Bob Cotsford Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 Gentlemen, your advice please. Probably I've been too trusting, but it's always paid off in the past when buying or selling second-hand goods, now I'd like some opinions and advice:Early this month I answered an ad. in the the classifieds listing for an engine listed at a good price. The seller agreed to sell, but said he only used postal orders or bank transfer and didn't have a paypal account. The guy has posted on the site previously (since 2009), so I sent him the money following the promise that the engine would be sent first class asap.Since then I've had one email in reply confirming receipt of the money with another promise to send the engine asap which was sent from his iphone. After two weeks I emailed asking if there was a problem with him posting the engine as it hadn't arrived. Eventually after a few more emails from me a reply came 'from his girlfiend' claiming the seller was away and in the middle of moving, and had left the engine with her to post but she couldn't find my address amongst his emails. Once she had the address she would send the engine first class and email me the tracking number. I replied including my address AGAIN. 5 days later I still have no response, no emails, no phone calls to explain, and no engine. So, how patient should I be? After nearly a month should I treat it as an act of fraud and report it to the police (for what good they are)? What would you do? Edited By Bob Cotsford on 30/06/2011 07:42:08 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EZ-Hawk Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 Hi mate 2 weeks and 5 days sounds excessive to be honest but I would have imagined that NO reply would have been the thing if it would have been really fraudulent?. What I would do is send another message to his phone, his girlfriend etc and suggest you are contacting the police "just as a precaution" and then if you don't get an immediate reply, then I would actually do it!. Good luck, hope it turns out ok, sometimes things actually do go wrong and the seller can't make the postings on time. It happened to be on the bay auction site! The guys wife was taken suddenly ill and long story short I got my item and a very apologetic letter and thanks for my patience. I felt a bit guilty to be honest but all was well in the end. Best regards EZ-H (Dave) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Simmons Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 I am sorry that you may have given away your money. Any doubt, please walk away. Can you find out where the seller came from? as if it's in the UK, (It may be a false address given to you) Try the Citizens Advice service and they may be able to help you. I had lost my item that I was selling once as the money never arrived. Life lesson learned the hard way. (I know it's the other way around to yours.) Best of luck to your outcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted June 30, 2011 Author Share Posted June 30, 2011 He is UK, there's no way I'd have sent money overseas! Yes, I think one last email, then start making it official. I could understand him having problems if he's moving, but it only takes a minute to email or phone and explain. If he can't be bothered to do that, then what else can he expect me to think but that it was a con?As you say Dave, it's confusing because if it was a con, why reply to any of my emails once he'd got the money? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Simmons Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 I hope for your sake he is in the UK. Mine was UK address but emails were from overseas routed via a UK address than to me. Do you have his land phone number? or was it via an iphone? I agree it's confusing as he is replying back as he has the money. I hope you will get your goods in the end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Simmons Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 I am now guessing, but what if he has not got the the goods, but is buying 2nd hand from HK or China and than sending it on to you, making a profit? I don't know but if that's the case you may have to wait.. He should inform you that fact if it's true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Harris - Moderator Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 I'd try one last "friendly" communication. Explain that you're getting worried and that you hope there's a genuine reason but if you don't get a satisfactory and prompt response you will be forced to take legal action, possibly including an approach to the police if there's any indication of fraud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve W-O Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 Unfortunately it is not fraud, no criminal offence has been committed, it would have to be a civil case. I assume you sent the money registered/signed for, or if bank transfer you would have the proof. It may be genuine, otherwise send him the notices required for a small claims court action. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Harris - Moderator Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 Isn't there a crime of obtaining money by deception? Whether or not there would be any case to answer, the mention of criminal proceedings might be sufficient to get the seller to the Post Office.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve W-O Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 Posted by Martin Harris on 30/06/2011 10:31:57:Isn't there a crime of obtaining money by deception? Whether or not there would be any case to answer, the mention of criminal proceedings might be sufficient to get the seller to the Post Office.... The police would only look at it as a crime if there were numerous complaints, which would show it was intended to deceive. It is not fraud, althiugh it is a common belief that it would be. A small claims court claim is simple, and most people will pay before it goes to court and the costs get any greater. It is a crime to enter someones premises and remove their property without permision, but these "toll road dodger" scrap merchants do it all the time and the police aren't interested, the same with much antisocial behaviour etc etc. Even if it was a crime, it would not get the money back! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted June 30, 2011 Author Share Posted June 30, 2011 I've sent another mail asking for an update within 48 hours. Part of the problem is that I've grown incautious with not having any problems previously, so I don't have an address for him. Google, however has an amazing ability to find personal details. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ian Jones Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 Bob, Get his last address,Get his new address.Keep the proof of receipt of your money. Don't beat about the bush, tell him you are taking legal advice - if there is no positive result within 7 days then indeed get the legal advice & act on it. First step would probably be as Steve W-O suggests - CAB, they will be able to tell you how to get him to court - I believe this is not expensive. Doing nothing or being lacking in assertiveness will get you nowhere - time for a nice guy to show his metal I think. Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted June 30, 2011 Author Share Posted June 30, 2011 getting his new address might be a stumbling block!Anyway, I'm glad to see it's not just me thinks his behaviour at the very least strange. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Cantwell Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 Hmm by classifieds, do you mean this forums classifeds? i was conned off the BMFA adds, laser 150 advertised, at maybe too good a price, he was selling it for someone else,(now forbidden) i paid the money into his account, i had his address, phone number, and all panned out,there was no engine, only by threatning to come down with a few of the guys, with baseball bats, did he cough up, since then, i have been warned by various folk, you can NEVER be too carefull, if i buy now, it will only be off a traceable BMFA member, with an address that can be checked, and 2 numbers to contact them, touch wood, i have not been scammed again, this was a couple of years ago, the BMFA classifieds have changed since then, I also dont mind paying into a bank account, or recieving money into my bank account, my account number, sort code etc, are given away with every cheque, along with my signature!!but back to this one, insist on your money back, its IS a criminal offence, and the police where very interested in my case, best of luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted June 30, 2011 Author Share Posted June 30, 2011 Thanks all.It was from this site's classifieds, so I'm hopeful that if I don't get a reply within the next few days, the site admin may be able to help with contact details, though that may require a request from the polis in view of the data protection act.Apparently the guy was intending to advertise a DX7, so I've been keeping an eye open for that ad turning up. Interesting, I just looked in 'place an ad', it asks for an email address, a phone number and nearest city. If the guy was truthful with the nearest city I can get his details through t'net. Come to that, his phone number would be useful - or maybe David could give him a call on my behalf, now that wouldn't contravene the DPA. I'm pretty certain I've narrowed him down to having a Scottish university education, he owned his own business or worked as a self employed contractor (IT?), he had an interest in kit cars and his age group is 27-31.Edited By Bob Cotsford on 30/06/2011 20:14:40 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted June 30, 2011 Author Share Posted June 30, 2011 Of course that could all be wrong in which case his namesake is in for some earache! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve W-O Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 For it to be a criminal offence, you have to be able to prove that he had no intention of supplying the goods in the first place. (ie selling the same thing to many people) Otherwise it is breach of contract, a civil dispute. The problem with paying into a bank account is that you do not have any name and address, and as you so rightly say, the bank will not give it out, even to the police without conditions being met. The internet hasn't failed to find anyone yet, just some take longer and more patience Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Ashby - Moderator Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 Bob, really sorry to hear of this, can you PM me the sellers name please. I need to make sure he's removed from the site, Thanks.Edited By David Ashby - RCME Administrator on 01/07/2011 08:05:29 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Simmons Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 So it's from this site's classifieds . CAB is for free advice and are very helpful. Contact the police, and get a crime number so it's registered with the police and it's helpful to have further down the road if you need it. I agree that the internet is a useful tool, (for good and bad.) Best of luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted July 1, 2011 Author Share Posted July 1, 2011 another good reason for sticking to ebay and Paypal in future!He's got the weekend to get in touch, who knows miracles do happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Cantwell Posted July 1, 2011 Share Posted July 1, 2011 STEVE your right, it, unless this thing has been, like you said, to many others, its not a criminal offence, but with this laser i got conned with, over twenty folk had given him money, and you know what? over on a fishing forum, he is still at it!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted July 1, 2011 Author Share Posted July 1, 2011 ok, so did anyone else make an offer on an ASP120FS advertised on this site? If you did, please pm me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted July 5, 2011 Author Share Posted July 5, 2011 Just to close this off, today I got a parcel through the post - yes the engine did finally arrive.So, obviously a full twenty eigjht days from paymant is not an unreasonable length of time. I can only assume that Mr AF had been tied up with his move and other pressing matters, and that his girlfriend really did have the engine sitting on her desk at work for two or three weeks before posting it. My apologies for doubting you Mr AF, but really, would it have been that hard to take two minutes to phone, text or email me to let me know what was happening? It may have been a bargain price, but it did come at some cost to my nerve endings. Still, all's well that eventually ends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.