Tim Mackey Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 Not sure what has happened over on my U Tube account, but the various videos I did seem to have disappeared - all I'm left with for now is this. I will see if I still have the origonal sound files somewhere and update things if I can. Edited By Tim Mackey - Administrator on 10/03/2011 10:13:42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Card Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 Very interesting stuff. Top tip for the video, click on it and watch it at full size in HQ mode so you can see the detail onscreen better. I hadn't realised you could load your own sounds, it would be fun to go to an airshow and capture the engine start up of the full size version of your model, then use that very sound on your module. Are you planning on adding a second speaker on your next installation, to liberate the full 40W of performance? The sound modules I've heard at shows in the past all suffered from lack of volume which does hurt the realism somewhat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myron Beaumont Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 Timbo Am I to deduce that the Camel has been "re-kitted" ? If so you have my condolences after all that work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Mackey Posted December 21, 2009 Author Share Posted December 21, 2009 Thanks peevie - I have added the top tip Yes 2 x speakers probably...but of course that depends on the suitability of the model size and weight carrying capability. Incidentaly, MSC are planning to release a 120 Watt add on ampflifier sometime next year ! The preloaded sounds are exactly that - MSC record the actual engine in a full size plane using very high quality recording equipment, there are obviously a few which they have /can not yet record....but the list grows monthly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Mackey Posted December 21, 2009 Author Share Posted December 21, 2009 Posted by Myron Beaumont on 21/12/2009 09:00:54:Timbo Am I to deduce that the Camel has been "re-kitted" ? If so you have my condolences after all that work Unfortunately yes..... Written off on day one, flight one....finals were called, and finals it was Unknown cause, but I have a clip of the crash, and may post it here in a while for "expert analysis" We all know thats the nature of the game, and one just has to shrug it off and move on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete B Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 Ohhh, Timbo............................... heartiest commiserations, mate Onwards and upwards.................. Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen Grigg Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 Im sorry to hear that Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Card Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 Yikes, sorry to hear that Timbo. Like you say, we know it goes with the territory, but never easy to accept, especially a nice model like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Mackey Posted December 21, 2009 Author Share Posted December 21, 2009 Cheers guys.... yes its a bit of a blow, especially when it happens on a fairly expensive model, and on a maiden flight ! Thank goodness we followed the usual code of practice and took the static shots first, and also that JB was on the ball enough to get some great flying shots as soon as she was airborne. I had around 7 minutes of flight, all well behaved and after initial trimming ( not much at all ) she settled down into fairly easy left hand circuits - as dictated by the wind direction and camera requirements, I did probably, say 12 - 15 such circuits, with the odd R/H circuit or low pass etc to break the monotony, and on finals, as I turned her left yet again in the exact same way to enter base leg, she just rolled over to the right and went in inverted. I honestly dont know what happened, power was down a bit but not enough to affect flying speed which was still fairly high. Charging the cells back home saw just 2700 m/a go back in ( 6s2p LiFe cells at 2300 mahr each - totalling capacity of 4600 so plenty left by the sounds of it ) Was it a downwind stall? Did a gust catch her on the turn? Did the radio fail? Both elevator halves were out at the crash scene, but of course that could well have been impact damage - she went in pretty darn hard. Having said that, the tail end was about the only bit that didnt get smashed...so I do still wonder if the elevator came out?? I had aileron rudder coupling and as I say, the exact same circuit had been flown many times during the flight without any nasty incident. I guess we may never know.The remains..... I will post the fateful circuit video when I get a mo.....and all you armchair fliers can have a go at crash investigation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken anderson. Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 all that work tim................ ken anderson.......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myron Beaumont Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 Timbo Please don't moderate me but if it had been powered by an engine ????? I just had to say it but that's just me ! -Really sorry, but what happened was probably " a lekky thing". Don't get me wrong 'cos everything you did looked OK ! It's a crying shame -That's what I think Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Mackey Posted December 21, 2009 Author Share Posted December 21, 2009 Err thanks for the thumbs up kenMyron, thats not the sort of thing that causes my moderator finger to act . However, factually speaking, I am not sure why you would come to that conclusion.... IMO leccy power is more reliable than IC, and besides there was no suggestion that power failure was the cause Edited By Tim Mackey - Administrator on 10/03/2011 14:53:15 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myron Beaumont Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 Timbo Sorry but that wasn't what I was saying at all . What I meant was that you built a new type configuration of all those batteries "up front" & with all the innovative things you did ,being so complicated electrically then maybe ,even one bad joint would have caused a failure? I suppose what I'm saying is that lots & lots of IC powered models of the Camel have flown for ages . In a way you are extending the use of technology to further our hobby Innovative is the word I'm looking for . Such a shame you can't pin down the cause though isn't it ? Didn't mean to sound as if I was anti -lekky On the contrary -I'm thinking of getting a 90 mm EDF for Xmas & a couple more lipos (depends on 'er indoors ) By the w\ay -she loves the smell of steam ,being a Yorkshire lass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Card Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 Based on your description Tim it seems like elevator failure is the most likely cause. I assume it dropped before rolling, as opposed to rolling into the dive? The photo doesn't show an obvious reason for an elevator to pop out as a result of the crash (unless the elevator servo is towards the middle of the fuselage and the pushrod compressed in the crash), so maybe it wasn't fully secure before take off? What kind of hinging arrangement was used and was it the hinge, the glue between hinge and trailing edge, or the trailing edge itself which came away? Edited By peevie on 21/12/2009 11:56:09 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Mackey Posted December 21, 2009 Author Share Posted December 21, 