tale of woe

[ken anderson.]

thursday at our club site....nice day..warm,sunny and hardly any wind.....one of members using a waist high model stand.....starting a '35' 2 stroke..bent down to pick up his TX......it either fell forward or his lost hold of it.....full throttle-the model hit his right forearm and ripped it all open.......result he lost a pint of blood according to the A/E dept......stitches inside and out+ an X ray....me covered in blood as we tried to bandage him up--while we waited for an ambulance........he was in hospital until 21.00....take care everyone.....

ken anderson ne..1 ....... accident dept..

[Alan Cantwell]

think what would have happened if he had been on his own, never happen will it?? hope he heals up ok, and kudos to you guys for getting in there and sorting him out, could not have been pleasant for you and your club mates

[ken anderson.]

alan-your right-we often talk about the fact that its not recommended to fly alone---even more so with the larger stuff..as has been pointed out-you will prob sever on of your limbs off-pass out and never wake up-as a 6mm cut in one of your arteries will drain your body within 10-15 mins... horrible to imagine but a part of the hobby we take part in...when we finished the first aid bit --i looked like a mass murderer(hands covered in the red stuff)

if said lad had been on his own the other day-he would have been done for......

ken anderson ne..1 accident dept....

[Jimbo565]

Ken

PM sent

[NigelH]

We've got a small number of proper tables at our site. Handy for the less supple guys and good to work at without having to get on the floor. What they really should have been fitted with though are a couple of padded verticals at the front two corners to restrain the wings.

At least people know that models still need holding down with the tables as they are though. Your associate obviously thought that he'd got it covered with his stand. Time to put it next to the brazier.

[Bob Cotsford]

Good job there Ken, the lad owes you more than a cuppa by the sound of it.

Was the model restrained on the starting table? I'm never sure what to make of some that are used at our club as there are all manner of Workmate and similar adaptations, some look barely capable of restraining the model when the engine is run up.

Much as I may dislike it, this is why our club has a rule banning lone flying for good reasons. It's a pain at times, but not as much of a pain as trying to hold your fingers on while dialling 999.

[ken anderson.]

the starting table's i've seen over the years look like home cobbled up jobs or adaptions of commercial one's..the trouble is a motor at full belt-is going to give its best shot at taking the table with it...and as they are normally top heavy--they go with the model......

ken anderson ne..1 .... accident dept...

[Chris Bott - Moderator]

Wow! well done Ken! Sounds like quite an incident you got him through. Respect to you guys for getting stuck in. Keep us posted on how your member is doing would you?

I can just imagine this same scenario hapenning with a similar sized electric model too. More and more I'm tending to arm models at the flightline rather than in the pits so that I'm not carrying a live model and a transmitter anywhere. Although I don't use I/C (much) or model stands, I think this report will still prompt yet another review of how I do things, it never hurts to keep checking if safety could be improved.

[PatMc]

Ken, I phoned John after I spoke to you on Friday. Good news is that his finger movements etc are OK so there's no ligament or tendon damage.

By coincidence I've been a bit concerned about connecting the drive battery then carrying an electric model out to the strip with the Tx dangling from my neck strap. There's a danger of accidentaly knocking the throttle stick open. Spurred on by John's accident I spent a bit of time yesterday playing with the mixers on my MPX & Futaba Txs so that the throttle stick can be disabled with a switch until ready to launch. It shouldn't be dificult to use similar mixes in other makes of Tx & they would applicable to ic as well as electric models.

Edited By PatMc on 05/08/2012 11:19:06

[fly boy3]

I really like that safety mod. PatMac. Any details to share with another Futaba user ? Cheers

[fly boy3]

May be the wrong time to bring this up, due to the above bad accident, but I wonder if we can have a poll on how many clubs actually ban lone fliers. Sorry if this has already been done. Cheers FB3

Edited By fly boy3 on 05/08/2012 11:46:09

[PatMc]

FB, bear in mind that so far I've only tried it on the bench using spare memory in both Txs.

