chris Ibbotson Posted May 22, 2014 Share Posted May 22, 2014 Hi C.B. Your have looked and learned from "Electriflier". You are doing a fantastic job on the build, adapting and re-designing the imperfect original formers e.t.c.to allow the build to go ahead. Can I ask a question? Have you thought about removing the ply ribs from the rudder and replacing with Depron? Would this make it less tail heavy, and would it be worth doing? I have seen this build in the flesh and it reflects your skill as a modeller and perfectionist builder. Best regards Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilot_Chuckle Posted May 22, 2014 Author Share Posted May 22, 2014 Thanks everyone for the words of encouragement. Chris, It had crossed my mind but the actual rudder is very flimsy and would need strength adding, thus adding weight. the heaviest part of the tail section is the two horizontal halves, these I may start removing some ply but will see how the CG looks before doing anything too drastic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Powell Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 I've often thought about doing this(hate cutting out formers ribs etc). What would the weight normally be if you just used wood to cover it? Looks great by the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electriflier Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 Neil, Probably a good comparison would be the Black Horse Hurricane which is a conventional balsa build and at 87", weighs in at circa 16.5lbs plus. I'd hazard a guess and say this model when complete will have an AUW of 9 to 9.5 lb if care is taken so, the difference is considerable I'd say. Roy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Powell Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 Thats a massive difference and i'm guessing that the wing loading/wcl is going to be fairly low meaning you don't have to be an expert to fly one. Really considering this option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilot_Chuckle Posted May 25, 2014 Author Share Posted May 25, 2014 Afternoon Got a couple of hours on the hurricane, to be honest its being a slow process today. First job was to get the fuselage set up perfectly level, this then allowed me to start work on preparing the tail end of the aircraft ready for the horizontal and vertical components. I joined the horizontal halves together. This then allowed me to start 'jigging up' and measuring and cutting depron to allow the horizontal tail section to sit nice and flat at the required incidence. Tail section joined, leaving elevators loose. These will also be joined together to allow the servo to be moved as far forward in the fuselage as possible. Once that was all dried it was time to check how it all fitted together. I also tried my hand at applying the 3mm depron skin to the underside of the tail section, using the trusted method of Electriflier, I don't think I did a bad job but will see in the morning when I get chance to look at it again. That's it for now. Charles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted May 25, 2014 Share Posted May 25, 2014 Excellent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john stones 1 - Moderator Posted May 25, 2014 Share Posted May 25, 2014 Slow but sure, what glue you using to fix to ply Charles ? John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilot_Chuckle Posted May 25, 2014 Author Share Posted May 25, 2014 Posted by john stones 1 on 25/05/2014 19:07:21: Slow but sure, what glue you using to fix to ply Charles ? John John Using Aliphatic and polyurethane wood glues. Only using UHU Por for the depron skinning at the moment. Charles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john stones 1 - Moderator Posted May 25, 2014 Share Posted May 25, 2014 Cheers Charles John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Bennett Posted May 25, 2014 Share Posted May 25, 2014 great looking model. watching with interest as its a method i want to try soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Fenton Posted May 25, 2014 Share Posted May 25, 2014 Hi Charles, really looks great, how are you going to tackle the fabric areas?CheersDanny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilot_Chuckle Posted May 25, 2014 Author Share Posted May 25, 2014 Danny, The whole model is going to be 'skinned' in 3mm depron. Fingers crossed then the "fabric" skin will then be painted in to look like fabric. Had an hour or so spare this evening so got on with one job I haven't been looking forward to. Not finished yet but............ He's coming along OK ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Rawlinson Posted May 26, 2014 Share Posted May 26, 2014 That's looking awesome. do you think it would fit through the score board at the flying field Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilot_Chuckle Posted May 26, 2014 Author Share Posted May 26, 2014 Posted by Philip Rawlinson on 26/05/2014 16:26:49: That's looking awesome. do you think it would fit through the score board at the flying field Thanks Phil Neither does a Depron Fun Fly either Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilot_Chuckle Posted May 28, 2014 Author Share Posted May 28, 2014 Managed a little bit more over the past day or so, started working on the rear of the fuselage. First job was to add more vertical 6mm depron ready for the horizontal tail to fix to later on. Once that had dried, i flipped the model over to start working on the tail wheel. Quick measure up on the plans showed a 52mm diameter wheel was required. Once a suitable wheel was located in the spares box, I set about bending some 12 swg wire to the right shape. This was then fixed using saddle clamps to a piece of 1/2" balsa sandwiched between two 3mm lite ply sections ready to be fixed to the fuselage former. I made a decision to make the tail wheel fixed. Nice and simple Next I thought I would try my hand at skinning again, after a little compliment from Roy the other day on my previous 'skinning' So on with the vertical stab. Roy had already shown and cut a 6mm depron piece ready to be attached. Next the bit I was looking forward to, and having watched and leant from Roy a couple of techniques I skinned the vertical stab both sides. To say I was pleased will be a understatement. Its starting to take shape now. Charles Edited By Pilot_Chuckle on 28/05/2014 21:32:30 Edited By Pilot_Chuckle on 28/05/2014 21:33:03 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Bennett Posted May 28, 2014 Share Posted May 28, 2014 now that looks impressive sir. fascinated with this build. