Building the Nijhuis Lysander

[Terry Whiting]

Hi Jim,

 

A very strange thing about that address, I never receive them, and the sender never receives notice of non delivery.

 

It's much easier using this sites message system  never fails.

 

Jim you stated you were using close loop on the rudder, why not you the same on the elevator, I have. I must say It's a personal choice, but for me it's the only system used on all my model's tail controls.

 

I also advise do not be in a hurry to glass the brass tube to F4 & F5.  Wait until you have the wing built with the carbon joining rods functioning.

 

 

Jack,

Is your's on the building board yet   ?

 

Edited By Terry Whiting on 31/01/2010 09:00:56

[rookie jim]

HiTerry,

I have sent address via sites message system so hopefull you will get it. cant understand why you didnt get the first.

 

Its funny you mentioned about a closed loop system for the elevators. the model shop also said that was an option some people use. I will have to give it some thought.

 

Is there an issue with centralising the loop systems of rudder and elevator as one will presumably take the centre servo and the other the left one assumong right is for throttle.

 

 

It may be my inability to visualise the closed loop on the elevators as i can picture how it works on rudder. have a thunder tiger ready trainer with that system, but not so clear with elevator.

 

 

 

Jim

[Hugh P]

Hi all, re the lights
I have used a MAPLINS NR73Q 5mm White LED, powed by a 90ma single cell lipo. Probably won't need a resistor in circuit but just for safety I have put a 12 ohm 1/8 watt in line. This just protects the LED which runs at 4 volts from the 4.2 volt supply of the fully charged lipo. I got a cheap torch from Co-Op / Rainbow and hacked the lens assyembly out. The reflector is 1" diameter and very light (ugh) weight. This set up will run for ages even using 2 LEDs. I plan to use a turnigy servo speed / direction regulator ( http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idproduct=8863 ) $7.59, that slows down the travel of flaps or gear. As it has 3 servo outputs I will put the lights on the spare channel (using a mini servo and microswitch), so that when the flaps go down the lights come on.

Any one planning to use a Laser 70? I have one and it's not a bad fit, but I will make a mock up of F1 as the carb and muffler need to be recessed into F1.

The build is due to start very soon, just finishing off the latest project.

[Peter 'Ivanna Crashalot' Savage]

I had mounted the engine before i mounted the firewall made it so much easier than faffing with a drill and my freshly made stringered fuselage!

[Terry Whiting]

Jim,

 

I have never suffered any form of problem in cetralizing a 'closed loop' or (pull-pull) system, which really is a better name as it virtually explains what it's actually doing.

 

What many novice modellers do is have their wires FAR to tight, almost like guitar strings.

You will be surprised just how soft a loop can feel, without any slop on the control surface .

 

For close loop wire I use Plastic covered multi stranded stainless steel pike fishing trace, what a mouth full, of about 30lb b/strain, you can also buy the dedicated crimps.

 

  

 

 

  

[Supermario]

Hi guys

I'm back after some days of work in Spain. and I don't have seen you Geoff. If I have the chance of seeing you I will thank you your Kind words, welcome to the Lizzie comunity.

Now, I return to building because the days are passing to quick and soon enter the spring and is time to go flying.

I finished the tail as shown on picture and just need to cover it.

I'm working in the interior because it need to be painted before I begin to put inside the electronics and servos

Regards

Mário

[Terry Whiting]

Jim,

 

Quite nice timing with Mario's photos, as I stated do not hurry to fix your 'brass tubes' to F4 & F5. You can see by the photos, Mario has not  fitted the brass tubes to those two formers.

[Geoff Daunt]

Hi all,

thanks for the various information.

By the way Mario, l am in Javea(or Xabia) about 1 hour north of Alicante.Sun is shining so off to the field later.Sorry about that for you guys in Blighty.!!!

Engine mount position drilled and trial fitted so now on to fixing formers.

[Hugh P]

Hi all.

I have at last found a source of Ali for the U/C. If you are in reach of Cambridge, the shop is Mackay 01223 517000 . I got a peice of T6 grade ali 1 M in length x 3" x 1/8" for £5.40.

