What's the main radio brand you fly?

[Simon Webb]

Well Shaunie that isn't my experience of owning a Volkswagen mate. I have had 3 and all 3 have been superb.

This latest one is a 54 plate TDi Passat......and the gearbox is still tight...the clutch original.....the steering is smooth......and it doesn't use any oil with 140,000 miles on the clock. So glad I bought it new.

I have had a Ford......and it was not a nice experience for me.

Of course I can only comment on my OWN experiences.

[Cuban8]

Have had an 08 Mondeo Tdi estate from new, 110,000 miles so far, all original except for pads and tyres, 55mpg if you drive legally on the motorway..................a friend's new BMW suffered a suspension collapse shortly after he had it, even they get it wrong sometimes but their marketing is very persuasive!

[G-YRUS]

I have a Transit and JR so reckon I'm from another planet.

[Trevor Crook]

Shaunie, your VW perception is backed up by the Warranty Direct reliability index - Mondeo is 65th, Passat is 157th. But Simon, I agree that you should also use your own experience as a guide. Back to the radios, I use Spektrum because when I switched to 2.4 even the entry level Futabas used expensive FASST receivers. I'm pleased with my choice because I now have a DX8, and an old DX7, with various DSM2 and DSMX receivers, and everything works in any combination. If I had gone the Futaba route I would have had to negotiate the whole FASST/FHSS nightmare, which is where Futaba lost the plot. Shame, because I was a happy user on 35, and their current trannies look really nice.

[Erfolg]

OMG

When I mentioned VAG and Volkswagen it was not to compare cars. I am not a VAG fan, although my daughter and son-in-law have a VW (golf) and a Ford (S max), in the recent past she had a Honda FRV. It seems a lot depends on who drives it, one of them can wreck anything, as they all have had issues. This person is excellent as a product tester, as a Rover owned, scarcely ever ran reliably above a day, when a student and unable to afford anything else.

The point I was trying to make, is that if Futaba, had settled on for example on one chip set etc. Rather than a multitude of systems, they could have got their costs down. The benefits to us the customer could be better focussed R&D, product design, potentially reduced purchase price, a coherent product range.

The lack of coherency of just Rxs is unbelievable, in that one Rx model will not work with all Txs in the Fasst range. Then the product range is mind boggling, with incompatibilities abounding.

I am a Futaba user and have been very disappointed.

Something very interesting happened at the club site recently. As a result of this pole, various sets were being verbally discussed. With most claims revolving around the ergonomics, particularly feel. It was apparent when a physical examination was made of JR, Futaba, Spektrum and Hitec (the Tx I was using), that same feature desirable feature was found on all of them, although many thought that there manufacturer was the only one to consider the grip/shape. In most other respects the differences were about switches, that were not consistent with a manufacturer and then the bits of shiny things.

If i ever a company needs a kick up the jacksy, with heads rolling Futaba must be in there.

Edited By Erfolg on 11/05/2014 16:03:54

[Shaunie]

I can't believe Futaba with their changing transmission protocol, so the first system they came out with was apparently expensive to produce, so sell it cheap make loads more and the price comes down. To come out with a cheaper protocol means they make less of each and the price stays higher for both. Or were they trying to be elitist to one group of customers and budget with another. and to not make them compatible is quite simply shooting themselves in the foot. They are just throwing market share to spektrum in my book.

Simon W, The Passat is renowned for flooding the passenger floor and destroying the comfort computer under the carpet. The best advice I can give you is remove the rubber grommet from under the battery tray and throw it away, if it's not already been done that is, preferably before the next heavy rainfall.

Shaunie.

[Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator]

Can I just remind you all that this thread is not about cars. Can we drop the car analogy now please as its moving the thread seriously off topic.

