Newbie attempts Ben Buck Junior 60

[Tom Clayton]

Hello all.

I've recently bought a Ben Buckle Electric Junior 60 kit. I bought it after seeing it on Youtube ('Glorious Cocklebarrow at it's vintage best' and then because 'the man in the shop' told me I wouldn't have the skill to build it (that could of been a double bluff. If it was I fell for it) I took this as a challenge. I've never built an RC aeroplane before, and I need advice. I've already talked to Pat(mc), who has been great and Chris, both very encouraging. I'm okay at construction - but know nothing, and understand less, about electronics.

[Tom Clayton]

I need someone, or even more than one, to either confirm, or tell me otherwise, about the gear I'm considering.

1/ Brushless electric motor: Prodrive 3536 1800kv

3/ Lipo Battery:Turnigy 2200Ah 3S 35C Lipo Pack

4/ Servos: advice needed about best type to buy

5/Prop: Aerostar 12x5 (or 12x6) electric series beech wood prop

Thanks - Tom

[Don Fry]

Tom, the advice that this is not a good first build is sound. It is a lightweight, complex structure, and needs a fair bit of past experience to sucesfully complete.

And once done, there are in 2017 better primary trainers in the world.

To make matters worse, many modern experienced flyers no longer onderstand the aerodynamics of something which first flew 75 years ago, with the fitted technology of that date.

Edited By Don Fry on 29/08/2017 13:21:21

[Peter Miller]

Tom

To be quite honest, This type of construction was the norm for many young modellers back in the 50 and 60s. True, we started with smaller models but that was because a Junior 60 kit cost £3 and that was a heck of a lot of money. For a little more you could buy a good engine.

We did have some basic books and articles on building but most of the time we just followed the instructions and got on with it,

So, While it might not be the perfect choice of a first build it can be done.

As a trainer it is very different to the modern trainer and if you plan to learn at a club with buddy boxes the instructors will be horrified.

However the Junior 60 is a free flight model.This means that it can be controlled by rudder and elevator but the beauty of the model is that if you get into trouble, take your fingers off the sticks it it will go to normal straight and level flight on its own. This is assuming that it is properly built and set up with no warps.

But then, don't take any notice of me. I came up the hard way as I described above. I suspect that most people these days didn't have to.

[Peter Miller]

If you go and look at my Peggy Sue Build blog you will see a similar model under construction although a littel more complex than the Junior 60.

**LINK**

[Tom Clayton]

Thanks Don (I think) and Peter. All I can say is.....gulp....

Well the positive here is Peter's, 'it can be done!' And I'm determined to have a jolly good stab at it.

I'll post some photes of the progress thus far..... when I figure out how to do it.

Thanks Peter - Thanks Don!

[Rob Ashley]

Tom,

I have spent my life doing things people said I can't. If you take your time and seek advice when needed then you should be able to build this model. There is a huge amount of experience on this forum so there will always be someone to help - after all helping others is part of the hobby in my opinion. The model may not turn out as accurate as you would like and it will likely frustrate you, but it will be yours and that my friend is the point (well one of) of building.

There are a number of vital things to get right - such as a warp free wings, main wing & tail incidences and correct tail symmetry - but all are achievable if you take your time.

Personally I like to start with the wings as they can go together quickly and you can see the results of your labours. Others start with the tailplane and others the fuselage. It doesn't really matter. If the kit has instructions then follow them...

I would also guess as this is designed for electric power there is a recommended setup on the box?

Best of luck

Rob

[Peter Miller]

Posting photos is easy. You already have an album. All that you have to do is click on the little camera ikon which will take you to your albums. Click on the photo that you want to post and then click OK an it is done

[PatMc]

Posted by Tom Clayton on 29/08/2017 09:57:46:

I need someone, or even more than one, to either confirm, or tell me otherwise, about the gear I'm considering.

1/ Brushless electric motor: Prodrive 3536 1800kv

3/ Lipo Battery:Turnigy 2200Ah 3S 35C Lipo Pack

4/ Servos: advice needed about best type to buy

5/Prop: Aerostar 12x5 (or 12x6) electric series beech wood prop

Thanks - Tom

Hi Tom, I only have time for a quick comment - that motor isn't suitable. At 1800 kv would be running at around 16000 rpm with 3s lipo on a much smaller prop than is practical for a Jnr 60 [a 12" prop would take the current over the motor's limit]. Also I'm sceptical about the weight for this motor - a 3536 would normaly be about 80 - 90g. Something heavier would be more helpful for the cg & would be less stressed in use.

