FIAT G50 WW2 Warbird

[Ton van Munsteren]

Have been working form 2008 on my Fiat G50 first started with the drawing and in 2009 with the build of the model.

 

The design was at first started to make it into a kit for RBCkits but plans have changed and when its up to me and hopefully RCM&E the Fiat will make it into a drawing publication.

 

Being a F4C scale fan I have been trying to have the Fiat as good to scale as possible and have to admit that its hard to reach that high level, specialy when you don't have the real plane standing somewhere in a museum.

 

Because I only do fly Eflight I based the design on a electricmotor , sound system and a wingspan of 2 meter.

 

Have made already about 300 photo's so this will be a thread with lots of pics to share.

 

Hope you guys like it and if there are to many pics please tell.

 

Let start with some pics and let them tell the story for now.

 

This is the version Iam going for.

 

 

My workshop door with lots of collected photo's.

 

Ton

[Stephen Grigg]

Thats looks a project Ton

[Ton van Munsteren]

Some  photo's of the drawing checkin over the 3 View and foto's of the real plane , to make sure its as good to scale as I can.

 

The design is in 3D its lots of work but good fun to do, from there I take out the parts which have been cnc cut at RBCkits so I can build my model.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ton

 

[Ton van Munsteren]

Stephen,

 

Yes that sure is a project to be honest also a little to big for my workshop

 

But I wanted to go for 2mtr for competition and when drawing on the PC it was a lot smaller than in real life

 

Ton 

 

[Ton van Munsteren]

Lets start building the Fiat here are the first set of photo's

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ton 

[Danny Fenton]

Beautiful work there Ton, do you find going from 2d to 3d helps to get the fit of parts just right?

How much clearance do you allow for wood? For example if you want a 6mm stringer in a bulkhead how big do you cut the notch 6.1mm??

 

Really looking forward to seeing how you get on.

 

Cheers

Danny

[Tim Hooper]

Posted by Danny Fenton on 13/12/2010 23:08:16:

Really looking forward to seeing how you get on.

 

Cheers

Danny

 

Seconded!

 

tim

[Ton van Munsteren]

Sorry Danny and Tim for the late reply, but I just came back from a training in Germany.

 

Danny,

Yes I like to work with 3D to know for sure the parts are correct and that the connection or openings are in the right place and order.

 

For me the greatest fun is to see a model grow on my screen and to see how its going to look like at the end.

 

Its also a check for the surface to make sure its good to shape and smooth.

 

A lot more difficult and time consumming and not always needed when the model or basic design is not to complicated.

 

I design my models with some self-aligning in mind and for a build thats as easy as possible (I hope) and to give RBCkits the option to turn it into a kit.

 

Clearance : To be honest I don't take any tolerance in account there is to much deviation in the wood / cnc cutting etc etc sizes that I don't work with +/- 0,1 or what ever.

 

I just work with the standard thickness of lets say 2mm or 3mm etc knowing that the liteply RBC is selling is like 2.8mm or something, other type's of plywood's are 3mm or even +tol, that make it all very difficult to have a 100% fit which you don's realy need and could even give tension in the construction.

 

I let RBCkits do the work on cnc cutting my parts and let them handle the tolerance and must admit that they are always doing a good job for me.

 

 

Tim,

Good to have you here hope you like the Fiat and enjoy the build.

 

 

Here some more pics.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ton 

[Stephen Grigg]

Im just amazed at how clever you guys are.I have trouble writing sentences on my computer let alone anything else.Im so impressed with what you create on your computer Ton.What do you actually send to  RBC Kits,to get them to create the kit required.And the speed at which its coming together also.its all so impressive

[Danny Fenton]

Thanks for the information Ton, I have never managed to get to grips with the leap from 2D to 3D I am okay with basic straight lines but when it comes to curves I get a bit lost. 2D is probably all I will do as none of my plans are for mass consumption, just my own models.

 

Stephen there is an excellent course you can do online if you are interested, based on TurboCad and is purely about designing models. It is given by Gary Hethcoat over on RCSB. I can send the link if you are interested its 4 one hour sessions.

 

Anyway sorry Ton, trampling all over your fascinating thread

 

Cheers

Danny

 

Edited By Danny Fenton on 17/12/2010 09:03:10

[Ton van Munsteren]

Stephen,

 

Thanks for the compliment.

 

What I send to RBC is my 3D drawing with all the parts taken out in 3D than set in 2D. 

The 2D parts are than placed in a drawing with the balsa sheet outlines and the material selection and thickness, for cutting the parts.

The rest is up to RBC to make from the 3D drawing a 2D drawing for in a kit and I must say that its a lot of work to make a good 2D drawing.

