Steve Hargreaves - Moderator Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 What are we to make of the assertion in this months publication by the good people of Model Technics (fuel suppliers to the masses) that methanol "....is only weakly hygroscopic & will have absorbed all the water it is going to by the time it reaches you...." & that "....fuel will not deteriorate with age if kept sealed...." Have all the people who keep their fuel in a darkened room surrounded by desiccants simply been wasting their time & effort.....? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Harris - Moderator Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 Certainly bears out what I've been told by Dave at Southern Modelcraft. He told me that nitro-methane will degrade if exposed to UV but once mixed, fuel is relatively stable and unless left in an open container or in direct sunlight will last indefinitely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JC Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 I was using two year old green power fuel at the start of this season with no aparent loss of power or starting problems. My fuel is stored in my cool dark cellar. JC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YakMad Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 I buy my fuel in bulk (Optifuel) as there is no decent supply locally, my fuel could be up to a year old and I never have a problem, its stored in a dark shed, I have even given 2 year old fuel which had been previously opened to a flying buddy, his two strokes ran perfectly on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Hargreaves - Moderator Posted June 11, 2012 Author Share Posted June 11, 2012 Agree with all the above....I can't ever remember having a problem with "dodgy fuel" but I know there are many people who categorically state that glow fuel will absorb water....even from the air in the container in which it is kept...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Area 51 Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 12mth old coolpower 10% finished off in March, no problems at all.. not the first time I have used this fuel after lay up... cool, dry, dark store area is used for storage when not heading to the flying field.. as I am very shortly..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOB GADD Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 Hi All. I used some fuel last weekend in a Thunder Tiger four stroke, which was bought in 1994, second spin of the starter she fired up perfectly allright , same performance as in 1994. So fuel does not go off. BOB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codename-John Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 didnt somebody on here do a little experiment of adding water to fuel to see any difference, if i remeber correctly he added a fair percentage and didnt get any considerable power loss or poor running ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Hargreaves - Moderator Posted June 11, 2012 Author Share Posted June 11, 2012 Yes...our old friend Peter Beeney did just that....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Chaddock Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 Not absolutely sure but is there not a difference between water absorbed hygroscopically and water added as a mixture? After all water/methanol injection was a popular way to boost power in big aero engines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allan Bowker Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 I used 10 year old Duraglo 5 after my break from the hobby. It had been stored in a cool dark area of the garage and can confirm it was as good as the day it was purchased. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vecchio Austriaco Posted June 11, 2012 Share Posted June 11, 2012 3 year old Rapicon heli 20 works fine. Now (living on my own) stored in a kitchen cabinett as in the shed the temperature is less constant. VA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Moore Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 Good news guys. I don't fly IC very often and keep my fuel in a cool dark larder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi g Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 Methanol water absorbsion . cant comment .. But containers condensation, possible. oil , nitro separation , possibly . People not shaking their fuel before use.. more than likely. Emptying fuel from a model tank without a filter back into the container , bet thats happened heaps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 1994! You don't know you're born you don't! I bought some fuel before it was made and kept it in cardboard box in the the middle of the M25. Then mouth pipetted it into a rusty sc40 with reed valves - started first time. Now that's real aeromodelling! AW eat yer heart out! BEB PS a la Monty Python Edited By Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator on 12/06/2012 10:32:30 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myron Beaumont Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 We used to lick road dry wit' tongue .We got our oil for fuel off the top of puddles left by old cars' drips We supped it up and spat it out and filtered it through an old rag we used to sleep under when we weren;t doing 24 hour shifts down the mine 10 miles away Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martyn K Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 Chemical Definition of Methanol **LINK** Methanol is a colourless liquid, completely miscible with water and organic solvents and is very hydroscopic." Definition of Hydroscopic **LINK** Hygroscopy is the ability of a substance to attract and hold water molecules from the surrounding environment. This is achieved through either absorption or adsorption with the absorbing or adsorbing material becoming physically 'changed' somewhat, by an increase in volume, stickiness, or other physical characteristic of the material, as water molecules become 'suspended' between the material's molecules in the process. While some similar forces are at work here, it is different from capillary attraction, a process where glass or other 'solid' substances attract water, but are not changed in the process (for example, water molecules becoming suspended between the glass molecules). Hygroscopic substances include cellulose fibers such as cotton and paper, sugar, caramel, honey, glycerol, ethanol, methanol, diesel fuel, sulfuric acid, methamphetamine, many fertilizer chemicals, many salts (including table salt), and a wide variety of other substances. (Note: Hydroscopic has now been replaced by the word Hygroscopic) Not sure why I have gone green though... Regards Martyn Edited By Martyn K on 12/06/2012 12:12:51 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Harris - Moderator Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 I'm sure there's no argument that methanol is hygroscopic although the Model Technics view of it being weakly hygroscopic differs to the accepted view (I wonder if the methanol/oil mixture behaves any diffrently to pure methanol in this respect?) but the point is that even in a virtually empty sealed container of fuel, there is only a tiny amount of water contained in the air and even if it was absorbed by the fuel, the effect would be insignificant. Leave the top off and things might be different of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martyn K Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 I think that is a fair statement. There has to be water present for it to be absorbed. My only experience with bad fuel was when I did leave the top off for about 1-2 weeks. The engine ran, but it was VERY erratic.. Martyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Harris - Moderator Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 I'd guess that would likely be due to methanol evaporation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flytilbroke Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 Vindication at last. I bet that the possibility of convincing the proponents of the "water in fuel myths, plural" is still almost microscopically small. Shame that some new to Glow engine use people will still have to suffer the false beliefs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Harris - Moderator Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 If anyone has fuel they want to get rid of because it's a year or three old then I'll always be glad to dispose of it via my silencers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spice Cat Posted June 12, 2012 Share Posted June 12, 2012 Posted by Myron Beaumont on 12/06/2012 11:28:56: We used to lick road dry wit' tongue .We got our oil for fuel off the top of puddles left by old cars' drips We supped it up and spat it out and filtered it through an old rag we used to sleep under when we weren;t doing 24 hour shifts down the mine 10 miles away Aye, but you try tellin' tha' to kids today; thou don't believe ya.. On a more serious note, I have kept a small unstoppered bottle of MT 10% in the shed on a top shelf above the door. I often use a drop this to prime bench run engines and it's never failed to light. Must have been there for about two years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.