In actual fact it was 1.3M but they did'nt charge the extra. Brilliant shop sells just about every tool going, nuts bolts ect even down to our sizes. They even sell balsa! If you are stuck for Ali, I will be at Old Warden for the May Fly weekend, and I'm often down in the Eastbourne area and also down to Wiltshire occasionaly, just let me know and I can get some for you. The shop is on the net and there is a PDF with metals sizes.

http://www.mackay.co.uk//media/pdfs/Metals-Leaflet.pdf

All I need to do now is bend it!

Hugh

[Geoff Daunt]

Hi Hugh,

A big vice on a solid bench and a big hammer...l guess.

Best of luck

[Terry Whiting]

Hugh,

 

Yes you will need all that Geoff has mentioned, but if the aluminium is of  the type that requires brute force then anneal.

Years ago an old De Havilland sheet metal worker showed me this  method.

 

The first job is to make a cardboard template (serial packet) of the inside dimentions

of the finished undercarriage.

 

Now you scrib the aluminium  precisely at the reqired bend points, then rub a piece of soap over the scrib, and to the opposite side so that you can see a 1" band of soap.

Treat one scrib at a time 

 

With the use of a GOOD blow lamp you apply the heat in the area of the scrib/soap, when the soap turns black you are ready for your first bend bend.

Keep checking against your template

 

You might not manage the bend in on go as the aluminium work hardens, if this happens clean off the burnt soap, and re-apply fresh soap., and go through the same procedure.

 

   

[Hugh P]

Terry

Thanks for that, I have heard of the method before, after heating and bending do you need to do a final heat and  then quench in water to re-harden the Ali. I work on an RAF Station and I belive there might be a metal bending machine in workshops, I will have to investigate. I have enough metal for 4 attempts! But it is only a few miles to get some more. Hi Hi.

Hugh

 

[Terry Whiting]

Hugh,

 

I never had that mentioned to me. I was told the act of bending caused a natural hardening prosess. I certainly never quenched the aluminium. 

Try a small test piece.  Anneal, quench. then test for bending.

 

You are a lucky chap with your two sites, RAF Wyton, and Warboys. I recall looking in on Warboys about 15 years ago, the lads there didn't  know my pal or me from Adam, but were made most welcome, on went the kettle for a fresh brew.  Great bunch of guys.     

[Geoff Daunt]

Decided to look at engine position and runs for fuel tank and throttle run before fitting formers etc. and drilling more holes in F1

With engine clamped to mount l found.

1. Throttle arm below bottom of box. I am using the SC 52 FS as per TN  on plan model.

Not a problem since l have reversed the throttle lever position by 180 degrees..

2. Trial fitted the Fuel tank in the box. When placed in central position there is no chance of a straight run to the throttle arm.( tank is a SLEC ( 9oz), The off set would be about  20mm, so too much bend.

3. If l put the tank flush with the r'hand side of the box l can just about get a straight run,maybe 2/3 mil offset to the left side of the tank.

Is this going to effect lateral balence? ...or am l being silly.

Have you guys had any fitting issues and if so best advice how to go forward.

How FAB to be able to have a forum about these issues when you are not sure how to do the right thing,!!!!!

[rookie jim]

Hi all

 

am i reading plan correctly in that i need to build a servo tray for the fuselage servos. from what i can see on the plan there is something inserted about half way up between formers f4 and f5.

 

Terry

Been thinking about pull pull method for elevators. i think i know why i couldnt work it out. i had assumed both horns would be on bottom of elevators one eitehr side of the fin. but am i right in assuming they would be just like the rudder top and bottom on same elevator.

 

 

jim

[Supermario]

Hi all

Jim, you are correct about the servo tray. The plan shows clearly the location of servo tray. I build mine with rests of plywood of the cnc pack.

The servo tray like the plan doesn't work if you use the pull-pull sistem for elevator because the elevator servo got to be placed in horizontal.

Terry tell you how he manage to do this detail.

A photo to show you how I do mine.