Thanks

BEB

[Cuban8]

Taranis is an interesting development, but having done some research I can't honestly see it making a serious impact on the main R/C brands. I'm not criticizing it at all, because if you like playing with the programming and dealing with the inevitable problems that always crop up with software, then that's great. I'm a retired electronics engineer and although I could work with Taranis, I wouldn't choose to, as for me a radio's prime purpose is to enable me to fly my models and not spent hours working on its programming. I'm happy for the manufacturers to sort out the bugs these days

[Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator]

Its interesting that this impression seems to be prevalent that Taranis involves hours of programming. Its simply not the case. We have a letter in the mag this month expressing the same view. The funny thing is in my experience its utterly wrong!

Taranis main benefit in my view is its incredible flexibility. Now yes - you could use that flexibility to become very involved in doing all sorts of weird and wonderful things with it - and few of our more "geeky" colleagues will do exactly that. But actually that's not the way I think most people are using it. Instead, they are using the flexibility to do the sort of things they did before - but Taranis flexibility makes those things a lot easier and lot faster than on many mainstream Tx's - if they could do them at all!

Its simply not an accurate picture to see Taranis users as people who spend hours programming - not flying! I'm a Taranis user and I fly at least three times every week and I bet that's a lot more than many!

Where Taranis does come into it own is when you want to do something that is ever so slightly different - easy on a Taranis. These days I sit and smile as clubmates tell me about their latest incredibly devious mix that allows them to do something which should be easy and that I could do with Taranis in 5 minutes and half a dozen key presses. So ask yourself, who do you think is spending all their time programming and not flying - it ain't the likes of me!

Now what is true is that initially it will take you longer - because its different. But once you have got used to the different approach I would bet most people who have used it would tell you that its faster and more intuitive than any other Tx they have used.

So, I'd ask people not to pre-judge this. Talk to some actual Taranis users and ask them how easy and fast it is to program. Don't just accept the stereotype, because the reality is very different.

BEB

[John F]

This bit interest me Cuban, where you say "I can't honestly see it making a serious impact on the main R/C brands."

If you look at the poll above you will clearly see that Taranis already has 5% of the vote and that is from folk on this forum. If you look at forum posts you'll see people telling the forumites where they have stock. 24 hours later they don't have any!

I think that speak volumes about the impact that Taranis has on the hobby and it can only continue to do so as folk are persuaded, especially with myth busting comments from users such as BEB above, to go for a system that is not only cheaper than others, by a huge margin, but has more functionality, should you want it.

Edited By John F on 12/05/2014 12:45:54

[Ed Anderson]

HOURS OF PROGRAMMING FOR .... RADIO?

 

Well, isn't that true of many people on their first attempt to set up any radio on a complex model? Until you have that "moment of revelation" with your new radio there is often fumbling and discovery involved. Then, "you get it" and it all falls into place.

So, might it take hours to set up that first 7 channel full house electric glider with 4 flight modes using your new Taranus, DX9, SD10G, 14SG? Maybe. The second one will probably take 20 minutes and the third 10 minutes.

Nothing new there.

But if you can download a profile that matches your plane/heli/glider then the process can be trivial. More and more radios allow this profile download process.

So, if you know nothing about what you bought then, yes, your new DX18 could take you hours to set up your 16 servo giant scale as your first plane on that radio. Your second will take 30 minutes and the third .... 10.

So, what's new?

 

But even if it took 2 hours to set up your first 4 channel sport plane, the second should be quick as you should now know the process, the menus, the quirks that you didn't know on the first one.

Edited By Ed Anderson on 12/05/2014 14:44:47

Edited By Ed Anderson on 12/05/2014 14:46:12

[Erfolg]

John

You have to be right, the Taranis has arrived, to the extent they are on paper competing with Hitec and are ahead of Graupner, Jeti, MPX. If sales were being measured over a short period such as 6 months, they are probably competing with Futaba, in addition to the rest.

What will be really telling is where Frsky is in 12 months time. I suspect that by then, the Taranis will be yesterdays model with respect the Frsky range of products. Not because there is anything wrong with the Taranis, more that the world moves so fast at the moment. The question will be have they made further inroads to market share?

