Lindsay Todd Posted December 22, 2013 Share Posted December 22, 2013 Hi Beb, as you may know my wife is seriously into baking and has baking beans to weigh down pastry in tins ( I kid you not) however put these 'magic' beans (well it is pantomime season) in a bag and they are great for weighing down sheeting and all sorts of compound / concave or combination geometry as they obviously just spread out to the contour. I guess they are dense alumina so pretty heavy. Linds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vecchio Austriaco Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 A nice way to reduce the cabling mess. Will pay off when you have to close just one connector (hopefully with security screws still don't see them) VA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted December 23, 2013 Author Share Posted December 23, 2013 Baking beans eh? Must look into that. For a while a had 4 small sand bags around the workshop - but one day I decided they were "in the way" Hi VA - fret not the connector will be fitted with locking so it can't separate! So, on excavating the wing from the heap of RCM&E's I found all well with the skin - nicely stuck down,.... We have to liberate the connector from inside there and fix it back in place,... The last wing skin is now in place and drying under the infamous heap of magazines. BEB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buster prop Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 This is a fascinating thread, not because I'm about to build a scale model of a Typhoon, but because of the subject aircraft - and I always find build blogs interesting. The 'history' episodes are great and mention of Holmsley airfield in the New Forest just off the A35 reminded me that I went there a while ago. The old airfield, actually Holmsley South, closed in 1946 and is now a caravan club site but bits of runway/ taxiway still exist and there's a memorial. When I stayed at the site I bought a book by a local historian called 'The Holmsley Story' and a great read it is, for only £4.95. As BEB says it hosted Typhoons, as well as many other British and American aircraft in the run-up to D Day. Lots of stories in the book, including the fact that the pilot's view from a Typhoon cockpit was so bad that a mechanic used to sit on the leading edge of the wing astride one of the cannon barrels and guide the pilot to the runway by hand signals! I hope they always jumped off in time. With the enormous torque swing and minimal prop. clearance getting a Typhoon into the air tidily must have been a real challenge. There used to be a sectioned Sabre engine at IWM Duxford in the British aircraft hangar, upstairs in the gallery. I last went in 2006 so it may have been moved since. The Sabre was an H24, with the H on its side so it was really two flat 12's one above the other with both crankshafts driving the prop through a gearbox. An incredibly complex engine with all those sleeve valves and their gear drives. No wonder it vibrated a lot! The Typhoons and its pilots did a fantastic job though, and its a plane well worth modelling. ways jumped off Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexJ Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 Hi Buster, I was at Duxford a month or so ago and the cutaway Sabre is still there (probably too heavy to move). Having recently read one of the books that BEB recommended earlier in the thread, I can now understand the complexity of the design and some of the problems they would have had servicing in the field. It is a monster!! Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Leighfield Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 There's a complete Sabre in very good nick in the very interesting aircraft museum at Dumfries. (Very well worth a visit). It's condition is remarkable because it was recovered from a Typhoon crash site after decades in the ground. It really is astonishing complex, but amazingly Rolls Royce chose exactly the same H24 lay-out for it's last piston aero engine, the Eagle of 3,500 hp. It looks like a bigger Sabre, quite a surprise. As far as I remember, the only plane to use it was the Westland Wyvern in the original prototypes and test models, before they decided to go down the gas turbine route. Surprisingly, the only Wyvern which has been preserved is an original TF1 with the Eagle engine and it is on display at Yeovilton. On the Typhoon route, the final proposed version of the Tempest was to be fitted with the Eagle. The drawings show a very long nose and a ventral supercharger intake/radiator, P51/MB5 style. It presumably didn't go ahead because of jets coming along, but I bet that it would have really shifted with 3,500 hp up front! Great subject for a model, no cg problems with that one. O Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted December 23, 2013 Author Share Posted December 23, 2013 I've seen that Sabre in Dumfries - you're right considering its a crash recovery it in remarkably good condition. But then again its a very solid "lump"! Buster Prop - which Tiffie are you planning to build - the TN one or another? I can recommend this TN design - a good build. OK, mags lifted off the wing and the last panel examined - all well! Here's a view,... And from the otherside,... From the front,... And a reminder of the underneath,... Now the sheeting is complete the wing is very stiff indeed - so living up to the reputation of its full-size brother! So, I just have to add the outer leading edges and the tips and shape them, then the fibreglass bandage on the upper centre and all is built on this wing - which has taken me 3 months to build! I've built entire models, installed the radio, covered and flown them in less time than that! OK I have lost some time due to work committments - but even so this wing is a long build; good though! BEB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Bennett Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 looking good oh bearded wonder. it is progressing well now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Stratton Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 That wing is looking very nice indeed B.E.B., but it will look even better when it's mated with the fuselage! Not sure that the teddy bear pilot is the right scale though!! Edited By Glenn Stratton on 23/12/2013 22:28:36 