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilot_Chuckle Posted May 30, 2014 Author Share Posted May 30, 2014 Evening, not really got much done today. However what time was available was spent chatting with Roy about the hurricane build and how to move it along. Along the build Roy has been advising me to save weight and to possibly consider changing the motor for something with a little more power. So after dry assembling the tail section onto the fuselage, mounting the wing it was time to weigh the model complete with the retract units, 4s 4500mah lipo, 3300mah 6v Rx pack, spinner and other bits and bobs. It weighs in at just under 9 lb Time to see how the model sits with reference to CG, yep she's tail heavy (no surprise) Both Roy and I were a little disappointed in the weight, now projected at 11 lbs plus, so a motor swap is now needed. But this would allow the use of 6s lipo (more nose weight ) Any how here's a picture of the lovely hurricane to date, still loads to do but going in the right direction. BTW the prop sat at the front is a 24" Menz prop ! Charles Edited By Pilot_Chuckle on 30/05/2014 21:06:53 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Powell Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 So if it's going to be about 11lbs what does that do to the wing loading and WCL. Just interested to see if the cost of a laser cut kit is worth it bearing in mind the weight saving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Electriflier Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 Neil, Maybe I could be of some help here..... I see this model almost every day and from a build perspective, I'd say that a laser-cut kit has both advantages and disadvantages. A major advantage is usually, the accuracy of a well-designed kit means that most of the guesswork is taken out of the early design stage and therefore, can help expediate a build if you're wanting slightly quicker results. Also, again, if the laser-cut parts are accurate, you're able to produce a composite (depron/ply in this case) model with very clean lines and sharp edges. Major downside when compared to an all-depron build is one of cost. A depron build will always work out cheaper in my opinion. A second consideration when compared to all depron is weight. The same model if built in Depron would probably be no heavier than 9lb as a guess. So, to answer your question more specifically, the additional weight which ultimately could turn out to be nearer 12lb (who knows) would still give incredibly low wing loading and WCL - 19.1 oz ft² and 6 respectively. Better still at 11lb - 17.5oz ft² Wing loading and a WCL of 5!!! So, at the top end of the calculations, he should end up with a model that handles somewhere between a glider and a trainer. Hope this helps Regards Roy Edited By Electriflier on 02/06/2014 22:05:12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilot_Chuckle Posted June 3, 2014 Author Share Posted June 3, 2014 Evening Firstly, thanks to Roy for answering the question above. To be honest never heard of WCL, but I will be doing some reading to learn. Got a little more done to today, after fitting a Pink foam ring to the front of the model to allow for the new bigger motor, I have started to sheet the front end using 3mm depron. and I also had a little time to do some work in the 'office' ready for the canopy to be fitted later in the build. Plenty of room for a 6s lipo to be slotted in there ! Sorry about the lack of words in the blog. But I do find it hard to put things into words. Regards Charles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martian Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 A picture speaks a thousand words Charles and these pictures are saying a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy Mundy Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Charles I've just caught back up with your build, you are doing an Amazing job mate keep up the good work it's an enjoyable blogg and I'm sure you are inspiring a lot of people to give depron a go. well done Roy M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Powell Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Thanks for the info on the wing loadings. I guess its personal preference but the qualitys of a laser cut kit mentioned, accurate etc and the wcl seem to make it, in my opinion, good value. I really think i'll be giving this a go. Fancy a p-47! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilot_Chuckle Posted June 4, 2014 Author Share Posted June 4, 2014 Evening Martian and Roy M, thanks for the kind words. Found a little time today to do a little more skinning. Little bit of filling to do, but other than that damn happy ! Also lowered the pilot a little in the cockpit after looking the photo's form yesterday, he appeared a little too high. Charles Edited By Pilot_Chuckle on 04/06/2014 21:47:15 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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