What I need is a crystal ball. I for one did not foresee the 2.4 revolution. Yet as many other modellers, two things really made me stop and think, one, frequency clashes being a thing of the past seemed good. The other was the suggested resistance to glitches, which has never been a problem for me, in reality. Once I experienced the freedom of just switching on, this was the game changer, the other issues just a benefit. I think this drove the 2.4 revolution, that propelled Spektrum to the fore.

So where will they go in the future, is it Telemetry? Apparently the Taranis has the feature built into the system. As a electric modeller, now power, knowing the power left in the Lipo seems very useful. As a glider flyer, knowing about the sink rate seems obvious, as is a down load of flights. Will this be a game changer like 2.4 or just incremental developments such as synthesised frequencies, computer radios for 35.

I am suspecting that we will see better integration of Telemetry as part of the next package.

Probably they will also make available a CD or download, with templates of various set ups for lazy people like me, whilst retaining the option of the user to set up the equipment as they wish. I am thinking back to Fortran, Pascall, basic etc, where you had to write the simplest instruction, even though millions had done it before you and after you. Then the obvious solution to these basic requirements via VisBasic and most probably other current languages.

So no revolution, yet the Taranis does seem to be generating a lot of sales after the 2.4 revolution, during an apparently incremental improvement era. So they are doing something much better than many others.

I only wish I had taken more interest when a club member showed me a Taranis, I looked at it, thought, yawn, another set, so what! So I have now seen you with a MPX, a Jeti, now another boring Tx. Since then it has been a Hott, which made me smile and think, you need far more money now to compete with gliders than I have. I then thought, and a lack of skill is another attribute I have. At the time I saw another box, now i feel i missed out.

[Ed Anderson]

I fly competition sailplanes and am seeing Taranis showing up at the contest field and those flying it LOVE it! And these are mostly former JR, Airtronics and Futaba pilots.

What is just as important is how it is driving down the cost of main brand systems. Futaba now has a $49 7 channel receiver (USA) and Spektrum now has a DX6 that seems to be loaded with features.

It is the nature of the computer business that competition drives price down and capability up and these radios are following that path rapidly.

[Biggles' Elder Brother - Moderator]

Posted by Ed Anderson on 12/05/2014 14:43:09:

HOURS OF PROGRAMMING FOR .... RADIO?

Well, isn't that true of many people on their first attempt to set up any radio on a complex model? Until you have that "moment of revelation" with your new radio there is often fumbling and discovery involved. Then, "you get it" and it all falls into place.

So, might it take hours to set up that first 7 channel full house electric glider with 4 flight modes using your new Taranus, DX9, SD10G, 14SG? Maybe. The second one will probably take 20 minutes and the third 10 minutes.

Nothing new there.

But if you can download a profile that matches your plane/heli/glider then the process can be trivial. More and more radios allow this profile download process.

So, if you know nothing about what you bought then, yes, your new DX18 could take you hours to set up your 16 servo giant scale as your first plane on that radio. Your second will take 30 minutes and the third .... 10.

So, what's new?

But even if it took 2 hours to set up your first 4 channel sport plane, the second should be quick as you should now know the process, the menus, the quirks that you didn't know on the first one.

I totally agree Ed

BEB

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

I am in the wrong thread but you started it

Ed's comment on rx prices has got to be good news for everyone, not before time methinks.

John

[Erfolg]

Ed, competition does drive prices down.

There has been competition at the lower or the entry level bundles for some time. Where the products were dismissed as low cost, low quality items, lacking in features. It does seem that Frsky has moved the level of competition highter up the table, wher all the features are apparently there at attractive costs.

How will the rest respond, can they lower their selling price, or will they be willing to.

Competition does no seem to act as a spur when it is Futaba, where Fasst prices seem very high, when compared to the their competition. If it were not for the reversed engineered Rxs, I suspect that Futaba sales would be completely dead in the water, as many more would be abandoning Futaba, particularly for Frsky and the Taranis. I do wonder if Futaba can survive on Tx sales only. Not seeing the anticipated Rx sales, with knock on effects to servo sales. In many ways it seems a recipe for a downward spiral.

