Anyone with experience of the Acro Wot Foam E?

[paul devereux]

On 28/04/2023 at 07:55, David Davis 2 said:

 

I'm Old School Paul.

 

If I were going to spend £200 on a model I'd buy a kit or short-kit and build it but I appreciate that you may not have the time or inclination to build a model off the plan. You're quite right, when you say that prices have shot up. IIRC I paid less than £100 for my Acro WOT Foam-E. It did not last long in my clumsy hands!

 

Finally, I don't believe anyone who says that ARTFs are cheaper than building a model from a kit or plan. I built a DB Sport & Scale Skyrider for £160 in a carefully costed excercise last year. https://forums.modelflying.co.uk/index.php?/topic/50509-the-cost-of-building-recording-the-financial-cost-of-building-a-db-sport-scale-skyrider-a-surprise-for-miss-blue-eyes/page/4/&tab=comments#comment-938468 This was £30 cheaper than an ARTF WOT 4 and fully £100 cheaper than a Travel Air.

I'm coming round to your thinking now. Not just on grounds of cost, but longevity of the airframe. I think my next plane will be built up, probably from plans. I don't think foam is sturdy enough, plus they always start to look tatty after a few flights. But my main concern is the inevitable weak spots where the motor mount and u/c are attached to the airframe.

[David Davis 2]

3 hours ago, paul devereux said:

I'm coming round to your thinking now. Not just on grounds of cost, but longevity of the airframe. I think my next plane will be built up, probably from plans. I don't think foam is sturdy enough, plus they always start to look tatty after a few flights. But my main concern is the inevitable weak spots where the motor mount and u/c are attached to the airframe.

 

I'd recommend the DB Sport & Scale Sky Rider Plan Pack Paul. I made a mistake in building mine by not aligning the wings accurately but I'm going to add a trim tab to the port aileron which should make my model easier to fly. https://www.dbsportandscale.com/skyrider-7793-p.asp. A properly built model would not have that problem.

 

I'm tempted to build another wing but I have to much to do at the moment.

 

 

[Nigel Heather]

On 06/05/2023 at 09:05, paul devereux said:

I'm coming round to your thinking now. Not just on grounds of cost, but longevity of the airframe. I think my next plane will be built up, probably from plans. I don't think foam is sturdy enough, plus they always start to look tatty after a few flights. But my main concern is the inevitable weak spots where the motor mount and u/c are attached to the airframe.

 

I think built up planes look a lot nicer and are in some ways more robust.  But do remember that for the same size they are usually heavier.  The plus side is that this tends to make them more stable in light winds and gusts.  But to get the same performance you are usually talking more powerful motor, ESC and batteries which can double the price.  For example when I bought my Acrowot I also looked at the built up ARTF version - the airframe cost about the same as the complete foam-e (£150 at the time).  The recommended motor and ESC added another £80 and would need more expensive 4S batteries.

 

Foamies are a lot stronger than you would imagine - where they are weak is the motor and undercarriage mounts - built-up is superior here.  But when it comes to the wings, fuselage and tail-feathers, foaming do tend to bounce more than built up planes - the lighter weight helps here too, less weight, less kinetic energy.  And when something does snap you can often just glue the two parts together and be back flying quickly.

 

So although I do prefer the look and feel of built-up (just received a kit to build) I think that foaming are pretty marvellous overall.

[David Davis 2]

On 06/05/2023 at 10:05, paul devereux said:

I'm coming round to your thinking now. Not just on grounds of cost, but longevity of the airframe. I think my next plane will be built up, probably from plans. I don't think foam is sturdy enough, plus they always start to look tatty after a few flights. But my main concern is the inevitable weak spots where the motor mount and u/c are attached to the airframe.

