Latest CAA Update

[Chris Berry]

Posted by Steve J on 15/10/2019 19:25:56:

"A new, free-to-use online training course for drone users is now available on the NATS website."

**LINK**

Yep it appears to aimed purely at multirota flyers. It’s not phone friendly and states that registration will be mandatory from November, which is wrong.

Its useful for little Johnny.

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]

[Bob Cotsford]

Posted by Chris Berry on 15/10/2019 19:39:39:

Posted by Steve J on 15/10/2019 19:25:56:

"A new, free-to-use online training course for drone users is now available on the NATS website."

**LINK**

Yep it appears to aimed purely at multirota flyers. It’s not phone friendly and states that registration will be mandatory from November, which is wrong.

Its useful for little Johnny.

I would have said that although the illustrations use a multirotor it states quite clearly that the term 'drone' is being used in reference to all SUA under 20kg - that means all models under 20kg. Everything I saw applies as much to the lone FW flyer as to MR flyers. Every kit I've put together in at least the last twenty years has included safe operating flying instructions - you know, the bit we all skip over because we know how to fly model planes.

[Martin Harris - Moderator]

.

Edited By Martin Harris on 15/10/2019 21:10:09

[Chris Berry]

Posted by Bob Cotsford on 15/10/2019 20:31:20:

Posted by Chris Berry on 15/10/2019 19:39:39:

Posted by Steve J on 15/10/2019 19:25:56:

"A new, free-to-use online training course for drone users is now available on the NATS website."

**LINK**

Yep it appears to aimed purely at multirota flyers. It’s not phone friendly and states that registration will be mandatory from November, which is wrong.

Its useful for little Johnny.

I would have said that although the illustrations use a multirotor it states quite clearly that the term 'drone' is being used in reference to all SUA under 20kg - that means all models under 20kg. Everything I saw applies as much to the lone FW flyer as to MR flyers. Every kit I've put together in at least the last twenty years has included safe operating flying instructions - you know, the bit we all skip over because we know how to fly model planes.

True, but the images and animation could have included a mixture of aircraft. It focused purely on a DJI that’s my point. They could have a varied the slides to include RC FW by they didn’t.

[Bob Cotsford]

I agree Chris, maybe they just think that fixed-wing flyers are a more sensible and responsible lot? Or maybe this is focused on a possible Christmas flood of MRs gifted to tech minded teens? Who knows how the beurocratic mind works, after 66 years I still can't see their logic half the time.

[Don Fry]

I've just looked at the slides. Best you start an intensive revision program before you attempt to tackle that mental mountain. By the way, being pedantic, you are not permitted to film yourself if engaged in a private activity. The mind boggles.

[Nitro Flyer]

what about the fact we are goverened by concent in uk,why dosent all model flyers withdraw their concent on this registration nonsence. and stop rolling over and accepting all that the theiving fraudulent lieing criminals in westminster are trying to do regarding registering of toy model aeroplanes quad copters ect,lawful notices of rejection should be sent to all the relevent parties that are trying to force this abomination on model flyers,the uk is fast sliping into a police state dictatorship, and our freedoms are being taken away on a daily basis once they are gone they are gone,once anyone registers anything your car,house,childeren,toy model plane you give ownership over to that third party,you are then only the registered keeper,thats how and why goverment can come and take (steal) your property because its no longer in the private, and you no longer own it even tho you think you do thats how it works,registration is only an offer of a contract you dont have to accept the offer and can decline it,our grand parents fought two world wars for our freedoms and you lot are just rolling over and takeing it JUST LIKE THE BMFA have done nothing for modelers, where is the challenge to goverment BMFA are also just takeing it,come on uk grow a back bone,,acts and statuates are not law and only have the colour of law through are concent, read our bill of rights 1888,,i will not be registering any of my models nor doing any online tests to comply with this fraud on the people,,,

[Alan Gorham_]

If you are going to rant, then at least get your facts right. You don't register individual models, you register as an operator (ie owner) and as a pilot.

