John Hickson Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 Chaps, I need guidance..... I bought the Escale Seafire, which is OK but looks far too clean and shiny. I want to tone the gloss down, add some panel lines and get it weathered I see (from countless hours reading on the web) that most people add panel lines by masking when painting, thid doesnt seem to be a route I can take as its already covered and the wings arent fully sheeted - I'm assuming the paint would come off here due to the flex of the covering? So I'm working on the assumption that inking on the lines using a permenant marker is my only option. Trouble is this rubs off due to the shiny finish. I experimented with a scrap of oracover and found that if I scotchbrite it the marker becomes pretty permenant. I this something that is done? Whats the best way to achieve that used look on what I have, or am I wasting my time. Your advice would be gratefully recieved. Edited By John Hickson on 13/08/2012 11:05:32 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Hargreaves - Moderator Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 Hi John...I'm not a scale expert but I believe that films can gererally be flattened with Scotchbrite so they will accept pain & other finishes so I think you are on the right lines (ouch...terrible pun there...). Solarfilm also so a product called Prymol which is supposed to "etch" the film to allow different finishes to adhere...this might be worth a try too.... Maybe the RCM&E Scale guru Danny Fenton should cover this in one of his columns.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Fenton Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 My ears were gently glowing...... Hi John, I did something similar to a Seagull Sea Fury a few years back, in fact there were three of us that did the deed. Chris Bott, Shaun Chant, and myself. The process involved green scothbrite pads and you scour (very gently) the entire model. This keys it well enough for the paint (in this case Warbird Colours) to adhere extremely well. The sea grey models were sprayed, Shaun's more colorful version was again Warbird colours, but brushed. In this instance that was all we did, however I saw Ian redshaw use a technique on Richard Scarbrough's P-47 that involved masking the leading edge of the panels and rubbing graphite powder from leading edge backwards, to invent some lines by shading. The entire model was then fuel proofed with a matt fuel proofer. I believe he used Flair Spektrum. Hope this helps Cheers Danny 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuey Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 I have used some Halfords aerosol enamel and Spektrum enamel on Oracover, and it seems to stick very well. I used a pad or a fine wet and dry to carefully take the shine off, then cleaned with isoproypl alcohol before painting. I guess you could key the film, then add panel lines and a coat of fuelproofer to seal. I would say try not to add too much paint etc to unsheeted areas, incase the film flexing cracks it. I read one of the Tony Nijhuis articles that said Prymol wont work on polyester films like Oracover, hence the need to key first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Hickson Posted August 13, 2012 Author Share Posted August 13, 2012 Hey thanks guys, I'm glad I was on the kinda right track. That powder technique sounds interesting Gary, I will try and fond somethin on the web about it.I was just reading your TN Spit build thread (should be working mind you!) so sorry to see it end how it did. Repainting it seems pointless unless in doing so I can also do the panel lines as it would be the same colour scheme. Would anyone recommend scotchbrite as a way of dulling the sheen of film as a final finish so to speak? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuey Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 I think I read somewhere that very fine grade wire wool (000?) can be used. Rather than use it in a circular motion, rub along the line of airflow. I have not tried this myself btw! I think a scotchpad might be too harsh if you are not covering afterwards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Hickson Posted August 13, 2012 Author Share Posted August 13, 2012 Cheers Stuey I will give that a try later too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Fenton Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 Must have missed a post from Gary...... The powder is just graphite, sand the end of a pencil if you cannot get it in a more consistent powder form. Ian Redshaw did a blog over on RCMF about how he did it, but he went straight over silver film so you would have to combine what I did on the Fury with Ians work on the Jug Cheers Danny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ton van Munsteren Posted August 13, 2012 Share Posted August 13, 2012 John, Here some pics of a Mig 3 from VQ models which I weathered for a friend. Nothing was done to the Oracover , the lines were done with a thin permanent marker pen and the weathering was done with black an alu house paint a little thinned and applied with a cut hard brush and kitchen paper. With a brush for the exhaust was difficult because the paint did stay on the brush and wouldn't stick on the Oracover. Must admit that it was fun having a go on Oracover and letting an Arf model come to live or sort of. Have fun weathering your