2009 It didnt actually appear to drop before rolling...but very hard to tell TBH - I will post the video soon. The whole elevator halves were hanging off, still connected to the pushrods+clevises, the "furry" hinges having come completely out of the balsa tailplane T/E.The other 3 people present say they could see no obvious reason for the crash, and were also a little alarmed to see the elevators out. As I say - and you confer - the tail feathers area, and the nature of the way the model went in, should not really have caused this....one would almost expect the impact force /direction to have "pushed the elevator in".... rather than yank it out IYSWIM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Mackey Posted December 21, 2009 Author Share Posted December 21, 2009 Posted by Myron Beaumont on 21/12/2009 11:44:20:Timbo Sorry but that wasn't what I was saying at all . What I meant was that you built a new type configuration of all those batteries "up front" & with all the innovative things you did ,being so complicated electrically then maybe ,even one bad joint would have caused a failure? I suppose what I'm saying is that lots & lots of IC powered models of the Camel have flown for ages . In a way you are extending the use of technology to further our hobby Innovative is the word I'm looking for . Such a shame you can't pin down the cause though isn't it ? Didn't mean to sound as if I was anti -lekky On the contrary -I'm thinking of getting a 90 mm EDF for Xmas & a couple more lipos (depends on 'er indoors ) By the w\ay -she loves the smell of steam ,being a Yorkshire lass I assure you there were no bad joints - all the powertrain was still working after the crash, despite the state of the cabling following the impact! I actually ran the motor up whilst it was hanging out of the wreckage as seen on the workbench...and tugged hard on all interconnects - all solid. I dis-assembled the battery pack later on, and all interconnects had to be forcefully heated and pulled off the cells, with no signs of connection failure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Ireland Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 Must admit I've always been a bit sceptical of those "furry" hinges on ARF models. Even after using more cyano and pinning them I still don't like them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken anderson. Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 alas poor yorrick i new him well----the most annoying bit of losing a model aircraft in this way is why???----and with reguard's to the fact that it happen's on the maiden flight is even more annoying....i've heard many a modeller say unprintable thing's and then declare that is it -they are finished with the hobby...... tim has been there before as have most of us...the time you have allocated to building the model with the xtra tlc added is impossible to measure-for if someone told you that on it's maiden flight it was going to end up as a load of junk...you would have cardiac failure...........never mind the way forward is to put it down to one of them thing's and move on to the next project....which after rahme let's tim back in the house -he will....................... ken anderson......... p.s....tim back in house(joke).......Edited By ken anderson. on 21/12/2009 15:38:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Richards Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 For me the fact that you are only ever moments away from a pile of sick adds the excitement to the hobby. I know it is not the first thought that you have after crashing but it does make the hobby what it is, if the never crashed it would not be nearly as exciting and challenging. Do not get me wrong I am not saying I enjoy crashing just the challenge of not crashing in all its facets from building through preparation, choosing the right kit to flyingWhere the video Timbo? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Roberts Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 I really enjoyed the article in the mag last night (or should i say this morn as i laid awake reading at 4am as the wife has been ill and was keeping me up grrrr lol.) sorry to hear what happened Timbo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken anderson. Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 timbo-you had no chance there-too low to try and save the plane.............. ken anderson....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myron Beaumont Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 Timbo Just stop/started your vid many times (no I'm not a sadist Once she turned to the right it seemed to get disproportionally worse didn't it A bit like ailerons jamming over with maybe rudder as well .I noticed on the left to right flypast that she appeared to be quite responsive to your correction to what I presume was a "gust"' Did you use full aileron deflection at any time to get the feel of them ? Anyway , very sad -what a lovely machine . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JOHN BOWMAN Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 For the record. I had been taking the pictures of Tim's model and it was flying beautifully, a joy to see and hear as it happens. All very nice, a text book flight up to the point of the crash. Tim has been flying low accurate circuits near to the camera and it looked perfect, like it was going to become one of those models that just fly beautifully and last for many years. Having completed the first photo session Tim called landing and flew down wind ready to turn finals but before he could turn the model simply half rolled inverted and sort of half looped into the ground as can just be seen on the video. A real shame and a mystery, Just for the record definately not pilot error! Hard luck Tim I know how much work went into the project. Regards John Bowman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Mackey Posted December 22, 2009 Author Share Posted December 22, 2009 Posted by Myron Beaumont on 22/12/2009 19:46:51:Timbo Just stop/started your vid many times (no I'm not a sadist Once she turned to the right it seemed to get disproportionally worse didn't it A bit like ailerons jamming over with maybe rudder as well .I noticed on the left to right flypast that she appeared to be quite responsive to your correction to what I presume was a "gust"' Did you use full aileron deflection at any time to get the feel of them ? Anyway , very sad -what a lovely machine . It got proportionally worse simply because nothing I did had any effect at all....felt as if I had lost radio contact. I am loathe to suggest this as the cause, because I can honestly say I have been nothing but totally happy with my Spektrum stuff for 3 years constant flying with it, in all sorts of models and locations...with never a problem. I also am not one to jump on the "it must have been radio failure" waggon whenever a model goes in .Yes it was a little gusty, but nothing compared to what I normally fly in at the Orme! Controls were as usual for me, lots of travel, with loads of expo....never got around to using full aileron as the objective of the session was to get the photoshoot done - in that respect - mission accomplished..... as shown in the current mag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Ireland Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 Ken FYI, Its "Alas poor Yorick, I knew him Horatio, a fellow of infinite jest..."Edited By Doug Ireland on 22/12/2009 22:52:15 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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