explanation... Graham R made a point about finishing warbirds. I must admit for many years I also saw them as out of my reach, and I think this is shared by many club members. Richard Wills has opened my eyes to the fact that a warbird finish is really no harder than a sports model, and some of the skills are really satisfying and 'in front of the telly' accessible. However, I thought I would try a sports model this time for the very reason Graham R stated; many people 'get' sports planes... Why the CAP? I like them, and Peter Miller told me his favourite design was the CAP21 he built. I bought the cowl and canopy from Vortex, but then went to the 232 as I like the wing platform. I simply scaled the design from a 3 view, and applied the shapes directly to the foam board. It's very much semi-scale. I have made the fuselage a bit taller to give my immature self knife edge performance, and the canopy line is not right, but hey... Wings are made by using around 7 ribs and curling the skins by dragging over a table edge. Spars are 1/4" sq pine from B&G. Foamboard is Hobbycraft board with the inner paper skin removed by applying a bit of heat with an iron. Takes a bit of time, but save a lot of weight. The out skin is retained and I will paint directly onto this. Fuselage is quite conventional with 1/32" ply doublers, 1/8" ply F1 and F2, and liteply F3. F2 is set back so the wing dowels are in the dihedral brace. You'll see the step in the wing. This means I can mount the undercarriage blocks to the fuselage rather than the wing. Far tougher and simpler. The motor will mount on a battery box 'coffin' that will fit through the square hole in F1. That makes it easy to line the motor up with the centre of the cowl. The fuselage is built onto a 'crutch' of foamboard. This keeps it all straight, and most is cut away once the sides are on. You can see a big chunk still in place around the cockpit. This will also go as it's no longer needed once the formers are in place. Tailplane and fin, rudder and elevators are all double thickness foamboard with only the outer skins remaining. Tough, stiff and light. There will be minimal covering; just any exposed foam will be covered with copier paper applied with thinned PVA and ironed on. I will then paint with thinned emulsion, sprayed on. Any bits of the colour scheme that are white, I get for free! I am still considering covering the whole thing with laminating film after paint to give it a nice gloss finish and make it really robust, but I also want to minimise the build hours so I'm not scared of crashing it (I find less fear of crashing tends to lead to less crashes!). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Davies 3 Posted October 16, 2022 Author Share Posted October 16, 2022 So, a fair bit more completed today... Rear turtle deck is now done; rolled 2 pieces of foamboard to get them to curve and stuck the first down with POR. Secured the edge of the second and cut along the overhang. Then glued them together. Front deck is easier as the flat bit in the middle is easy to glue Motor mount/ battery box is made although not yet fitted. It's easy to line it up when the cowl is in place, then I can tack it in with wedges of scrap before epoxying it up. If you haven't done this before, it's a great way to line up your spinner gap. Tail feathers are now done. 2 laminations of board with the inside tapered at the trailing edge before they are glued together. Leading edges chamfered and will be covered in copier paper (LE only) with thinned PVA to tidy it up. Just the top deck/ battery hatch and lower nose area to finish, then fit the radio. I'll do this once I have the motor in so I can shuffle the servos around to get it to balance without ballast. So far, looking good. Cockpit floor to add so Ted can be fitted (long suffering pilot/ bear), and undercarriage to bend up. Then a splash of paint and we're ready to go! Graham 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martin collins 1 Posted October 16, 2022 Share Posted October 16, 2022 Looking great Graham, let`s see an eye catching colourful finish to catch the eye of the foamboard Naysayers 🥳 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Davies 3 Posted October 17, 2022 Author Share Posted October 17, 2022 Yes Martin! Some striking lines and graphics should do it. It's nice to be able to see a model too. I put the Regianne down on our strip the other day and then spent 10 minutes looking for it... Some more progress. Fitted the motor box. I secured the box into position with some foamboard wedges and then epoxied it in. There's a plywood plate that secures the rear end of the box that is then glued to the ply doublers to lock the whole ensemble. Now this is done, I can put in all the fixed heavy bits so I can balance the model by placing the servos where they best balance. I've made a battery hatch. A single piece of foamboard to back it., and then a slice of polystyrene, cut and sanded to shape. I added somef oamboard to the top of the cowl to make it easier to get a nice profile across the top, but it will take a bit of tidying at the front edge. Ted is trying out the office for size... I will make the undercarriage next so I have all the heavy bits in place, and then will fit the servos. Once these are in, I can close the bottom of the fuselage and tidy up all the edges of foamboard. Then it's just a case of covering the various foamboard edges with PVA/ copier paper, and a bit of painting.... Graham 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martin collins 1 Posted October 17, 2022 Share Posted October 17, 2022 Going together very quickly Graham, should have it in the air by the end of the week 😜 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john stones 1 - Moderator Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 Not seen a 232 for yonks, very nice choice. 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Robson Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 Looking good Graham, I see you have the bear necessities, I would beware of striking lines there is a lot about. I have started that T tail foam board twin, I will post when I get a bit further on with it Talking of concentration I had a 40 min flight today not through choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martin collins 1 Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 T Tail Eric, scale? What was your 40 min flight? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Robson Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 Hi Martin, It's a Westland Whirlwind but I am making the fuselage and tail unit first to see how it works out in foam. The 40min flight is documented in "Autumn who's flying" in latest posts, the next time I won't put as much petrol in, it is the supplied fuel tank converted for petrol. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martin collins 1 Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 What size is the Whirlwind Eric, i have a Cloud Models Whirlwind kit in my stash, it is probably going to be one of the ones i let go as my pile of to do kits keeps getting bigger especially now the door to the Foamboard room has been opened ............ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Robson Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 Hi Martin, it will be 60" span, built similar to my Me 110 to run on 3s 3000, I may try retracts but don't really want to add too much weight as the 110 is just right and easy to hand launch, in over a 130 flights it has never broke a prop even doing touch and goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Davies 3 Posted October 19, 2022 Author Share Posted October 19, 2022 Tiny bit more this evening. Fitted the servos and made the pushrods. OLD SCHOOL! Normal sized servos and dowel pushrods. I felt that those control surfaces are huge, and a bit of grunt won't hurt at the expense of a couple of ounces. At this wing area, that isn't here nor there. I like dowel pushrods; nice and direct and slop free at the expense of a bit of temperature trim change. Balances OK, so all should be well. I'll be able to close up the fuselage next session... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Davies 3 Posted October 19, 2022 Author Share Posted October 19, 2022 Just to clarify, the pushrods will be supported! They're just laying in to get the lengths... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Davies 3 Posted October 20, 2022 Author Share Posted October 20, 2022 Small amount of non-exciting progress today. Applied some copier paper to the exposed foam edges of the elevators and some of the fuselage. I bored myself, so still have a bit more to do. I have to say though, I have tried to keep the paper on the foamboard this time, but probably will revert to brown paper next time. It's really easy to strip the surface from the foamboard paper and I think the finish will be a bit worse than the Brown paper/ PVA. We'll see though. I also applied a strip of light glass cloth with PVA to the centre section of the wing as a bit of insurance. Next job is to separate the ailerons; you can see the broken line of cuts I made before I fitted the top skin. Hopefully it will be a really easy separation. Final job I did was to fit the pushrods, an internal support and the fuselage lower skin. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Davies 3 Posted October 21, 2022 Author Share Posted October 21, 2022 More gentle progress... I have covered the exposed foam edges on the fuselage and tail. That meant I could hinge the rear end. I use mylar strip for pretty much everything. I joined the elevators with a piece of 1/4" pine (from B&Q, and also used for the spars) with a couple of cocktail sticks fitted into it to stiffen the join to the foam. Not too much to do now; the ailerons need separating and then the exposed foam covering, and then a lick of paint. Graham 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martin collins 1 Posted October 21, 2022 Share Posted October 21, 2022 Keep pushing Graham, nearly there, looking good. I`m still at the cutting parts and head scratching stage on my project! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Robson Posted October 21, 2022 Share Posted October 21, 2022 Fast worker Graham, I have had 2 off days , full of cold. probably due to my marathon flight. My Acrowot is in need of a refurb I have been thinking of doing one in foam for a while but I am addicted to warbirds so it remains at the end of the list Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Miller Posted October 23, 2022 Share Posted October 23, 2022 Looking good Graham Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Davies 3 Posted October 23, 2022 Author Share Posted October 23, 2022 Thanks Peter. Slow progress this weekend due to a nasty stomach bug. Managed a few little jobs that don't look like much, but take time: Fitted and set up the ESC Fitted the cowel Closed the lower fuselage Bent up the undercarriage legs Separated and shaped the ailerons. I intended to cover the exposed foam edges of wing and ailerons, but ran out of steam... Graham Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Davies 3 Posted October 24, 2022 Author Share Posted October 24, 2022 More gentle progress... All exposed edges covered made the fibreglass aileron horns Hinged the ailerons Soldered wire stops onto the axles. This took a lot longer than usual. I suspect my trusty iron is losing a bit of grunt. A few feckles and fiddles.. Ready to paint now, then hook up the servos and point it into the wind! Some lessons though: I intended this as a quick-build sports scale to demonstrate to those that find warbirds intimidating to build, finish and fly. The idea was to replicate the 'quick and dirty' kits of back in the day such as any of Inwods models excellent models, or fayre such as Gangsters. to this end, I decided to leave the outerskin on, and not cover, but paint directly onto the skin. I'll not do this next time. The outerskin is OK, but too easy to split. I'm concerned that masking tape will lift the top surface unless I'm really careful. Also, foamboard ends up dinged to heck, and prown paper/ PVA restores the surface perfectly. I also didn't really save any time as finishing the edges takes almost as long as covering. I think therefore I prefer both skins removed (or use Flitetest foamboard) and cover in brown paper. The next bit of research is to find a decent varnish/ dope substitute that can be applied to the brown paper but won't melt the foam. Then, I'll be able to use gloss spray paint. All good fun though Graham 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Robson Posted October 24, 2022 Share Posted October 24, 2022 That looks the part Graham, Wilko water based varnish would probably do or De-lux Materials odourless dope but that is a lot more expensive than the varnish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martin collins 1 Posted October 24, 2022 Share Posted October 24, 2022 Looking good, how is the weight shaping up with the battery in it Graham? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Davies 3 Posted October 24, 2022 Author Share Posted October 24, 2022 Thanks Gents. Cheers for the suggestion Eric. I'll do some experiments before the next one. Not sure Martin, not weighed it yet. It's not super light, but that's fine as it will cope with a breeze. I suspect it will come out around 4lb. I'll weigh it tomorrow if I get a second. Graham Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martin collins 1 Posted October 24, 2022 Share Posted October 24, 2022 Had a quick scan through the build again, i don`t think you have said what span it is Graham? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Davies 3 Posted October 24, 2022 Author Share Posted October 24, 2022 Sorry Martin, 55". Power is a 4250 540kv on 4S 3700 packs. I'll probably use a 14x6 or 14x8, so it will have plenty... Graham 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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