model. Ton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Tarling Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 Some of you may not realise that there are several grades of 'Scotchbrite' available - I used the brown and the grey to get a nice 'soft' finish on the aluminium cowl of my Sopwith Pup and I'm sure they'd be better for flatting down the surface of covering film. Better than wire wool IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete taylor Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I've had good results just by wiping over with ipa (that's isopropyl alcohol, not pale ale!!) then brushing or spraying acrylics directly onto the film as required. Edited By pete taylor on 22/08/2012 22:46:04 Edited By Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator on 22/08/2012 23:29:51 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete taylor Posted August 23, 2012 Share Posted August 23, 2012 Here's a better one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wesley Rowe Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Hey guys I have a Top Flite P51 Mustang 60 size covered with Monokote. I am adding panel lines, weathering etc but am running a petrol engine so need to seal it all in. Will Flair Matt clear spray do the job here? I would use Top Flite Lustrecoat but it is impossible to find here and due to it being classed as dangerous goods, cant be sent via airmail.... Thanks Wes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Harris - Moderator Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Why do so many people do their panel lines in black? I don't recall ever finding this method convincing in the least and on balance, find that an untouched finish gives a better impression of realism. Wouldn't it be better to use a darker shade of the base colour and maybe a very sparing dry wipe of aluminium colour and/or chromate primer colour in the lines to simulate edge chipping? Another technique which might work on an ARTF (just thinking out loud - I haven't seen it recommended or tried it) could be to very carefully (so as not to weaken the structure underneath) score the panel lines in the covering with a relatively blunt instrument and then use the dry wipe method to highlight them. Whichever way you go, beware of overdoing the effect, which I feel detracts from the overall result. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wesley Rowe Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 To be honest, I quite like the black panel lines as it simulates the dirt / oil which gets trapped in the panels. Each to their own though, and it doesnt work on all planes... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Harris - Moderator Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Wesley, Although I appreciate the reasoning and I've tried it myself on a number of occasions, it always looks to me like drawn on ruled lines where the panel lines should be... I think we tend to make the lines too regular and dark to represent what are actually shadowed (and I agree, often dirty) areas on an aircraft but the point I'm trying to make is that dirt is rarely jet black and possibly better represented than by a sharp-edged black line. Panel lines need to be subtle to work (in my personal opinion) and aren't usually very visible in service e.g see this full size photo - with the obvious exception of the painted on demarcation lines of course. Edited By Martin Harris on 19/11/2012 13:11:42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 I really don't like the overstated black lines on many ARTFs etc, look at real dirt and it's usualy somewhere between grey and brown. I'd be tempted to try a fineline marker in dark grey or brown depending on the base colours to give the impression of panel lines, with Ian Redshaw graphite powder shading enhancement. To me, less is more when it comes to dirtying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wesley Rowe Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 I do see your point. My model is a TF Mustang and has the dark olive drab on top. The black doesnt look bad on this colour but it will be overpronounced on the silver underside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wesley Rowe Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Anyway, back to my question, any ideas for a clear coat to seal the weathering? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Cotsford Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Flair Satin spray looks good to my eyes, but it's not glow fuel proof, at least not with 5% nitro. If proofing is needed then I'd give it a LIGHT coat of Flair Gloss Clear then a coat of the satin or matt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wesley Rowe Posted November 19, 2012 Share Posted November 19, 2012 Thanks Bob. Using petrol in my Mustang so no nitro near it! Obviously if raw fuel is spilt it will cause an issue so will need to watch this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Johnson 4 Posted May 11, 2020 Share Posted May 11, 2020 I like black drawn on panel lines... Top and bottom.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark travers Posted December 6, 2020 Share Posted December 6, 2020 I read this and was wondering if any updates on a method? I am hoping to add sunken rivet heads as well as lines onto an oracover’d model. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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