I just hope that the major players do not respond by suggesting that you only get what you pay for etc. We have already had the argument as to the legality of personal imports with respect to CE marks, all designed I suspect to muddy the waters, deterring some from buying other than from the UK high street retailing system, the well established brands.

I get the impression that the Taranis is being sold mainly if not completely by Internet retailers, with little of no serious high street presence. Is this also part of a revolution?

[Cuban8]

OK, I hear what you chaps say. I agree that Taranis does have wonderful flexibility if you know what you're doing, but still question whether, in its present incarnation, it'll ever be the best solution for the majority of foamy owning sport fliers who tend to go for Spektrum or Futaba (quoting one Taranis correspondent "Best £140 I've ever spent on a Tx, worth it just for the exercising of the old grey matter").

Browsing the various forums and YouTube postings would suggest that many owners are struggling with it, and I think this will make some potential customers wonder if it's really the system for them. Still, time will tell and I must confess that I wouldn't mind one going on my Christmas or birthday list!!

[Brian Hammond]

I,m the same ,Futaba and Spectrum

[Chris Bott - Moderator]

Posted by Cuban8 on 12/05/2014 18:42:32:

OK, I hear what you chaps say. I agree that Taranis does have wonderful flexibility if you know what you're doing, but still question whether, in its present incarnation, it'll ever be the best solution for the majority of foamy owning sport fliers who tend to go for Spektrum or Futaba (quoting one Taranis correspondent "Best £140 I've ever spent on a Tx, worth it just for the exercising of the old grey matter").

Right now I'd tend to agree Cuban8. The sport flier that has no frustration with what he's using right now has no reason whatsoever to change.

You may have noticed that I'm sold, hook line and sinker down the Taranis route.
I'm actually finding it easier to just do what I want to do, and do more flying.
Add to that the lower prices for everything, and the telemetry that has the sensors I want (unlike the major players) and it's a no brainer for me.

I'm also very interested to see huge further development going on, I hope and believe that setting up a model on it will become even easier. The software guys certainly aren't dragging their feet.

[vice sabba]

Sorry , I' m really dissapoint that you have put SANWA - AIRTRONICS as older set ... we are Leader in the surface radio rc and we are the winner of WC in glider ....

Plese could you see a WC result before to denigrate a company leader in Europe marker.

Dr. Vincenzo Sabbadin

Venezia Italy

[ROY DAVIES 1]

Did the 27 single, reed and prop' and 35m meg route then changed over to a DX6 then an DX8 and a retirement present of a 18 month old DX18 is where I am now. I now posses no other radios ( I had Hitec JR Futaba) as they were 'hanging about ' and not being used so I turned them into money before the @bubble@ burst

I would like a DX9 as the spoken prompts will help an old codger like me. So a part ex may be waiting any takers.

Roy

[William Morrison]

I used to use Futaba, then tried Spectrum. Had a terrible experience with early Spectrum and their changes and not working system. When to Hitec Aurora and never looked back. What a great tranny!

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]

[David Ashby - Moderator]

Posted by vice ita 7515 on 14/05/2014 15:44:26:

Sorry , I' m really dissapoint that you have put SANWA - AIRTRONICS as older set ... we are Leader in the surface radio rc and we are the winner of WC in glider ....

Plese could you see a WC result before to denigrate a company leader in Europe marker.

Dr. Vincenzo Sabbadin

Venezia Italy

 

Be calm, nothing detrimental intended and the reference has been removed.

Perhaps you'd care to expand on your last line though - 'company leader' is a bit vague after all

 

 

Edited By David Ashby - RCME on 14/05/2014 21:31:41

[tom ruut]

I used to be a Spectrum user but switched to the Futaba 18 MZ mainly due to the touch screen function which makes programming a breeze!

Tom Ruut ,Canberra,OZ