[Peter Jenkins]

Are you serious Nitro Flyer or is this a wind up?

[Martin Harris - Moderator]

I thought government by consent was to do with allowing an elected Parliament to make laws and statutes on behalf of the people.

The only Bill of Rights I'm aware of was in 1688 and limited interference on the will of Parliament by the monarch.Can you provide some information about the 1888 version?

I think you're going to be disappointed by any legal testing of your theory that you can simply ignore legislation because you don't agree with it. There is unlikely to be a massive ground swell of popular opinion in support of rebellious model flyers!

Oh, and by the way, registration as the keeper of a motor vehicle has no bearing whatsoever on legal ownership.

Edited By Martin Harris on 16/10/2019 15:29:14

[Fatscoleymo]

Posted by Nitro Flyer on 16/10/2019 14:58:16:

what about the fact we are goverened by concent in uk,why dosent all model flyers withdraw their concent on this registration nonsence. and stop rolling over and accepting all that the theiving fraudulent lieing criminals in westminster are trying to do regarding registering of toy model aeroplanes quad copters ect,lawful notices of rejection should be sent to all the relevent parties that are trying to force this abomination on model flyers,the uk is fast sliping into a police state dictatorship, and our freedoms are being taken away on a daily basis once they are gone they are gone,once anyone registers anything your car,house,childeren,toy model plane you give ownership over to that third party,you are then only the registered keeper,thats how and why goverment can come and take (steal) your property because its no longer in the private, and you no longer own it even tho you think you do thats how it works,registration is only an offer of a contract you dont have to accept the offer and can decline it,our grand parents fought two world wars for our freedoms and you lot are just rolling over and takeing it JUST LIKE THE BMFA have done nothing for modelers, where is the challenge to goverment BMFA are also just takeing it,come on uk grow a back bone,,acts and statuates are not law and only have the colour of law through are concent, read our bill of rights 1888,,i will not be registering any of my models nor doing any online tests to comply with this fraud on the people,,,

Wowser….you had a bad day?

[John Bisset]

Posted by Peter Jenkins on 16/10/2019 15:20:40:

Are you serious Nitro Flyer or is this a wind up?

Maybe has been sniffing the nitro before posting...?

[ChrisB]

Oh dear, someone certainly has had a bad day and should perhaps read up on the proposals.

[Levanter]

I was once described as having posted one of the most bizarre comments on this forum.

I no longer claim this accolade as it surely goes to Nitro Flyer and I wish you luck with that one, you will need it.

Levanter

[Pete B]

Go easy on NF, gents - he's a new poster and probably hasn't yet got the 'feel' for the way we discuss things here

Given the contentious nature of the subject, you're all to be congratulated for your restraint so far, so let's keep it that way, eh?

Pete

[john stones 1 - Moderator]

I blame the Romans, what they ever do for us eh ?

[Brian Stevenson 1]

Nitro Flyer does make one interesting point. We are "governed by consent"

With a 'majority' of MINUS 45 the government (which in the UK boils down to the PM and his cabinet) no longer has that consent. So it has no 'mandate' whatsoever. For anything. Including the bringing into effect any laws not already in effect when the government did have a majority.

On the above I am just 'thinking aloud' and maybe bringing it up as a point of discussion. But I do not intend to argue the issue.

My 'tentative' personal actions:

I may not register at all. The law will anyway be ignored by those who are merely 'careless' and even more so by those who deliberately intend to create disturbance - IE: "I intend to disrupt my local airport but I think I should register as an operator or pilot first". It's a total nonsense.

I suspect most 'drone' flyers have never heard of the BMFA. I also suspect that the majority of regular non-competitive 'model plane' flyers are not BMFA members - my house insurance covers model flying and I only joined the BMFA to avoid 'proof of insurance' hassles with sometimes over-bureaucratic club committees.

Incidentally those clubs who demand to see your operators or pilots licence before allowing you to fly will likely fall foul of the Data Protection Act as each individual club will need the direct permission of the 'Data Controller' before they can do this.