Using a Futaba FF9 I plugged the throttle servo into Rx channel 6. This is controled by a rotary knob on the Tx. The mix was channel 3 as master & 6 as slave with 100% (or -100%) mix wth 0 offset, I selected switch "E" to switch the mix & or off.

This means that when switch "E" is off the throttle is controled by ch 6 rotary knob & the stick is ineffective. Turning the knob to full off posn & E off means there's no chance of accidental power up by knocking the stick.

As I've been typing this it occured to me that using ATV on channel 6 it would be possible to limit the amount of movement that the rotary knob controls but I'm not sure if this will also limit the stick's control

[Chris Bott - Moderator]

PatMc I have done this (switch to disable throttle) on my DX8 and it must be a safety improvement, but it can still get knocked so still beware.

I have put mine on a switch on the top right where I have never asigned a flying switch. I also made it such that if I put the tx down on it's back on an uneven surface and the switch got knocked, it would be pushed into the safe position.

I still prefer arming at the flight line, and aranging my arming plug so that it is easy to access, away from the prop but still allows me to restrain the model. Also I won't use a kneck strap because when I did, I let the Tx swing and the throttle stick did get moved...

Back to the thread - good news that the chaps fingers are all moving OK

Edited By Chris Bott - Moderator on 05/08/2012 12:28:24

[Craig Carr]

Firstly well done to ken and the lads for sorting John out and the good news hes going to be ok

I would be interested like fb3 on some feedback on how other clubs deal with lone flyers, do they allow it or not?

Like has been said had the member been there on his own the possible consequences don't bear thinking about and I wonder if clubs therefore have a duty of care to not allow flying unless more than one member or your accompanied by a buddy.

Do any of your clubs ban solo flying?

Craig

[Martin Harris - Moderator]

This was the (similar) idea I came up with for our club magazine a couple of years ago (sorry no time to upload the photos) if it's any help:

A Simple Safety Mix For Electric Flight

As we all know, electric flight offers clean, quiet (if in the opinion of some, a little soul-less) flight. However, there is one significant difference in that it can lurk silently, awaiting a careless moment, knocked throttle stick etc. and potentially mangle any object in the propeller's path – including, of course, any body part within range...

With this in mind, I have worked out a simple method with which to program a safety switch onto my Futaba programmable transmitters for my electric models. Most of us adopt a neutral configuration for the switches and I leave all my switches forward by default, so I have set a switch which I pull back to allow the throttle to function. Therefore, I can switch on and let the speed controller arm but the propeller won't turn until I operate the chosen switch.

Basically, you just need to create a switchable throttle to throttle mix of -100% and offset to zero to neutralise any throttle input.

Not having any experience, I can't advise any specifics on the popular Spektrum systems but hopefully they will be capable of similar functions and perhaps one of their expert users will be able to add some advice?

I know some of you are a little intimidated by “advanced” programming so I've knocked up a step by step guide... specific to the FF9 but most Futaba sets will be very similar – hopefully reference to the manual will clarify things on other sets but I'll help where I can if anyone brings me their transmitter at the field.

1. Enter programming mode and select advanced mode:

2. Select a free programmable mix (use the rotary dial for most selections and move down the menus with the cursor keys):

2. Set as shown:

Use the select (up) (cursor) key until you see the screen as below and set:

Mix “OFF or ON” (depends on the selected switch position i.e. not INHibited)

MAS(ter channel) THRO(ttle)

SL(a)V(e channel) THRO(ttle)

SW(itch - choose whichever switch you prefer to use)

POSI(tion – choose your normal “neutral” position as we want the mix to be active – in this case it is a 3 position switch and I only want the throttle to be active when switched fully backwards i.e. down – a 2 position switch would just show “Up”)

4. Use the cursor to continue down from the bottom of the screen....

and you'll see the next screen:

Set the RATE to -100 with the throttle stick at the bottom, move it to the top and do the same with the throttle set to fully open (selected item will move to the “up arrow&rdquo. OFFSET will normally be at 50 % so you will need to highlight it and move the throttle stick to closed, then press the rotary dial down until it changes to 0%

4. Now come out of programming mode and test carefully – with any luck you'll now have an added margin of safety which you can use while fixing hatches, carrying the model out to the flight line etc. It isn't totally foolproof – e.g. you might have left the switch operated from the last flight - so remain cautious at all times and treat it as live but it might just save a trip to casualty so I think it's a worthwhile exercise.

