First time painting a balsa electric warbird !

[KenC]

I have seen the thread on Warbird paint , and sadly do not possess a spray gun or compressor.  Starting from the bare sanded wood , what is the MOST cost effective process for painting that will not ruin the look ?   I had thought of doing some of the "camo" bits on FW 190 with a sponge and daubing , but there is the base coat and upper body and wings, not to mention the soft green blue that covers the underbelly. It is a 60" wing and if I made it look like the version that I am following ( loosely)  there could be 7 or so separate colours !

[Alan Gorham_]

Before worrying about paint, if you are starting from bare sanded wood, I'd think hard about how you will seal and consolidate the surface. Methods could include: tissue and dope, tissue and WBPU, glass cloth and epoxy resin, glass cloth and WBPU, brown paper and PVA, silver coloured iron-on film that is then keyed ready for paint, or iron-on fabric eg Oratex. If you don't use anything at all, then prepare to be disappointed in any paint finish you put on.. 

[KenC]

Thanks Alan for the reply , I was aware of sealing and a few of the other options , like tissue and dope ..etc However  I left the post open in direction as to avoid pre determined focus on my part. Rather wait and see if certain precursors mean following a given path.

 

I had thought of fiberglass, especially the wing to try and strengthen and avert hanger rash in transporting a long  wing.... my concern with this is adding too much more weight to the build, and creating , as Jon from Laser Engines put it , a lead sled. 

[Alan Gorham_]

But reading your original post it makes no mention of sealing the bare wood. If you painted over that then you would end up with a lead sled as the wood soaks up repeated coats of paint. 

 

It is perfectly possible to glass a small model and not add excessive weight, but it does require care and technique. Again, before you consider the paint system you wish to use, you should think about your prior experience with finishing off a wood model. Rather than leaving it open to other people to guess, why don't you tell us what experience and preferences you have in finishing models and then maybe you will then get better suggestions relating to actually painting the model... 

 

PS... Sealing the wood isn't optional! 

Edited July 24, 2023 by Alan Gorham_

[KenC]

So reading back on your options , do you seal with sanding sealer prior to applying iron on covering  or similar ?

 

[GrumpyGnome]

I've never used sanding sealer if I'm going to cover it with something else - tissue, film, nylon, glass, laminating film. Dunnk about brown paper and pva.....

[KenC]

Grumpy do you ever have issues with painting over iron on covering, where the covering does its usual and wrinkles later in time. ?

 

[GrumpyGnome]

Painted over film - wrinkled and flaked

Painted over lam film - wrinkled and flaked

Painted over tissue and lam film - seems ok.

 

I need more practice of paint over lam film - that's coming soon.

 

Hopefully others who have had success will chip in.

[KenC]

Because I have not covered a model since the 1990s , and only used Solafilm  or Solatex  ( besides painting  on its own )  , what is lam film ?

 

Tissue and dope over sheeted areas loos lovely , I have one plane like that , however over open structure I would think might be open to pressure or puncture damage far more than the old Solatex. 

[GrumpyGnome]

Lam film is Laminating film. Heat shrink film on a roll, available cheap as chips - I think I paid around £15 for a roll of 100m x about 0.6m.  Treat it exactly the same as other films. It dries completely transparent. Available in gloss or matt, and various thicknesses.

 

I covered an SE5 in heavyweight, doped, painted tissue. Looked great but pretty minimal puncture resistance. Being re-covered.

 

I've covered the open areas of a Seagull P47 in lam film, primed it, painted it. Looked good but not durable. User error! Going to re-cover these areas soon.

 

Both will be covered in lam film, then tissue, then paint.

 

Edited July 25, 2023 by GrumpyGnome

[KenC]

47 minutes ago, GrumpyGnome said:

I've covered the open areas of a Seagull P47 in lam film, primed it, painted it. Looked good but not durable. User error! Going to re-cover these areas soon.

 

Was the error the way you applied the Lam film or a later handling error.  Is lam film as durable as the old Solartex ? 

Is it necessary to apply and undercoat to wire wooled Oracover  covering 

Edited July 25, 2023 by KenC

[Nigel Heather]

1 hour ago, GrumpyGnome said:

Painted over film - wrinkled and flaked

Painted over lam film - wrinkled and flaked

Painted over tissue and lam film - seems ok.

 

I need more practice of paint over lam film - that's coming soon.