 

 

I continue sheeting inside de fuselage, preparing for the instruments panel and guarantee the fuel tank will be visitable.

I had to fillet the top of F3 former because I don't like those corners that appears inside the cabin.

Mario

 

Geoff when I was those days working in Spain I wasn't so far from you. I have been in Valencia.

And about the wheather here in Portugal is sunny too but cold.

About the location of the fuel tank close to the rigth side I think that doesn't affect at all the side balance of the plane because is to near of the longitudinal axle.

Edited By Supermario on 02/02/2010 00:19:35

Edited By Supermario on 02/02/2010 00:31:42

[Terry Whiting]

Geoff,

 

As Mario stated there is no problem with moving the tank to one side, the effect is minimal and can be adjusted when finally balancing the model with the flight pack.

 

When it comes to fitting out servos in a model the first thing I look for is accessibility, I do not want to be a contortionist for adjustments. Making the Lysander's canopy removable as I have, I'm spoilt for room.

 

 

Jim,

 

Yes back to back horns is the answer.

As for the elevator servo being horizontal, really it makes absolutely no difference to the pull pull.

 

I must admit years ago when I first tried 'pull pull'  I did mount my servo so that the output arm was  virtical, then one day I thought WHY, and ever since it's fitted horizontalIy 

 

 . 

[Alan Dorrell]

Hi Everybody,

 

About annealing Auminium and it's alloys, i.e. dural, Terry's instructions are spot on (I'm an ex metalwork teacher). But don't attempt hardening by heat treatment. Ali will work or age harden naturally.

 

Terry,

Your input is incredibly useful in a general sense.

 

As for Supermario. Wow !!!

 

I know I'm nowhere near starting yet (got to complete the Toot as well as learn to fly), but I hope to make my Lizzie electric. Any suggestions for power train ? Motor, esc and size of props and lipos.

 

Cheers. Alan. 

[Papa]

Hi Alan, This link will take you to the site Tony uses for Electric Power and it has all the information you need.

 

 http://www.4-max.co.uk/tn-lysander66.htm

 

Jack Higgins

Toronto

[Simon B]

Mackays in Cambridge is awesome.  Nice range of balsa, plentiful glue, they sell screws and nuts individually and every tool under the sun!

[Hugh P]

OK , I have a full understanding of annealing Auminium now, thanks Guys.

 Simon B

I forgot to say in my last, MAKAYS even sell's Gorrila Glue in three sizes.

[Terry Whiting]

Jack.

 

Checked out the site, but a little too pricey for my liking. Through 2009 I have been flying an 8 lb Sopwith 1&1/2 Strutter on £100 less. I will be playing around with an identical power train for my Lysander.

 

[Alan Dorrell]

Couple more tips on heating of Aluminium. If you go beyond the blackening of the soap the ali will begin to glow and MELT !!

 

Marking for bends by heating (any) metals; mark the spot with a sharpened piece of blackboard chalk. You can still see it when the metal is glowing. Also avoids a scribed or scored line starting a full split or crack in the material.

 

Jack,

 

Thanks for the site address.

 

Cheers. Alan.

[Supermario]

Hi all

Just finish a simple but a very worky task.

Paint the stringers by the interior is quite dificult. No position for the brush

and paint over paint a few times to cover.

In the picture it seems a light blue but really is a light grey blue like the descriptions I

read about the real Weston Lysander.

I use water based paint used to paint automobiles but in the interior I don't have to finish it with varnish.

I made the reinforcement bar at the topo of the F4&F5 formers. I made it in 6 mm aluminium tube with two screws.

Now I have the conditions to begin to put the servos and linkages, and then put the last

stringers in the bottom of the fuselage.

I'm wondering where I shell put the Rx and after a pre balance where to put the battery pack, but in time I will decide.

Terry

If you send me by e-mail I can post more pictures of your Lysander.

Me and (I think) all of us, are quite curious about your the evolution of your work.

 

Regards

Mário

 

[Klippy]

I think you're being a bit shy Mario, you and Terry are pushing the boundaries, this is the first thread I go to, everyday. I had never thought of painting the inside of the model! Except the cockpit.