Keil Kraft Super 60

[David Davis]

She'll certainly fly again but I'm very busy over the next few weeks then I'm off to La Belle France house hunting until June so don't hold your breath.

[tomo55]

Great this Hobby of ours is'nt it. Sad when you pick up the bits but the Super 60 will fly again good on you David.

Good luck Chris

[Ernie]

Hi David, Sounds like an easy repair............Where in La Belle are you thinking about buying......Can I help, We've been in France for quite a long time, and pretty well know our way around the system. ....Just send me an email, if I can help. PS, we're on the west coast, about 100ks north of Bordeaux.........................................................ernie

[Mike Etheridge 1]

Well blow me I went to Epsom police station when I lost my plane all those years ago but I never thought of ringing the RAF!---I can't think what sort of response I would have got from Biggin Hill!

How about a bit more detail David-we won't tell the ministry of defence!

Best of luck with the repair

MJE

[David Davis]

RAF Shawbury is the home of 60 Squadron, a Helicopter Training squadron. The helicopters frequently fly around our flying field but not over it on flying days. I emailed their Community Relations Department to ask them to fly over the area to look for the model which they agreed to do. I sent them a picture of the model so they could recognise it and they emailed me that they'd found it at 09.30 this morning. Mind you, I searched that area on foot last week and didn't see the model. I think that someone found it and moved it to the edge of the field close to the gate.

I always associate Biggin Hill with fighter aircraft. I don't suppose the downward view is as good in a Spitfire as it is in a helicopter!

Pictures of damaged model attached. Closer inspection reveals that some of the glue joints have gone in the wing.

 

 

Edited By David Davis on 15/04/2013 21:11:38

[David Davis]

Yesterday I received this email from the pilot who found my model.

Hello Mr Davies

I am the pilot who located your aeroplane and I am so pleased you have got it back. As a fellow modeller (I fly from Shawbury) I know how distressing it is to lose a model and was delighted to be able to help you recover it and by all accounts in not too bad shape. I hope you'll be airborne again soon now that the good weather is (hopefully) coming.

It was very generous to leave the champagne. My colleague in the office is doing an instructor upgrade on Thursday so we'll have a celebration when he passes.

Thank you again and happy flying

Dick Barton

As the Squadron Leader is called Paul Barton I am left to wonder whether it was the Squadron Leader actually flying the helicopter when the model was found. "Dick" could be a nick-name.

[Ruprect Spode]

I have a good friend who instructs on Griffins, I'll ask about this.

[TigerOC]

Just for interest relating to finding lost models, there is a device;

 

**LINK**

that has a range of 100m which may be of interest to anyone with valuable or precious models.

Edited By TigerOC on 19/04/2013 09:31:47

[David Davis]

I've set myself the task of repairing the Super 60 in a week , in order to fly it at the SAM 35 Cocklebarrow Farm event next Sunday.

Weather forecast does not look good however.

[David Davis]

Weather forecast has improved.

Model is repaired and test flown. I ran out of black Solartex so had to use blue.

[SkippyUK]

Nice touch to add name 'Dick Barton' - I hope he sees this as it will certainly make him smile.

Skippy

Edited By SkippyUK on 05/10/2013 19:19:12

Edited By SkippyUK on 05/10/2013 19:19:31

[Ben B]

Really it should be a plain bearing two stroke but in my eyes 4 strokes with their lazy power seem to suit better.

[Ian Shaw]

What a fabulous story about a KK Super 60 above.

I am about to become the proud owner of one! I have purchased it from a lovely lady whose husband sadly died a year ago. It has been converted to electric by her late husband I think a few years ago. Here she is, I am relatively new to the hobby and wonder if I can ask some advice please?

[Ian Shaw]

Sorry pressed the button too soon! Here are some close ups of the internals:

I have a Spekrum DX6I and a DX9 transmitters so I'm hoping I can figure out how to bind them to this model especially as the Rx is a Spektrum.

Not really sure was this battery is as I thought ost electric models that were 2.4 GHz would be powered by a LiPo battery but this is a NiMH but the voltage is obscured.

Not sure if some servos are missing though as these are obviously rudder and elevators but the first photo shows ailerons on the wings I think.

Any advice regarding LiPos batteries, flying characteristics anyone can offer would be greatly appreciated. I am currently flying a Hobby Zone Conscendo electric glider that is a beauty to fly and very safe with it's self righting panic button!

Cheers

Ian

[Ian McTaggart]

Hi experts; I've just followed the 'Super 60' posts with great interest.