 

I'm starting to look at an ARTF! Not a foamy, the Kyosho Calmato. There are three or four in my club and they fly very well. Of course you have to buy the servos, speed controller and motor on top but it is a very attractive model and I would probably put an i/c engine into mine were I to buy one. On the other hand I already have an ARTF Acrowot in flying condition and a DSM Aerostar in need of restoration so I'll probably save my money. 😉

😉

[Nigel Heather]

1 hour ago, David Davis 2 said:

 

I'm starting to look at an ARTF! Not a foamy, the Kyosho Calmato. There are three or four in my club and they fly very well. Of course you have to buy the servos, speed controller and motor on top but it is a very attractive model and I would probably put an i/c engine into mine were I to buy one. On the other hand I already have an ARTF Acrowot in flying condition and a DSM Aerostar in need of restoration so I'll probably save my money. 😉

😉

 

 

Things to look at.  There are a few at your club, that is good, are they electric, if so ask what motor, ESC, batteries they use and how well the battery compartment is accommodated.  Or that the instructions don't have much guidance on what components to use - but as you have access to club members that have them that shouldn't be such an issue.

 

One problem with older IC models is that they say they that you can use electric but as they really haven't been designed as such don't work that well.  For example I have seen at least one design where you are expected to remove the wing to change batteries.

 

Also note that this recommends 4S batteries as a minimum so you won't be able to use those cheap 3S 2200 that you have for your Acrowot.  So you may have to factor in £100 or so for new batteries.

Edited May 9, 2023 by Nigel Heather

[Nigel Heather]

I've decided to replace my acrowot with a Max Flight Ruckus. Still a foamy but appears to be more substantial and better built- but also heavier so I've decided to go with 4S to compensate.

 

My batteries arrive this week so I'll update here with my experiences.

[David Davis 2]

1 hour ago, Nigel Heather said:

 

 

Things to look at.  There are a few at your club, that is good, are they electric, if so ask what motor, ESC, batteries they use and how well the battery compartment is accommodated.  Or that the instructions don't have much guidance on what components to use - but as you have access to club members that have them that shouldn't be such an issue.

 

One problem with older IC models is that they say they that you can use electric but as they really haven't been designed as such don't work that well.  For example I have seen at least one design where you are expected to remove the wing to change batteries.

 

Also note that this recommends 4S batteries as a minimum so you won't be able to use those cheap 3S 2200 that you have for your Acrowot.  So you may have to factor in £100 or so for new batteries.

 

If I were to buy a Calmato I would probably fit an i/c engine to it as mentioned above because I have several of those sculling about. My ARTF Acrowot is the full size model powered by a Laser 70. I used to have a foamie Acrowot but damaged it beyond repair after several less than perfect landings. Sorry Nigel for not making things clear.

 

PS. Only one of the Calmatos in my club is electric powered and the owner keeps crashing it. That is not a reflection on the suitability of the model for electric power, more on the hamfistedness of the owner. The latest Calmato 40 comes ready made for either electric power or i/c. A 4S pack, 4000-5000mAh liPo is recommended. I'll admit these are expensive.

Edited May 9, 2023 by David Davis 2

[paul devereux]

@Nigel Heather I thought this is the best thread to reply to my question about the acrowot motor mount, rather than someone else's about something different. Thanks for your help. After much dithering, I bought the acrowot (the slightly smaller size means it can fit on the back seat of my car unrigged, and it is easier to rig).

I get your idea on adding glue to the motor mount, but can that not be added retrospectively if it becomes loose? As I said in the  earlier post, the airframe is sold as a spare, so it must be reasonably easy to get motor access. Also I'm not sure of your thinking re flexible glue- isn't the idea to fix it as permanently as possible? If I use epoxy or Gorilla glue (which expands slightly) that would do that. And the original ply plates are fixed firmly to the foam airframe, so presumably the manufacturers expect that to do the job? I slathered epoxy around the loose motor mount on my wot4 foamie, my theory is that if it comes loose again I'll slather some more on.

I'll be interested in your thoughts.

 

 

[Learner]

6 minutes ago, paul devereux said:

@Nigel Heather I thought this is the best thread to reply to my question about the acrowot motor mount, rather than someone else's about something different. Thanks for your help. After much dithering, I bought the acrowot (the slightly smaller size means it can fit on the back seat of my car unrigged, and it is easier to rig).

