Peter 'Ivanna Crashalot' Savage Posted October 28, 2009 Author Share Posted October 28, 2009 I'll make a list of all the tools i have used so far: Stanley KnifeRazor SawWickes wood glueRazor planeGood solid chopping blockBuilding board able to take pins or small nails for the tail planeGood straight 1ft and 2ft rulesSanding block and range of grades of sand paper Anyone else add any more useful tools for beginner builders? I'll have to start a plan builders beginner thread Edited By Peter Savage on 28/10/2009 18:48:52 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter 'Ivanna Crashalot' Savage Posted October 28, 2009 Author Share Posted October 28, 2009 Do you think solartex would be too heavy for it? i think the real thing is matte Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klippy Posted October 29, 2009 Share Posted October 29, 2009 Received my plans yesterday, still waiting for the kit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Whiting Posted October 29, 2009 Share Posted October 29, 2009 Pete, Satin black Solartex would be fine, I should think when operational they were matt, but the Old Warden Lysander is black satin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken anderson. Posted October 29, 2009 Share Posted October 29, 2009 all these lysanders getting built-we're going to have more now than we did during the war--speaking of which - someone seen tony nijhuis outside the pub lighting his fag's with £20.00 note's...........'ss....... ken anderson........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi g Posted October 29, 2009 Share Posted October 29, 2009 So thats why the postage was so expensive ken. Are you sure they were twenties, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken anderson. Posted October 29, 2009 Share Posted October 29, 2009 prob wrong----not sure but i think young asher's was there also.... 'sss........... ken anderson(could be my last post lad's)............. young asher's=david ashby......(top man)...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ashby Posted October 29, 2009 Share Posted October 29, 2009 That's a teriffic job Peter, neat work They called me that at school Ken but it can't have been you - I'm nowhere near old enough Edited By David Ashby - RCME Admin/Moderator on 29/10/2009 10:09:02 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter 'Ivanna Crashalot' Savage Posted October 29, 2009 Author Share Posted October 29, 2009 Got the elevators and rudder done, doing the solid balsa edges now! We should have like a lysander meet! at some airfield or something I bet most of them will be B MA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom McGhie Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 I have built models in past and I am taking my time with this one. Dry fit and double check and refer to the blogs. It looks a nice kit and not too difficult with CNC parts. I might try wickes woodglue. I have tried some wood gluesI had in garage but they don't seem to be strong enough easy to break joint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Ireland Posted October 30, 2009 Share Posted October 30, 2009 I was introduced to Aliphatic glue some time ago and use it for just about everything other than engine mount, bearers and wing spars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Whiting Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 Many modellers spend £00's on their model, then look for the cheapest glues. My advice is buy a good waterproof PVA. My first choice is Evostik in the 'blue' dispenser. As Doug says superphatic is good, but the joints need to be precise fitting. For ALL my load bearing joints I use the PVA of my choice, the wood will fail before the glue, so I have no use for epoxies Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi g Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 WOW thats brave advise. pva is a good glue but as with all glues it depends on the surface being joined . to say we are gluing ply. if its a hardwood veneer with a rough grain surface and we are laminating then pva will be fine but if that surface was say micro sanded birch then epoxy would be better. balsa will glue with bascally anything as its absorbant even tho its a hardwood. thats why cynos work so well with it .but start glueing plys with cyno and expect the odd bad joint. PVA and alphatic are bascially the same thing , ones a poly vynal ones an emulsion base.. they both remain flexible in the join although pva more so. good strength yes , and most common in wood working, but high strength and load no way . use epoxy....!!!!!!! PVA isnt really waterproof or fuel proof either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Whiting Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 Kiwi, I speak as I find, and have only used Evostik PVA Waterproof for all my builds including water planes, Amongst those, I have one which is a Puppeteer on floats, it's 11 years old, and flown regular off water. Last year I had an argument with a marker buoy, the models damage was lower wing and fuselage. It was completey stripped,repaired, and recovered. There was no failure of any glue joints. Hopefully she will give a few more years service, as long as I don't try and use maker buoys as aircraft carriers I feel that a reasonable test for any glue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter 'Ivanna Crashalot' Savage Posted October 31, 2009 Author Share Posted October 31, 2009 I am skipping to the wing construction