I'm using a Keda motor that weighs 150g in my Jnr but I'm sure there are several Turnigy motors equally or more suitable, I'll post some suggestions later today.

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

Motor sounds way out to me as well, yep there are better trainers about and this one wont like the wind so much, but you'll enjoy building it and learn from it. Get stuck in and build it.

[Rob Ashley]

Tom,

Here is a link to another thread from someone who built the same model with an electric setup:

http://www.modelflying.co.uk/forums/postings.asp?th=48350&p=1

Rob

[Tom Clayton]

Rob - That's great, the kind of encouragement I need! And Pat - very much looking forward to your advice!

[Andy Green]

Hi Tom

Have a look at my website where you will find loads of builds, no Junior 60's but a couple of Super 60's.

Andy

[Tom Clayton]

The work so far...

[Tom Clayton]

[Tom Clayton]

When in doubt....

[David Davis]

Tom, your building looks pretty good and I learned to fly on a Junior 60 so there's no reason why you shouldn't so carry on but be prepared to buy an ARTF trainer!

[Tom Clayton]

Thanks Dave - but I only really like the vintage aeroplanes. I'll join a club, perhaps I'll find a willing tutor.

[Mike Etheridge 1]

Tom, your building work looks fine to me so I do not see a problem with you completing the plane but just make sure you get the centre of gravity right and no twists in the wing structure. I built my junior 60 when I was 15, the kit cost just 58 shillings then. I have just finished the refurbishment of the plane which is 55 years old so with a bit of luck your plane will last the same.

We do have a Tom Clayton in the family, his grand father who is still alive at 96 flew in Bristol Beauforts during the war as a navigator but was also a trained pilot. The usual pilot in the Beaufort was named Alan Etheridge.

Edited By Mike Etheridge 1 on 29/08/2017 18:05:23

[Dave Bran]

Posted by Tom Clayton on 29/08/2017 17:00:53:

Thanks Dave - but I only really like the vintage aeroplanes. I'll join a club, perhaps I'll find a willing tutor.

Whereabouts are you and how far would your consider as a distance to go to fly?

[Peter Miller]

THat looks really good building. Told you that you could do it.

Yes, where are you?

[Tom Clayton]

Hi Dave, we're in Bridgnorth, Shropshire. We (me and my daughter) drove down to Cocklebarrow farm to see the August meet there, it was great, but it was a LONG journey! So how far - not that far! There were some wonderful aeroplanes there, but this vintage gull wing, 'The Spook', really captured my imagination The chap who owned it rescued it from a skip....amazing, and an amazing flyer.

[PatMc]

Tom, here's a choice of 6 motors from HK that I'd consider suitable :

**LINK**

**LINK**

**LINK**

**LINK**

**LINK**

**LINK**

They're all between 1000 & 800 kv & about 140 - 150g. The lower the kv the larger prop that can be used, these motors should be OK with between 11" & 13" dia props. The actual max size really needs to be determined by measuring the current taken at full throttle setting [normaly done using a Wattmeter].

Note the first 4 motors are mounted with the prop adaptor fitted directly on to the shaft the other two use an adaptor that is fitted to the motor body with the shaft protruding back into the model. The 4th & 5th being versions of the same motor.

[David Davis]

Shame | no longer live in Shropshire. I'd willingly have taught you to fly at SMFC at Montford Bridge. Nice bunch of lads.

[Dave Bran]

That's me and my Clubs out then, (Kent). Also a shame as there's a growing collection of old stuff here.

A senior member has just built a Junior 60 and a Super 60 solartex covered, and has some other stuff he built way back, another member has just gone all old timer free flight on us (dunno if he'll recover!), and a couple have the HobbyKing "Old" plane.

I have a Sundowner which is genuinely "ancient". Originally Diesel and single channel, long before my tenure it was converted to three channel with a tiny two stroke, then electric. It's blue and orange doped nylon, a bit faded and a bit patched, I was going to convert it back as I have a 30 four stroke I was given, I really should shift my posterior!!

If you fancy a faster start with less to lose effort wise for those first tries:-

**LINK**