zz Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Hello Karl, Thank you for the clarification on that point. It is good to known the exact situation. And, on reflection, I think it was Latvia that had that symbol prior to WW2. I confuse those two countries. But, I do know there are no kangaroos in Austria. Have a sign to prove it. Kooka Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kc Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 If it's a scale model it should have correct markings. If the end result of WW2 had been the other way round ( i.e. if USA and Russia hadn't been against Germany ) then what would we be saying if the RAF roundels and invasion stripes were now banned......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Leighfield Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Not generally well known is that pre-war one of the Boy Scout achievement badges, actually a brass pendant on a ribbon, was a swastika. It was however the original way around, not in the deliberately perverse, reversed direction adopted by the Nazis. Before that the swastika had no offensive connotations and it certainly didn’t when the Scout Movement used it. A late uncle of mine had one but I can’t remember what it was awarded for, it could still be lying around the house somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stearman65 Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 I think this thread has gone way off subject. It was a simple question now it's turned to a political debate. As for my Storch, the favoured colour at present is the all white, red cross version, unfortunately with a swastika. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stearman65 Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Posted by David Mellor on 25/01/2019 15:01:57: It isn't off topic. To that extent I think I probably disagree slightly when the OP says "applying a swastika is no different to ensuring that other details are represented as accurately as possible". I think it is the one scale detail that is perhaps a little different to all the others. I didn't say that! That's why I think the thread is way off topic, people are getting confused. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wright Stuff Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Posted by Stearman65 on 25/01/2019 15:22:11: Posted by David Mellor on 25/01/2019 15:01:57: It isn't off topic. To that extent I think I probably disagree slightly when the OP says "applying a swastika is no different to ensuring that other details are represented as accurately as possible". I think it is the one scale detail that is perhaps a little different to all the others. I didn't say that! That's why I think the thread is way off topic, people are getting confused. But you're not the O.P. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Fry Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Posted by Stearman65 on 25/01/2019 14:34:41: I think this thread has gone way off subject. It was a simple question now it's turned to a political debate. As for my Storch, the favoured colour at present is the all white, red cross version, unfortunately with a swastika. Read the original posting. It was not a question, it was a statement. David has put forward some reasoned arguments, taking a slightly tangential view of the statement. I also like your proposed colour scheme, good contrast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stearman65 Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 I didn't say that! That's why I think the thread is way off topic, people are getting confused. But you're not the O.P. What does OP stand for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kc Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 David said " Roundels or invasion stripes were never used as political ideological symbols " well of course that's completely wrong! Of course they were and are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 How odd, I can no longer see the original post from Stearman65, the thread starts with Martin's response. This web site does seem to have a habit of losing a few posts here and there which can lead to a lot of confusion. I think the database needs reorganising! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wright Stuff Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Just to get back on topic, I agree wholeheartedly with David: acceptable, yes, but distinct from other markings. If I may broaden the topic slightly? Lots of other examples of historical accuracy versus sensitive subjects. Is it degrading to paint naked women on the noses of model B-17s? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stearman65 Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Posted by David Mellor on 25/01/2019 15:53:15: Posted by Stearman65 on 25/01/2019 15:49:01: I didn't say that! That's why I think the thread is way off topic, people are getting confused. But you're not the O.P. What does OP stand for? Original Poster. Or sometimes just Original Post. Meaning the person (Martin Harris in this case) and what he said in the first post of this thread. I started the thread & made the original post, somehow it's disappeared, now I am confused. Edited By David Mellor on 25/01/2019 16:00:46 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Posted by The Wright Stuff on 25/01/2019 16:09:19: Just to get back on topic, I agree wholeheartedly with David: acceptable, yes, but distinct from other markings. If I may broaden the topic slightly? Lots of other examples of historical accuracy versus sensitive subjects. Is it degrading to paint naked women on the noses of model B-17s? Look upon it as a reminder of a time when insensitivity didn't exist, a lesson to be learned if you wish. Me, I'll just admire the artistry thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stearman65 Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Posted by Stearman65 on 25/01/2019 16:13:22: Posted by David Mellor on 25/01/2019 15:53:15: Posted by Stearman65 on 25/01/2019 15:49:01: I didn't say that! That's why I think the thread is way off topic, people are getting confused. But you're not the O.P. What does OP stand for? Original Poster. Or sometimes just Original Post. Meaning the person (Martin Harris in this case) and what he said in the first post of this thread. I started the thread & made the original post, somehow it's disappeared, now I am confused. Edited By David Mellor on 25/01/2019 16:00:46 Screen shot of my posts, can one of the moderators explain how my thread starting post has been removed? Edited By Stearman65 on 25/01/2019 16:21:52 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Leighfield Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 We don’t seem to have any problems in building a Zero with the red disc insignia despite the unbelievable atrocities committed by the Japanese in Manchuria even before they began their brutal misadventures in 1941, so what is the problem here? Red stars on a model of a Russian plane fighting for a leadership that murdered millions of its own citizens and sent other millions to the Gulag don’t seem to bother us either. I wouldn’t dream of building a scale WW2 German warplane without the swastika, it is simply scale accuracy and reflects the badge of an ideology that comprehensively failed, it lost. The worst thing we can do is push it to the back of our minds and forget about it. It is definitely staying on my Fw190D, it wouldn’t look right without it and it doesn’t do anything to influence my contempt for National Socialism. If anyone wants to leave it off that is their privilege, I wouldn’t criticise them. I don’t feel any need to do that though, politics completely turn me off these days anyway and they won’t influence my approach to model planes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Member Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 [This posting has been removed] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john stones 1 - Moderator Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 Bomber aircraft, killed many civilians the world over, what's your thoughts on replicating those ? Opens up lots of avenues discussions like these, not complaining, just asking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erfolg Posted January 25, 2019 Share Posted January 25, 2019 The question posed is one that is politically charged. The reactions to this topic and many others does and will change with time. I tend to think there is no right and wrong with respect to many aspects, in an absolute sense, although for some emotionally there is. A lot depends on your particular perspective and often experiences. History is normally presented in terms of Black and White, where in reality it is shades of grey, with respect to all events. Be it Richard III or ethics of area bombing or what ever you choose. Reading Michael Portillos American Railroads, you soon realise that the USA civil war as portrayed today, is just another politically correct portrayal by the winners. With respect to Swastikas, IMO it is better to have them displayed and discussed in all the contexts than pretend that the symbol is the issue, avoiding the emblem does not eradicate a reoccurring set of issues that have reoccurred since, as a set of issues. Most people do not actually know what the Fascist ideology really is, yet feel they do. For me one death is to many, easy to say, harder to live up to. Edited By Erfolg on 25/01/2019 17:16:44 Edited By Erfolg on 25/01/2019 17:18:09 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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