I get your idea on adding glue to the motor mount, but can that not be added retrospectively if it becomes loose? As I said in the  earlier post, the airframe is sold as a spare, so it must be reasonably easy to get motor access. Also I'm not sure of your thinking re flexible glue- isn't the idea to fix it as permanently as possible? If I use epoxy or Gorilla glue (which expands slightly) that would do that. And the original ply plates are fixed firmly to the foam airframe, so presumably the manufacturers expect that to do the job? I slathered epoxy around the loose motor mount on my wot4 foamie, my theory is that if it comes loose again I'll slather some more on.

I'll be interested in your thoughts.

 

 

Does the replacement fuselage come in 2 halves and glued together after motor etc installed?

[paul devereux]

50 minutes ago, Learner said:

Does the replacement fuselage come in 2 halves and glued together after motor etc installed?

It does! I never noticed that before! Other adverts don't say that.

Ripmax AcroWot Foam-E - Fuselage Assembly with out Servos (Z-CF030/01) - Ripmax Ltd

Edited May 17, 2023 by paul devereux

[Colin Carpenter]

When I replaced the fus on mine , it went together easy enough. Throwing out the box and noticed a rattling. There were some square weights which should have gone in the rear fus. No paperwork if I remember correctly.  When testing had to add lead at rear. Nothing in the original when I dismembered it for the parts ! 😳😳😳Colin 

[paul devereux]

1 hour ago, Colin Carpenter said:

When I replaced the fus on mine , it went together easy enough. Throwing out the box and noticed a rattling. There were some square weights which should have gone in the rear fus. No paperwork if I remember correctly.  When testing had to add lead at rear. Nothing in the original when I dismembered it for the parts ! 😳😳😳Colin 

Did you experience the motor getting loose, either in the original airframe or the replacement? That's the big question.

[Colin Carpenter]

Yes , that’s why fus changed. Couldn’t repair it any longer. The replacement also loosened up despite a bit of reinforcement in the half shells. It’s a wonderful flyer. Mount is its Achilles !😭😭Colin

[paul devereux]

24 minutes ago, Colin Carpenter said:

Yes , that’s why fus changed. Couldn’t repair it any longer. The replacement also loosened up despite a bit of reinforcement in the half shells. It’s a wonderful flyer. Mount is its Achilles !😭😭Colin

Did you ever find a solution? Are you still flying it?

Edit: I'm thinking it can't be a common problem or the design would be modified.

Edited May 17, 2023 by paul devereux

[Colin Carpenter]

Afraid not ! It loosened up so much it became uncontrollable and boom !🔥💥Seems to be normal on this thread ! Colin

[paul devereux]

34 minutes ago, Colin Carpenter said:

Afraid not ! It loosened up so much it became uncontrollable and boom !🔥💥Seems to be normal on this thread ! Colin

If it flies well, would it be possible to rebuild a reinforced nose? Not in your case, of course, if you wrote it off. I'm thinking it might be possible to fly it, if the motor becomes loose, then reinforce the nose area.

[Colin Carpenter]

The foam Wots all seem to have their weaknesses. I’ve seen the Wots Wot land and the front fall off !! Twice !! U pays ur money etc !! I’ve moved on to Sebarts and they don’t survive a wallop , generally!  Colin

[Nigel Heather]

Apologies, I'm a bit behind with this thread so have missed a few questions

 

1. I don't know whether adding a flexible glue to the motor mount where it slots into the foam will help or not, I have read that it does but I have never tried it myself.  The reason I think it would be best added when new rather than when it gets loose is that you are fixing it at the correct thrust angle.  Once it becomes loose you can move the motor around a little so how do you know what angle to fix it at.
2. The model comes with the motor preinstalled but it can be removed and replaced afterwards - it's a little fiddly, but undo the four screws on the front attaching the motor to the mount and then ease the motor through the battery hatch.  You may have the cut the zip-tie fixing the leads to the mount.
3. The engine mount is a different matter, this is installed at the factory when the fuselage is in two halves.  Once you receive it there is no way of replacing it.  This is different to the Wot4 which can be replaced.  If you look at the list of Wot spares there is a Wot4 mount but no Acrowot mount - this is because it is impossible to remove or replace.
4. The undercarriage mount is a similar story to motor mount.  It is installed during factory assembly and there is no way to replace it when it (inevitably) snaps off - once that happens you need to come up with a home-made DIY fix - or, as Ripmax would prefer, buy a replacement fuselage (if they ever have them in stock).