for now cause i wanna get some filler for the tail plane Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi g Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 I m sure you have terry . if the glue is inside well sealed and no water can penetrate thats fine as youve proven. But as PVA and alphatic rely on moisture to cure they wont hold up to dampness for long. You wont see PVA used in boat construction. A good measure of a PVA was to use the longest curing one as it relies on penetration for strength . You use PVA in a hot room and those joins wont be as good. Most PVA and alphatic glues state not for exterior or structural use. polyurethane glues will be more sutable for this but they too have limitations. Like I said if gluing balsa in pva is fine as penetration is good on the wood. but glue smooth ply face to face and the join not so good. Most the time the glue join is only acting as a fillet to give a larger gluing surface. wipe that fillet away the join will again fail. Pva and alphatic are heavy glues as are epoxy. making cynos the choice for modern modellers. .. Most chinese arfs are glues with fast drying polyvynals thats why the joins a prone to breaking Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Richards Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 I use a lot of Evostic resin W waterproof PVA both for modelling and joinery and have never seen the glue fail before the wood. I do not agree that it is heavy compared to Epoxy. Although it is heavy when wet it is much lighter when all the moisture has evaporated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi g Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 Point being was that PVA and epoxy are heavier than CA. The boys in my joinery department use plenty of PVA but the joins are all mechanical with screws and dowels , dovetails , rotary joinery connections etc. not a straight butt or lap as in modelling. Laminating is usually done via two part powder resin glues. Edited By kiwi g on 31/10/2009 22:03:04 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Richards Posted November 1, 2009 Share Posted November 1, 2009 My point was that PVA is lighter than Epoxy. I think glue is a personal choice much of the time most glues are strong enough for most modelling applications. When I have seen glue joints fail it has been because of bad joints not because of weak glue. I guess that an argument for using CA because it is light. However I think PVA allows me to get away with dodgy joints for a small weight penalty.Edited By Bruce Richards - Moderator on 01/11/2009 08:15:53Edited By Bruce Richards - Moderator on 01/11/2009 08:16:48 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Whiting Posted November 1, 2009 Share Posted November 1, 2009 Bruce , as you rightly say glues are a personal choice, and as after 20+ years of water plane flying, which has to be the worst environment for any model, my Evostic resin W waterproof has never failed me, and is what I'm using on my Lysander. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi g Posted November 1, 2009 Share Posted November 1, 2009 Hang on a minute .. Terry you said . As Doug says superphatic is good, but the joints need to be precise fitting. For ALL my load bearing joints I use the PVA of my choice, the wood will fail before the glue, so I have no use for epoxies. So what you are saying was that you are fine with gluing structural things as lets say Firewalls. then you said alphatic needs more precise joins yet alphatic and PVA are bascally the same.. Then bruce you just said that pva doesnt break just bad joins then you say it lets you get away with bad joins. as far as waterproof I was only stating what the majority of manufactuers say on there containers,. Now Pva is a good modelling glue in general but the point being I would not like to be starting the nitro motor when the Pva glue lets go and it will .... Hey I use PVA all the time as Im not that keen on relying on CA on spruce and ply surfaces but theres no way I would use it to join a wing spar or firewall.. like I stated the Pva is best when it can be absorbed into the grain structure of the wood thats why it doesnt glue smooth surfaces well. Pva has advantages in that it remains flexable compared to CA and you need not mix it like epoxy but structural strength .. good luckEdited By kiwi g on 01/11/2009 09:47:49 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Whiting Posted November 1, 2009 Share Posted November 1, 2009 Kiwi, No I would never use on firewalls which carried an I/C motor, sorry to those I gave that impression. Back to some building Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter 'Ivanna Crashalot' Savage Posted November 2, 2009 Author Share Posted November 2, 2009 Got some obechi 1/4" sheet for the spars Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom McGhie Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 Anyone built the wings yet ? I will be looking to start soon studied the plan and wonder if you need to pack with 2.5mm as mentioned in previous post? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter 'Ivanna Crashalot' Savage Posted November 3, 2009 Author Share Posted November 3, 2009 You need a sheet of 1/16" under the spar when you pin it down, don't let it come out behind the spar. then push the ribs down as far as they will go. I have just started the inner left wing section Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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