[Nigel R]

"With a 'majority' of MINUS 45 the government (which in the UK boils down to the PM and his cabinet) no longer has that consent. So it has no 'mandate' whatsoever. For anything. Including the bringing into effect any laws not already in effect when the government did have a majority."

Hmm, well, as I understand things -

You voted for a representative from your constituency. All those representatives are still MPs*. We consent to be governed by these MPs as our representatives.

Some MPs, however, for reasons not for this forum, no longer belong to the (previous) majority party. Ergo, the present cabinet cannot propose any new legislation or motion and guarantee it to be passed. It still has a mandate to govern, as we are still in the term of parliament covered by the 5 year period which follows a GE. But, that government/cabinet could be subject (and maybe quite soon) to a vote of no confidence - at which point you could expect either a coalition of other parties to form a new government, or a GE to be called.

In short, the government still has a mandate, but it is somewhat toothless, and thus needs replacing with a government that has a majority (as we are realistically expecting sometime soon).

* well, one or two excepted, hence by-elections, etc etc.

mods, apologies if this is looking a bit too much like politics

[Brian Stevenson 1]

Posted by Peter Miller on 17/10/2019 08:59:11:

Posted by Tim Kearsley on 17/10/2019 08:46:14:

That from NF is one of the longest sentences I've read for a long time! What rambling rubbish.

Tim.

I would have described it as incoherent

It might not be a work of literary genius and it is somewhat 'over the top' but there is some truth in it.

EG: "Lying criminals at Westminster" - at least the "lying" is a fact, politicians do it most of the time.

Many of us are too willing to 'roll over'. But the BMFA has stated more than once that is NOT going to 'police' this registration nonsense. But you can be sure that some clubs, even BMFA affiliated ones, will attempt to do this. Should my club try that on me I will instantly demand to see their explicit permission from the Data Protection Act's 'data controller' to check members registration. They have to have this explicit permission, individually , club by club, to see my registration. And you can be sure they won't have it.

[Former Member]

[This posting has been removed]

[Lima Hotel Foxtrot]

Posted by Peter Miller on 17/10/2019 08:59:11

I would have described it as incoherent

Posted by Tim Kearsley on 17/10/2019 08:46:14:

That from NF is one of the longest sentences I've read for a long time! What rambling rubbish.

Tim.

Well, aren't you gents the welcoming face of this forum?

For all you know Nitro Flyer may be dyslexic, new to forum posting, perhaps disabled in a way that prevents clarity of typing or a plethora of other reasons that his (admittedly rambling) post is formatted the way it is.

Congratulations on openly mocking a forumite.

[Pete B]

I'm sure NF has now got the message so time to move on, folks...

Pete

[Brian Stevenson 1]

Posted by Steve J on 17/10/2019 10:36:53:

Posted by Brian Stevenson 1 on 17/10/2019 10:30:08:

Should my club try that on me I will instantly demand to see their explicit permission from the Data Protection Act's 'data controller' to check members registration. They have to have this explicit permission, individually , club by club, to see my registration.

All a club has to do is ask to see the operator number on all your 250+g models.

Steve

Indeed. They can ask. But unless you have 'volunteered' it by painting it on the outside (as you are apparently no longer required to do) you can demand to see their explicit permission from the DPA 'Data Controller'. There can be no argument about this, the laws say they MUST have such permission to access such 'personal data' and the data protection people are extremely rigorous in chasing up those who don't have such explicit permission.

[Cuban8]

Welcome to all the new guys that have taken the trouble to post here. The clue's in the name..... a FORUM ..noun, meeting or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged. Where else is there to be found so much interchange of ideas and opinions around our great hobby? Nowhere. Don't agree with you all and I dare say some don't agree with me. At least our worries and concerns (even if some don't share any worries over what the regulators are doing) are aired - TBH I wish more would register and put their thoughts up for discussion, whether they're badly written or not.

Edited By Cuban8 on 17/10/2019 12:15:23