Edited May 17, 2023 by Nigel Heather

[Nigel Heather]

9 hours ago, Colin Carpenter said:

Mount is its Achilles !😭😭Colin

 

And the undercarriage mount.

[Nigel Heather]

Question about the ESC - do you have to have to set the max and min on it - you usually have to tell an ESC what is full throttle but can't see anything in the Acrowot instructions.

 

I ask because I'm not convinced my motor is running at full speed.

Edited May 17, 2023 by Nigel Heather

[Nigel Heather]

13 hours ago, paul devereux said:

@Nigel Heather Also I'm not sure of your thinking re flexible glue- isn't the idea to fix it as permanently as possible? If I use epoxy or Gorilla glue (which expands slightly) that would do that.

 

 

 

 

I've never tried the 'glue-fix' myself just read that others had done it.  So I'm speculating to a degree - the reason I'm not so sure about epoxy is that it is quite brittle.  The nature of the foam is that it will flex and I'm thinking that when it does the epoxy will crack or detach.

 

So if I were doing it I'd use UHU POR which it quite tough, grips foam very well, but is also slightly flexible too.  It is the best glue I have found for foam repairs so at some point you are probably want to get a tube.

[paul devereux]

10 hours ago, Nigel Heather said:

Question about the ESC - do you have to have to set the max and min on it - you usually have to tell an ESC what is full throttle but can't see anything in the Acrowot instructions.

 

I ask because I'm not convinced my motor is running at full speed.

I'll be interested to see the responses to this. Personally, I have no knowledge of ESCs. I just add receiver and battery and fly (after range check, and checking the failsafe/throttle stop- all done via the Tx). One of the reasons I would never take the Part A.

[Nigel Heather]

33 minutes ago, paul devereux said:

I'll be interested to see the responses to this. Personally, I have no knowledge of ESCs. I just add receiver and battery and fly (after range check, and checking the failsafe/throttle stop- all done via the Tx). One of the reasons I would never take the Part A.

 

 

Usually with ESCs, you have to, as a minimum, tell it the full and zero throttle stick positions.

 

Additionally, most ESCs are programmable, either by using a programming card or through a series of beeps and throttle stick positions - this can be used to set things like brake, timing, BEC voltage, LiPo voltage protection.

 

As far as I can see, you can't do any of this with the Wot ESCs.  To be honest I get that for the configuration, as they know the model they can hard-set the configuration but I would have thought you would still need to tell it the full and zero throttle.

 

 

[paul devereux]

13 hours ago, Nigel Heather said:

 

 

I've never tried the 'glue-fix' myself just read that others had done it.  So I'm speculating to a degree - the reason I'm not so sure about epoxy is that it is quite brittle.  The nature of the foam is that it will flex and I'm thinking that when it does the epoxy will crack or detach.

 

So if I were doing it I'd use UHU POR which it quite tough, grips foam very well, but is also slightly flexible too.  It is the best glue I have found for foam repairs so at some point you are probably want to get a tube.

You've convinced me. I have a full tube of Foam-Tac, which also stays flexible. I shall use that prophylactically.

[Sparks]

My solution to the 'undercarriage' problem with Wot4s and Acrowots was to tap out the screw holes (think it was M4) and fit cheese head nylon bolts instead of the steel screws.

 

I occasionaly sheared the bolts on heavy landings, but never ripped ot the plastic fixing plate.

 

My last Wot4 survived over 200 flights before I passed it on to another club member.