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Leighfield Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 I'm looking forward to seing that at Greenacres BEB. I can set my Fw190D on it, we could re-create the Battle of the Bulge and I'll take you out on the ground at dawn. Hope I don't run out of fuel in the process though, that would be too much like the real thing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Simmons Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 Yep. teddy's the correct scale, Bears are HUGE.. Have him holding on "Hunk" style on the fuselage, behind the cockpit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy watson Posted December 23, 2013 Share Posted December 23, 2013 Sorry for being tardy on this, but there is a solution to the wiring that no one has mentioned- Ashlock connectors. Available from Fighter aces: **LINK** I have used these where the amount of toys in the wings has led to a mass of cables needing to be connected into the fuselage (or vice versa). These are fantastic little devices- no soldering- which in my book is a very good thing, but also total security of the connection with a mechanical lock of the 2 halves- so no danger of vibrations coming loose. I know that doesn't help you BEB, but as we know- these blogs are really for the people following! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted December 24, 2013 Author Share Posted December 24, 2013 The teddy is my "flying mascot" given to me by Mrs BEB many many moons ago. He used to go to the field in my flightbox for years, but he's a bit old and fragile to go now so he lives in the workshop and keeps a careful eye on things! Well, how about a Christmas eve edition of "The Potted History of the Typhoon"? Tonight's story, while being a powerful example of the devasting fire power of the Typhoon, is not the happiest page in its history. On the 27th August 1944 a section of Typhoons led by W/C J.R. (Johnny) Baldwin was scrambled to attack a small flotilla minesweeping off Le Havre. Baldwin immediately thought the mission "strange" - why would the German Navy be minesweeping one of their own mined areas? He questioned base - but was assured that no allied ships were in that area - therefore they must be German. Allied ship movements were passed on to all other units operating on the front for obvious reasons. Although the Royal Navy had been minesweeping this channel since the 18th August, they had been ordered to stand down for the day on the 27th. So, the official position was that there were no allied ships in the area. But the order to stand down was questioned by the commanding officer of the minesweeping operation and was revealed as an error. So the order was recinded and 4 minesweepers, along with two trawlers as auxiliaries, were sent afterall. Tragically, while the stand-down order was circulated to all units, the re-instatement of the order to carry on sweeping never was. On spotting the flotilla Baldwin again questioned the order to attack - again he was told no allied ships were in the area and he was to attack the flotilla. Baldwin questioned the order twice more, and twice more he was instructed to attack. Forming the section into line-astern Baldwin called his aircraft in to attack. As the attack started the ships in the flotilla fired flares in the colours of the day - Baldwin reported this to base - the order was to continue with the attack. The attack lasted just eleven minutes. On its completion, three of the minsweepers were on fire, one of the trawlers was stopped. Two ships were sinking, a third was listing badly. Seventy eight ratings and officers were dead, 149 were wounded. No Typhoons were lost or damaged in the attack. The suvivors were forbidden to speak of the event, there is no official record, only witness accounts. The "powers that be" were terrified of the damage to morale that would be caused should the story get out. "Friendly fire" is sadly nothing new. BEB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted December 27, 2013 Author Share Posted December 27, 2013 Well I haven't just been eating over Christmas - I have managed to sneak an hour in the shed now and then. Principally I've managed to get the leading edges glued on and sanded down to width - although they still have to be finally profiled,... The next job was to attach the blocks (which are massive!) to form the wing tips. First I made a balsa template of the wing-tip plan-form via tracing from the drawing onto the, now well established, greaseproof paper and then doing the pin-prick trick,... Note the arrow identifying which is the "facing forward" direction as the plan-form of the tip is not the same each half. This template can then be used to draw the profile onto the blocks previously glued to the wing ends,... This picture, together with the one below, give some idea of how bulky these blocks are - probably 80% of them will be sculpted away!... So, we now have to start shaping this, but how? I could saw them - but that will require some force. I decided to use a Dremel with a sanding drum fitted on the extension drive cable. I can then use this like a chisel to carve away the wood with very little stress on the block itself. This was pursued as far as to be "close" to the plan-form line,... This was then brought to the line using the rough side of my Permagrit tool,... It now time to start imparting the aerofoil profile, again this was done roughly using the sanding drum in the Dremel,... Once this is done I will take up the rough Permagrit again. Once the tip is close in both plan-form and profile I can finish off the shaping with the finer Permgrit. But that's for tomorrow - I've had just about as much balsa dust as one man can stand today! BEB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Hargreaves - Moderator Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 Blimey BEB thats some serious sanding/carving/whittling there.....I can't imagine how much dust that produced!!! Are the blocks permenatly affixed now or do you intend to hollow them out at all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 BEB, try putting a layer of masking tape over the wing sheeting adjacent to the tip block, when you start cutting into the tape it's time to swap to a fine abrasive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Fenton