I am a returning aero-modeller, - after nearly 60 years but I suspect / hope I'm probably in quite good company. Anyway you're not interested in that. I'm buying an original KK Super 60 part-built which hopefully will take to the air in the not too distant future. I have always thought is an elegant model but I have been wondering if it might look even nicer with the engine inverted. Has anyone ever done that?

And please excuse my ignorance, if the answer is yes will a four stroke be happy upside down? (They weren't around when I was a lad).

Thanks, Ian.

[PatMc]

Inverted engine installation was always my preference with ic models/

I built my Junior 60 with an inverted 2 stroke. IMO it looked much better with the cylinder hidden than most examples with the pot in full view. Never had any problems operating it over about 20 years regular use including some flying as float plane from a lake.
Also flew my Magnattila with an inverted OS 40 4stroke for several years without any issues.

PS you don't by any chance hail from the Dundee area do you ?

[Peter Christy]

I flew a Flair Attila with an inverted OS20 four-stroke for years. Never had any problems after I lowered the tank to be more in line with the engine.

Just be careful not to over-choke it when starting. Its quite easy to flood an inverted 4-stroke, and the combination of an electric start and a hydraulic lock can be expensive!

--

Pete

[Ian McTaggart]

Pat Mc and Peter Christy,

Thank you for responding to my post: and thank you very much for your advice.

I'm going to plan towards a small -ish four stroke. 20 to 35? and I will definitely go for inverted.

[David Davis]

I have an inverted OS 40 in my Baron, a French trainer from the 1970s which is about the same size as a Super 60. It works well despite all of the warnings from the Cassandras in the club.

I think you'll be alright with a 30 fourstroke but with anything smaller, the model might struggle on take-off.

[Nigel R]

"I'm going to plan towards a small -ish four stroke. 20 to 35? and I will definitely go for inverted"

Many moons ago I had a Junior 60 with an HP VT25 four stroke, which had approximately no power whatsoever. It seemed to manage perfectly well.

On that basis, I would have thought an SC30 would be plenty OK.

[Fun Flyer]

My Super60s have flown quite happily on a 48 FS.

[Shaun Walsh]

In the mid 1970s someone in my old club (Thurrock Model Flying Club) decided it would be a good idea to put a Fox .60 2 stroke into a Super 60, it went very well until he tried a fast diving low pass at which point the lift generated by the front of the wing exceed the ability of the rubber bands to hold it down. The front of the wing lifted and it did a very tight loop into the ground.

But the prize for exceeding the power requirements of an airframe goes to a friend of mine who put a .60 into a suitably beefed up Kielkraft outlaw with the nicads in the tail to balance it out. It had to be hand launched on half throttle otherwise the motor torque produced violent oscillations in the roll axis.

[Ian McTaggart]

Thanks to you all for the advice on inverted and motor sizes for the S60. I've now bought an Enya 35 model 5224, which looks similar to the motor on the 1960's Keil-Kraft plan. And I got an unused Enya 41-4C. As it's not been used do I need to 'run it in'? If so, what is the best way? I'm not completely clueless but I pre-date model four-strokes! Perhaps I'll use the 35 while I'm learning and then switch to the four stroke. The other big gap in my knowledge is covering materials. Back in the day I would have used nylon or silk especially on the wings. I would appreciate wise words on what is considered a strong covering now. If nylon is still available somewhere that might be the way to go, as it would be absolutely contemporary for the model.

[David Davis]

Silk is available from Sussex Model Centre among other suppliers. **LINK**

Nylon is also available but you may have to phone around a bit to find it.Others have used polyester dress lining material.

Over the last twenty or thirty years most of us have gone over to iron-on fabrics like Solartex which is available in a wide range of colours including Vintage Red, Vintage, Blue, Vintage Yellow and Vintage Orange which are semi translucent and supposed to look like silk. Iron-on coverings are popular because there is no smell as associated with dope. However, the company which makes Solartex has recently stopped trading but you can still buy the product while stocks last: **LINK** This is my Super 60 finished in Solartex Vintage Red with Solartex Black and Solartex White trim.

There is a German product called Oratex which is similar to Solartex. I've never used it but it has a good reputation.

Either of your Enyas will power the Super 60 adequately and you won't wear one out!

Can you please remind me Ian whether the Super 60 uses 1/16" or 3/32" wing ribs. I have a special project in mind which will use the Super 60 wing planform!

Edited By David Davis on 24/04/2018 04:22:35

[Dave Cunnington]

3/32 wing ribs I believe....however I cannot see anything to confirm that on the plans

DC