 

Hopefully others who have had success will chip in.

What about this lightweight glass cloth and acrylic varnish method that I have been reading about since I’ve been researching funfighters?

 

So glassing but not using two part resin.

 

Cheers,

 

Nigel

 

 

Edited July 25, 2023 by Nigel Heather

[Nigel Heather]

@KenC where do you live.  If nearby you are welcome to use my compressor.

 

Cheers,

 

Nigel

[KenC]

Nigel that is an amazing offer , regardless of where you are I am very grateful for it.   That said I am about 10 miles south of Maidstone in Kent.

 

What advantage does the glass cloth and varnish have over the 2 pack fibreglass ?

 

Edited July 25, 2023 by KenC

[Nigel Heather]

32 minutes ago, KenC said:

Nigel that is an amazing offer , regardless of where you are I am very grateful for it.   That said I am about 10 miles south of Maidstone in Kent.

 

What advantage does the glass cloth and varnish have over the 2 pack fibreglass ?

 

 

I’m in Horsham, West Sussex, so not a million miles away.

 

Glass cloth and varnish - I don’t know for sure because I have only recently heard of it myself but I imagine

 

Cheaper

Easier to use

No noxious fumes

Quicker working time

Easier finishing - no rocks hard drips to sand down

Maybe lighter

 

But I also imagine it is not as strong, but reckon it would still be stronger than tissue and dope or film.

Edited July 25, 2023 by Nigel Heather

[Nigel Heather]

It’s not traditional varnish, it is stuff called Poly C

 

https://www.rcworld.co.uk/acatalog/Poly-C-500ml-PolyC500.html#SID=263

 

But read that some floor polishes are the same stuff - someone mentioned Wilko Diamond Floor Polish.

 

Water based, takes about 8 coats, but it is said that the water evaporates off so the results is very light and tough.

 

This thread talks about Poly C and cheaper alternatives

 

 

Edited July 25, 2023 by Nigel Heather

[KenC]

Nigel nearer the time I would very much like to talk to you about the use of the compressor, my questions at the moment are looking forward and giving me ideas on direction for starting the finishing process.  Tomorrow  I plan to bolt the thing together and weigh the plane, less battery which is weight specified ,  and work out how close to the danger line I am.   For the moment I am fighting with litho plate, and working out how to make a Nijhuis ( popular warbird)  look semi scale !  

 

There are parts of the airframe that seem vulnerable , like the flared wing seats , and knowing my ham handed loading and unloading  of the transport , the wing might be an idea. 

[KenC]

Sorry meant to say thanks for the info on the Poly-C ... need to read and find out more, as if the glider crowd are into it , it must have weight advantages.

[GrumpyGnome]

Glass cloth and Poly-C have been used on sheeted areas of my P47 - nice and easy

[Frank Skilbeck]

I've used Poly C and nylon, which also worked well.

[Tom Gaskin 1]

Bucks Composites of Lancing also sell lightweight glass fibre and Water Based Polyurethane varnish (basically floor varnish). I have used their products on balsa and foam models for years.

 

As they are located just down the road from me it is easy for me to get supplies too 😀

 

Tom

[KenC]

I read of the .6 oz glass cloth, it is expensive at £17  but wow .6 oz against 6 !

[Engine Doctor]

Speak to Bucks composites as the slightly heavier gauge glass is much stronger ,has a closer weave so doesn't use as much resin and its the resin that adds the weight.

I believe there is a glass tissue available that ad lityle or  no strength but give a surface for finishing.

I tried poly c when it came out some years ago thinking it was going to be the way forward. Very dissapointed ! The covering could be pulled off the balsa with no effort so went back to epoxy resin. I found the Zap finishing resin very good and sets quicker than Bucks resin and also sands easier but is more expensive.

Edited July 26, 2023 by Engine Doctor

[KenC]

Thanks Phil, I shall have a peek at Bucks .... I do want the added strength especially to those flared wing seats , and to the wing for transport.  If you had to offer a guess from your experience .... what sort of weight gain would you expect on a 60" warbird from glassing carefully and spraying .   I am trying to gauge the potential all up weight .

[jrman]

I glassed with 0.6oz/sqyd cloth and finish painted a BT P40 of approx 64" span achieving a weight gain of 4.5 oz. It was the only a/c I weighed both before and after but others were covered using the same technique so I would have expected a similar outcome.