Posted December 28, 2013 Share Posted December 28, 2013 BEB that's a very slow and messy method my friend. A razor saw would have gently removed the excess balsa, and a Davids plane imparted the profile, both would have resulted in very little dust. But each to his own, the end result is the same, looks great Cheers Danny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted December 28, 2013 Author Share Posted December 28, 2013 Yes I agree - it is slow and messy. But I did try with the razor plane - the balsa is very hard and wide I ended up feeling I was just "hacking" at it and putting a lot of stress on the joint between the block and the wing. As you say end result is the same and with the extractor fan on, wearing a mask and frequent use of the mini-vacuum cleaner - its not too bad. Honest,.... I sometimes think it might have been easier if TN had just specified a huge balsa log and I could have carved the whole plane out! BEB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted December 29, 2013 Author Share Posted December 29, 2013 OK - mammoth sanding session over, we have wing tips. First from one side,.... And then from the other,... They are not quite how I want them yet - but they're pretty damn close! So I'll revisit then for final fettle just before covering. Next up is fitting a 3" wide fibreglass wing bandage to the upper surface only. This was duly done and is currently setting. All that remains now is to drill through the wing fixing bolt holes on the upper surface and the wing is basically built! BEB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted December 30, 2013 Author Share Posted December 30, 2013 I've trimmed the fibre-glass back and drilled through the wing mounting bolt holes into the upper wing skin. Next up was bringing the fuselage down from the rack and fitting the mounting plate for the wing bolt captive nuts. This proved easier said than done - as how you're supposed to get it into the wing saddles at this stage of the game is anyone's guess! I managed it eventually by rounding the back corners of and then "gently persuading" it! The wing must sit on the inner ply wing seats visible in the photo above. To ensure this we have to trim the fuselage sheeting back so that it is just below the level of the wing seat all along the saddle. It doesn't matter if this leaves a small gap as it will be covered by the wing fillet eventually. Here is the trimming of the sheeting in progress - a touchy job,... Now, the BIG moment - we get to offer up the wing to the saddle!!!! And,.... It doesn't fit,.... To be honest, it would be a bit of a fluke if it did fit first time! So, into fettling mode. The wing doesn't fit for three main reasons: first, there is insufficient clearance under the radiator outlet - so that needs sanding back a bit - second, the lower set of bolts holding the cowling on are too long and are stopping the wing from butting up against the back of the firewall, as shown here,... So, they need about 3mm cut off them. Finally the flat at the centre leading edge needs to be cut back a little and the centre trailing edge needs a trim too. All this was duly done - and the result was......Da-dah! The wings seats perfectly. So I just have to drill the plate for the captive nuts that the wing bolts will go into and fit the wing locating dowel at the front. That's for next time! BEB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Bennett Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 well done sir, that bit of any build is the heart in mouth stage. will it fit or not. glad yours went in ok after a little bit of fettling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Leighfield Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 Even in this un-finished state it looks aggressive. I hope you lock the door on it when you go to bed at night! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted December 31, 2013 Author Share Posted December 31, 2013 Thanks for the comments chaps! Yes, I was relieved when I realised that all that stopping it going together was a few simple things that easy adjustment could fix! You right Colin - she is starting to get that pugnacious Tiffie look! I've sorted the dowel and the wing bolt captive nuts. The wing was put into position and after many measurements with string to various points on the airframe, and long squints from front and back, I satisfied myself that it was square and level. So, taped into this position, I drilled the wing mounting plate using the existing wing holes as a guide and drilled through from the fire-wall into the wing leading edge for the locating dowel. Captive nuts were pressed home into the mounting plate using a G-clamp and the dowel was epoxied into the wing. Wait impatiently for epoxy to set,..... You see today is something of a watershed in the build, on this day, the very last day in 2013, she stands, fuselage and wing assembled and on her own feet for the first time! That's a "sit on the garden bench and look at it for 10 minutes" moment! So, having started on 7th August 2013, on the 31st December we have a basically complete airframe. I need to add the wing fairings, underbelly fairing and control surfaces (which are made but not sanded up) - but that's basically it. Then its on to covering, installation and finishing! But,...at this point I fear I must announce a short intermission. I have a Dawn Flyer to do for the 2014 Mass Build - and so I shall break off for short period to do that. I'm hoping to make it a really quick build so I can get back to this. Hang on in there - we'll be back! BEB Edited By Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator on 31/12/2013 16:12:55 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Bennett Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 looking like an hairyplane sir. how come your garden is dry, mine looks like the battle of the somme has taken place. so you are half way now then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Hargreaves - Moderator Posted December 31, 2013 Share Posted December 31, 2013 Looks most excellent BEB.....I do have an important question though.....where did you get that little yellow & blue stand from? Great for use in the workshop....I want one!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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