 

 

Danny,

 

Thanks now your making me nervous

 

Its good to work with a 2D drawing and would be no problem to design and build a good model from, why not go the extra mile and have a go at making a drawing and send it to RCME and if I can help please tell.

The Tony Nijhuis, Tim Hooper and Peter Miller designs are perfect samples for that and are all their models are great and they are doing a lot of modellers a good deed.

To be honest I do want to go back in basic more simpler designs and have plans for a lot more design in about 65inch span for all type of airplane.

But then starting with a 2D drawing and using only 3D for checking shapes like the fuselage and wing ribs.

Love to see all the request from all the guys in the Tony Special topic and see a lot of less know planes that a would love to design and build and off course publish in RCME.

 

OOOOOOO NNNNOOOO more designs I still have to finish 5 drawings maybe I ask for more spare time for christmas.

 

Ton

 

 

[Stephen Grigg]

Danny Im either a coward,or truthfully dont believe my brain would cope at present,What I mean by that is I read what Ton sent to RBC,but  still havent figured it out yetIm at the stage where you can tell me how to do something,I listen intently and didnt get it.It comes by doing it,over and over.Ive come an amazing journey in 3 years of modelling and proud of my progress,but it is 1 step at a time.

[Ton van Munsteren]

Stephen,

 

Do you mean its not clear how to use a cad program or are my answers to complicated, talking about 2D and 3D with you not knowing where it stands for.

 

Ton

[Stephen Grigg]

Hi Ton,I dont understand the cad program,I remember Gemma writing a lot about cad.I understand 2D and 3D(I watched Avatar in 3D),but Im trying to understand exactly what you have to send to RBC ,for them to produce the kit, and how they go about it with what they are given..Do they get ,similar to what you showed in your first photos and measurements.Or do they put information you give them in to a computer that reads cad and it then instructs a machine to chisel a balsa tree into the parts you require

[Danny Fenton]

Hi Stephen, yes you have come a long way and don't sweat it lol you will pick it up, but it is incredibly addictive once you get started..........be warned

 

I will let Ton explain the cad/balsa tree/relationship he is far better at it than me.

 

You had me chuckling though  

 

Cheers

Danny

[winchweight]

Looks great Ton, superb to watch the photo become a 3D, then a model.

 

Danny, chuck the link to the Turbo Cad lesson up please.

[Danny Fenton]

Hi Shaun, the recordings are not free but the first sample session is free to download. I was involved in the D4Y Judy sessions, though I did go on to more or less finish the Klemm 35 just for the experience. Allbeit too small to inspire

 

Wings on the Web

 

Cheers

Danny

[Ton van Munsteren]

Shaun ,

Thanks good to hear you like it.

 

 

Stephen,

I will try to explain;

 

In the first photo you see all the parts needed for the FIAT to build .

In the next photo a closer look at the parts placed in a balsa sheet size rectangle,

so RBC knows what size sheet to cut from and how many sheets needed.

 

 

Next are the Plywood parts, for that its good to know what sheet size the CNC machine can handle, because there is no standard like the balsa sheets.

Next the most important photo of a part with all possible problems that

RBC needs to correct, if the part drawing is not good for cutting.

 

1 :  is the actual part in 2D as it would show on the drawing.

2 :  the same part made active to show all the line dots and how its build up,

      this dots are the referance points for the CNC cutter to know where to go.

3 :  same part with to many dots the cutter will have to many ref. points and

      cutting will take to long and can cause problem and will also make the

      cuttingtime  expencive.

4 :  same part with the line brocken , the line should be closed or else the

      cutter will be allover the part and will go from one end to the other.

 

The better the drawing the less (repair)work for RBC to cut and the more interresting

they can offer the parts to the designer/builder.

 

They still need to do a lot of work for making the parts ready because they need to

set the parts in CNC cutting data and also make the offset on the part line fot the cutter

thickness.

 

I hope to have made it a little more clear.

 

Ton

 

[Ton van Munsteren]

Some more build photo's ;

 

Ton

[Lindsay Todd]

Very nice Ton, just looking at moving to cnc cut parts for my designs so some really useful info. Look forward to seeing the build progress.

 

Lindsay

 

[Ton van Munsteren]

Lindsay,

 

Thanks and good to have you here and must admit when you go for the CNC parts theres no way back it makes life so much easier building that model.

Please do keep in mind that cutting CNC as a strait line is quicker than a rounded line and therefore less costly.

Great new design you have made on the Debutant will be following your every step

 

Ton

[Stephen Grigg]

Hi Ton ,I understand now,thanks for your time and patience.

[Ton van Munsteren]

Some more photo's ;

 

Ton

[Ross Clarkson]

Pure class and workmanship, i am very much in awe!!

Can not wait to see the end result.

Good luck Ton.

[Ton van Munsteren]

Thanks Ross,

 

Some more foto's ;

 

Ton