[Broken Prop]

I have a mix on my MPX which immobilises the left stick (I fly mode 2) by using one of the switches. (In my case switch J, which I can hold down as I carry the model out to the flightline as an extra precaution).

If anyone is interested I will post it (it is a bit complicated).

Pete

[Ian Jones]

Well done Ken & Co.

I've often considered using a starting table, it would help me a great deal but the dangers have always made go for staying on the ground instead.

Hitec transmitters have a throttle lock button.

[David Ashby - Moderator]

Hope he's mended and flying again soon Ken

[Reno Racer]

Really sad to here about the accident, a good job someone was around to provide first aid and get the ambulance in quick.

Regarding starting benches, these can be lethal if not correctly built/designed and used. Below is the one's we built in my old club in the US, pictures with my Revolver 70, to give you an idea of size. The carpet covered uprights will support any size plane and it will not move, even with a 180 FS or 55cc petrol been run at full throttle.

I have the plans and wood list required to build. If any one wants copies, just PM me. IMHO, these benches are the safest way of starting and checking planes prior to moving them off to the taxiway.

Chris

[fly boy3]

PatMac, thanks for the info, I'll give it a go . Cheers FB3

[fly boy3]

Hi Christian, exellent restraint table. I can also see there is more than one available too. Would there be any danger of the tail trying to raise itself at full throttle, and causing a potential problem.? Cheers

[ken anderson.]

since changing to 2.4ghz (hitec A9)...must say i'm impressed with the touch screen throttle lock..ideal for ic and the electric...... as mentioned the lad concered is on the mend - but with a fair old dent in his armour.....i'll get a photo for all to see.....

ken anderson ne..1 ....accident dept.

[PatMc]

Posted by fly boy3 on 05/08/2012 14:43:48:

PatMac, thanks for the info, I'll give it a go . Cheers FB3

FB, I think the method Martin Harris posted is better. It still uses ch3 for throttle servo/esc so there's no need for a 5+ channel Rx as there would be the way I envisaged.

Martin, that's a much neater solution than mine. I've changed the mix to switch G (because it's 2 posn & E is 3 posn) then I've added the "Th-cut" to the same switch with 0 offset value. The mix is on with the switch G up & Th-cut on with it down. This means that there will be an audible warning if the Tx is switched on when the throttle stick is active.

I like the idea of the throttle lock on Ken's new Tx but not all of us can afford to splash out on new gear as often as he does.

 

Edited By PatMc on 05/08/2012 17:34:24

[PatMc]

Posted by Craig Carr on 05/08/2012 12:28:46:

Firstly well done to ken and the lads for sorting John out and the good news hes going to be ok

I would be interested like fb3 on some feedback on how other clubs deal with lone flyers, do they allow it or not?

Like has been said had the member been there on his own the possible consequences don't bear thinking about and I wonder if clubs therefore have a duty of care to not allow flying unless more than one member or your accompanied by a buddy.

Do any of your clubs ban solo flying?

Craig

Craig, I think any club with such a rule would be more liable if someone ignored it & subsequently had an accident. The club might be asked what precautions they took to enforce a rule that had been thought neccesary to ensure safe use of their flying site by the membership.

[Reno Racer]

FB3 no issues on the tail swinging up. The bench has retraints along the bench top at the rear to stop any sideways movement. When going up to full throttle to check rpm etc, it requires either a hold on the rear of the airframe, or some elevator on the TX to stop some tail dragers from prop strikes - but this is the same with any restraint. At least you can do all this confortably from the rear and don't have to worry about the plane going anywhere.

You will note there are 2 types of bench in the photo, the one with the flight box 'shelf' at the front is the older type; we had a mix of both, 8 new and 5 older ones.

Chris